Rachel Maddow: Dont ask, dont follow through?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 10, 2009 2:16 AM GMT
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/#31177018
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    Jun 10, 2009 2:42 AM GMT
    I liked her guest speaker too.

    Here is a related story. A Gay, Black, Iraqi Veteran AND victim of DADT running for office in California

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2009-06-09/best-political-resume-ever/Woods, 28, is currently running in a crowded Democratic field to replace Rep. Ellen Tauscher in California's 10th district, which includes parts of Sacramento and San Francisco's East Bay area. (Tauscher is leaving Congress to serve in Obama’s State Department; there’s no date yet for the special election.) Though he was briefly an aide to Gov. David Paterson in New York, Woods is the political unknown in the field, which includes California Lt. Gov. John Garamendi, State Sen. Mark DeSaulnier, and Assemblywoman Joan Buchanan.

    All that is likely to change soon, as Woods’ resume seems perfectly tuned to attract national attention. One of his top issues is repealing the military’s “Don't Ask, Don't Tell” policy, an issue that seems to be gathering steam as liberals try to hold President Obama to his campaign pledge. Woods has already received an endorsement from Dan Choi, a fellow West Point graduate whose recent discharge for being gay made him a rallying point for activists, and popular blogger Andrew Sullivan recently took note of his campaign as well.

    For Woods, the issue is deeply personal. He was forced to leave a promising Army career after he came out in 2008. He received an honorable discharge under the DADT rules.
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    Jun 10, 2009 4:43 AM GMT
    I've been saying this for a couple months now... Obama is a little bitch when it comes to GLBT rights.
  • Sayrnas

    Posts: 847

    Jun 10, 2009 5:07 AM GMT
    KyleAD saidI've been saying this for a couple months now... Obama is a little bitch when it comes to GLBT rights.


    I personally want to think that he is trying to deal with one major issue at time but your right that he isn't doing all that he can.
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    Jun 10, 2009 5:12 AM GMT
    Problems dont come in single file lines... he's the goddamn president, he can multitask.
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    Jun 10, 2009 5:47 AM GMT
    Sayrnas said
    KyleAD saidI've been saying this for a couple months now... Obama is a little bitch when it comes to GLBT rights.


    I personally want to think that he is trying to deal with one major issue at time but your right that he isn't doing all that he can.



    Doing all that he can? Did you seriously just say that?

    Is everyone blind? He's not for gay marraige, and and we won't see him retracting DADT. I guarantee it.
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    Jun 10, 2009 9:38 AM GMT
    KyleAD saidProblems dont come in single file lines... he's the goddamn president, he can multitask.


    Obama is the one that chastised McCain during the campaign when McCain wanted to postpone a debate to concentrate on the economic problems. Obama said a president should be able to handle multiple issues at once. I guess he feels that doesn't apply to him.
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    Jun 10, 2009 11:52 AM GMT
    DClifterguy said
    KyleAD saidProblems dont come in single file lines... he's the goddamn president, he can multitask.


    Obama is the one that chastised McCain during the campaign when McCain wanted to postpone a debate to concentrate on the economic problems. Obama said a president should be able to handle multiple issues at once. I guess he feels that doesn't apply to him.


    What politicians will say to get elected.

    Will we ever learn?
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    Jun 10, 2009 12:32 PM GMT
    My checkbook is now closed to the Democratic Party
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Jun 10, 2009 12:36 PM GMT
    President Obama perpetuates the double standard against gays in the military.

    The position of not repealing DADT already is that doing so "jeopardizes the cohesion" in the ranks. Or some other excuse to that effect. This is what the Brass tells him and this is what Obama sees as a compromise. He considers this a fair argument.

    Okay.

    Should he have not run for President as a Black man because there are enough racists in our country that are not ready for a Black man in office? I mean, he is the Commander in Chief. He has the most power in the world and he likewise has the most responsibilities in executing that power. His decisions effect millions of people. His presence as CiC causes a lot of bitterness amongst some Americans.

    This is the double standard I see, amongst other things. icon_mad.gif
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Jun 10, 2009 12:40 PM GMT
    I wish someone would question what evidence of dissention in the military would be caused by repealing DADT. Training and the UCMJ are the tools to prevent or minimize that dissention. We do that with sexual assault and sexual harrassment already, why not include GLBT training?

    What a farce!
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    Jun 10, 2009 1:05 PM GMT
    coolarmydude saidI wish someone would question what evidence of dissention in the military would be caused by repealing DADT. Training and the UCMJ are the tools to prevent or minimize that dissention. We do that with sexual assault and sexual harrassment already, why not include GLBT training?

    What a farce!

    Agreed. The argument is really condescending to servicemembers--suggesting they couldn't keep their bigotry in check for the sake of a professional work environment. How many dozens of countries have already gone through this successfully? Again, that theory implies our folks just can't handle following orders.
  • Menergy_1

    Posts: 737

    Jun 10, 2009 1:10 PM GMT
    coolarmydude saidPresident Obama perpetuates the double standard against gays in the military.

    The position of not repealing DADT already is that doing so "jeopardizes the cohesion" in the ranks. Or some other excuse to that effect. This is what the Brass tells him and this is what Obama sees as a compromise. He considers this a fair argument.

    Okay.

    Should he have not run for President as a Black man because there are enough racists in our country that are not ready for a Black man in office? I mean, he is the Commander in Chief. He has the most power in the world and he likewise has the most responsibilities in executing that power. His decisions effect millions of people. His presence as CiC causes a lot of bitterness amongst some Americans.

    This is the double standard I see, amongst other things. icon_mad.gif

    I wish someone would question what evidence of dissention in the military would be caused by repealing DADT. Training and the UCMJ are the tools to prevent or minimize that dissention. We do that with sexual assault and sexual harrassment already, why not include GLBT training?

    What a farce!



    1969er said
    coolarmydude saidI wish someone would question what evidence of dissention in the military would be caused by repealing DADT. Training and the UCMJ are the tools to prevent or minimize that dissention. We do that with sexual assault and sexual harrassment already, why not include GLBT training?

    What a farce!

    Agreed. The argument is really condescending to servicemembers--suggesting they couldn't keep their bigotry in check for the sake of a professional work environment. How many dozens of countries have already gone through this successfully? Again, that theory implies our folks just can't handle following orders.



    Well said, men! (applause smiley here....)
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    Jun 10, 2009 1:22 PM GMT
    AbFab1 said
    coolarmydude saidPresident Obama perpetuates the double standard against gays in the military.

    The position of not repealing DADT already is that doing so "jeopardizes the cohesion" in the ranks. Or some other excuse to that effect. This is what the Brass tells him and this is what Obama sees as a compromise. He considers this a fair argument.

    Okay.

    Should he have not run for President as a Black man because there are enough racists in our country that are not ready for a Black man in office? I mean, he is the Commander in Chief. He has the most power in the world and he likewise has the most responsibilities in executing that power. His decisions effect millions of people. His presence as CiC causes a lot of bitterness amongst some Americans.

    This is the double standard I see, amongst other things. icon_mad.gif

    I wish someone would question what evidence of dissention in the military would be caused by repealing DADT. Training and the UCMJ are the tools to prevent or minimize that dissention. We do that with sