As Humans we have failed

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    May 29, 2009 4:16 AM GMT
    i know that this is not a huge gay issue but it does have to do with your own life. i sometimes wonder what it would be like to have a stranger just out of the blue give me a helping hand or shed some inspiration on my thoughts. A stranger that voluntarily just reaches out and ask how im doing or ask if he/she can help me in any way possible. That has never happened to me and i realized that as humans, we are awfully caught up in our own meanness and intolerance to being kind. Yes we might help a lady down the stairs or stand to give a pregnant woman the seat on the bus but in the back of out minds we only do it because we want to make right with the creator (If he exist) and that those two actions are only apart of our accepted social norms. Apart from major celebrity figures who act as Consequentialist in their own right who give out millions of dollars to which we never see how its spent, i have never seen the action of one human being paying it forward. I believe that if each and everyone of us would put out our hand to help a total stranger, this world would benefit all of us. But im a realist and i know this will never happen until its too late to actually help each other. If you have ever seen this movie you know what im talking about. Why cant art mimic reality in this aspect? Why cant we as human beings truly help each other?

    pay-it-forward-dvdcover.jpg

    AND P.S I volunteer my weekends in the village where i help feed the homeless and the ones that are fighting the battle of drug addiction..my brother died from a drug overdose because he was always a depressed individual and i have a special tolerance for individuals with drug problems. i wish you all would have ask before you made comments about me not giving back....or passing it on.
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    May 29, 2009 5:00 AM GMT
    I have a question for you Tereseus: Have you Paid It Forward?

    I am not being smart or glib. I want you to think about that. I have, often. Happiness, peace, bliss, whatever you want to call it spreads like wildfire, but the fire has to start somewhere and with someone. And if the pay it forward can turn into random acts of kindness, such as testimonials here on real jock, as an example, you and I and a bunch of other people won't even notice when they don't happen.icon_biggrin.gif
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    May 29, 2009 5:04 AM GMT


    There are a lot of volunteers out there tereseuss1; I'm one.
    There should be a bit on our profile..

    Yep, still there.



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    May 29, 2009 5:09 AM GMT
    I'm a courteous driver...does that count?

    No, I know what you mean...I guess it has to do with the fact that so many people have a "why should I when he/she doesn't?" mindset...I try to avoid that when at all possible...I like to think that if I'm kind to someone then in some weird karma-istic way someone will be kind to me.
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    May 29, 2009 5:58 AM GMT
    It happens all the time, I promise. Not every person will do it, but I bet more than you imagine do.

    Also, see Buddhism.

    Finally - be the change you want to see in the world. And maybe you already are, which is awesome, but you have to have the ugly to have the beauty, and there is plenty of both in the world and human nature.
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    May 29, 2009 5:59 AM GMT
    aannnnddd SCENE.

    But seriously.
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    May 29, 2009 6:01 AM GMT
    Oh good. I saw the title and had the instant sinking feeling that cats had finally developed opposable thumbs and were taking over. My Little White Bastard likes to bat around books of matches so it's a constant concern of mine.
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    May 29, 2009 6:02 AM GMT


    ROFL!
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    May 29, 2009 6:18 AM GMT
    funny... but yes i have paid it forward countless times but the thing is...even though i dont want the same treatment as it would defeat the purpose...i just haven't seen anyone that went out their way to make someone else happy. Any volunteering i understand but are you doing it so that you feel better about yourself or are you just doing it with hopes that it might help someone.
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    May 29, 2009 6:53 AM GMT
    I have done a lot to help people, and been severely shafted by it more than half the time, at least in the last 15 years. It's taken a long time to to get to the point where I now know I can't do it anymore. Kept thinking it was just another fluke or bad judgment call. Well either my judgment is shit or fate sent me a flukestorm.

    I hope the good I did for those who appreciated/deserved it gets paid forward, but I'm out of the business. (Before I end up like Haley Joel Osment in the movie.)

    I still do free massages and give time in other ways, like moderation a Freecycle group, and maybe I'll start doing some regular charity work for an organization at some point, but one-on-one stuff, it's just too personal to be taken advantage of in those situations.
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    May 29, 2009 6:59 AM GMT
    hmm it is called being Virtuous--living with the idea that you might not have happiness... and Noble--willing to sacrifice your own good for the good of others....can we live by such principles?
  • barriehomeboy

    Posts: 2475

    May 29, 2009 7:02 AM GMT
    Find a movie theatre that plays old films, or british films. The queen would shit herself if she knew how rude the people of the world have become. I blame the women's rights movement. Men became afraid to hold a door open for a woman. That's when all the politeness ended. Or maybe I'm wrong. What do you think?
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    May 29, 2009 7:24 AM GMT
    tereseus1 saidhmm it is called being Virtuous--living with the idea that you might not have happiness... and Noble--willing to sacrifice your own good for the good of others....can we live by such principles?


    Me? No, not any longer. Because at some point you have to question whether you're actually seeking out the pain, and if you are, you're a chronic enabler or codependent or chump, whatever. And ironically, that often means you're not even actually helping someone else, and still you're getting hurt. There's no good in any of that. Sacrifice when it does some actual good for good people and is appreciated just never made me feel as bad as so many of the other incidents did, even when it was a greater sacrifice.

    By the way, I believe people who think they are entitled to what is done for them are really unlikely to ever pay it forward.

    Now all I'm hoping for is some friends to spend time with. Lost a lot of them while trying to help.

    Geez, I hope it's only this thread where I'm so depressing. This kind of stuff generally doesn't come out except in my own journal. I guess you touched a nerve.
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    May 29, 2009 7:58 AM GMT
    I have a friend on here. I actually met him on here and we became friends then workout buddies. Handsome as hell. To look at him you would think he was a typical hot gay guy that spends more time in clubs than elsewhere.

    When I got to know him, I learned that he was much more than that. Every friday, he delivers food to the homeless. I have been going with him for some weeks now. Not the best parts of town. Not easy people to deal with. It takes a few hours. He has been doing it for years and never misses a friday when he is in town which are most fridays. Doesn't talk about it. Just does it week in and week out. I ride along when I can if I am in town. He is a class act.
  • swogdog

    Posts: 143

    May 29, 2009 7:59 AM GMT
    tereseus1 saidfunny... but yes i have paid it forward countless times but the thing is...even though i dont want the same treatment as it would defeat the purpose...i just haven't seen anyone that went out their way to make someone else happy. Any volunteering i understand but are you doing it so that you feel better about yourself or are you just doing it with hopes that it might help someone.


    So what if you benefit from helping others? Aren't you an other? Why can't you be one of the benefitees in the transaction? The positive feelings that can arise from helping others are often motivation to do it again, and that's helpful...for others...

    And, if you practice generosity and other positive states, you get better at them. That makes the lives of those who interact with you easier too.

    Sure, there may be times when we help that we get hurt, but that develops discernment for the future. And, if in the present, we feel happy as a result of helping, then who is hurt by that small increase in happiness in the world, even if it is in you who feels it?
  • Little_Spoon

    Posts: 1562

    May 29, 2009 8:28 AM GMT
    If everyone gave, we'd have nothing left.


    Edit:

    And only the truly selfish would prosper.
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    May 29, 2009 9:55 AM GMT
    DogSprinkler.jpg/
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    May 29, 2009 10:16 AM GMT




    WHARRGARBL!!!




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    May 29, 2009 11:38 AM GMT
    leave it to you two to make an actual serious thread into a farce...
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    May 29, 2009 1:43 PM GMT
    You seem to go on and on how we as humans have failed are you serious?
    What have you done have you done the things that you described or complain that we as humans are doing. I not going to go into a laundry list of the things that I do because I just do them.

    The human race is not as bleak as you think. Why don you go on a road trip and let that be your quest and you will find out just how giving we are as human beings. Yes there is a lot troubling things going on the world but there is just as much good if not more.

    I always try to see the glass as half instead of totally empty!
    icon_biggrin.gif
  • kaccioto

    Posts: 284

    May 29, 2009 1:54 PM GMT
    problem that people don't understand is that you truly CAN'T help someone else, until you help yourself...

    and people don't want to help themselves since it's too real to look at their own situation, easier to 'help' other people...

    then they see other people movin on up b/c they had the balls to help their own selves (and others along the way) so he scratches his butt and says where have i gone wrong i donate to charity a bit..then he points at the progressive man, looks at his surroundings, and then calls him selfish for looking out for number one, when many times this is healthiest for all parties...

    he resorts to doing copious amounts of blow votes blue for all the wrong reasons and waits for his handout. jobless now, he receives said bailout, but it's not as much as was preached and he continues to curse those around him who have enough guts to take care of themselves BEFORE their neighbors.
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    May 29, 2009 1:57 PM GMT
    teresues1 said, "Any volunteering i understand but are you doing it so that you feel better about yourself or are you just doing it with hopes that it might help someone."

    It's really quite simple. You do these works to lift up those around you, to make a difference, to ease the suffering of existence for another, what often happens THEN is you start to feel better about yourself, an old concept of self esteem built on a firmer foundation than vanity or ego.

    Lysander, I think you're brilliant and have felt at times, similarly..one day I saw this : It doesn't mean ALL people will react in the ways he suggests; it means that you will run across this and when you do offers a way to think about it.

    The Paradoxical Commandments
    by Dr. Kent M. Keith


    People are illogical, unreasonable, and self-centered.
    Love them anyway.

    If you do good, people will accuse you of selfish ulterior motives.
    Do good anyway.

    If you are successful, you will win false friends and true enemies.
    Succeed anyway.

    The good you do today will be forgotten tomorrow.
    Do good anyway.

    Honesty and frankness make you vulnerable.
    Be honest and frank anyway.

    The biggest men and women with the biggest ideas can be shot down by the smallest men and women with the smallest minds.
    Think big anyway.

    People favor underdogs but follow only top dogs.
    Fight for a few underdogs anyway.

    What you spend years building may be destroyed overnight.
    Build anyway.

    People really need help but may attack you if you do help them.
    Help people anyway.

    Give the world the best you have and you'll get kicked in the teeth.
    Give the world the best you have anyway.


    -Doug of meninlove
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    May 29, 2009 2:04 PM GMT
    meninlove saidteresues1 said, "Any volunteering i understand but are you doing it so that you feel better about yourself or are you just doing it with hopes that it might help someone."

    It's really quite simple. You do these works to lift up those around you, to make a difference, to ease the suffering of existence for another, what often happens THEN is you start to feel better about yourself, an old concept of self esteem built on a firmer foundation than vanity or ego.

    Lysander, I think you're brilliant and have felt at times, similarly..one day I saw this : It doesn't mean ALL people will react in the ways he suggests; it means that you will run across this and when you do offers a way to think about it.

    The Paradoxical Commandments
    by Dr. Kent M. Keith


    People are illogical, unreasonable, and self-centered.
    Love them anyway.

    If you do good, people will accuse you of selfish ulterior motives.
    Do good anyway.

    If you are successful, you will win false friends and true enemies.
    Succeed anyway.

    The good you do today will be forgotten tomorrow.
    Do good anyway.

    Honesty and frankness make you vulnerable.
    Be honest and frank anyway.

    The biggest men and women with the biggest ideas can be shot down by the smallest men and women with the smallest minds.
    Think big anyway.

    People favor underdogs but follow only top dogs.
    Fight for a few underdogs anyway.

    What you spend years building may be destroyed overnight.
    Build anyway.

    People really need help but may attack you if you do help them.
    Help people anyway.

    Give the world the best you have and you'll get kicked in the teeth.
    Give the world the best you have anyway.


    -Doug of meninlove


    Quite some truth in this. Definitely food for thought
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    May 29, 2009 5:54 PM GMT
    tereseus1 saidleave it to you two to make an actual serious thread into a farce...


    It was.

    You've never seen it happen? Really?! So that makes you the only human of worth in the face of the planet?

    It does happen. You just don't see it. If you don't see it, start doing it. Have you?

    It's so easy to spout about good things and peace and understanding and universal lovingkindness, but doing it is another matter. You just do it. Don't complain that others aren't doing it. Don't guilt others into doing the same thing. Don't bring attention to what you're doing. Don't think, even for one single moment that what you're doing somehow elevates you from the rest of humanity and make you special.

    Because that's really just another form of what you called 'consequentialist' hollywood artists donating to random charities - bragging.

    Don't demand recognition. There are plenty of people here doing volunteer work. Plenty of people in real life who do good with no expectation of anything in reward. Little things you have no chance in hell of hearing about to big things you can't avoid hearing of in the news. You don't hear about it, because they don't say anything about it. I refer you to one of the commandments Doug posted:

    The good you do today will be forgotten tomorrow.
    Do good anyway.


    Just do it.
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    May 29, 2009 6:09 PM GMT
    And this is why I leave the things I think for Sedative to say these days. He's actually still got the patience to be eloquent on RJ that I seem to have lost ages ago.

    Were it me responding, I would have simply said something like 'Tereseus, get over yourself, get your nose out of the air, get a grip, and stop judging and generalizing people you don't know.'

    Oh, wait. I did just say that. Oh, well. Back to my scornful judgmental silence, then.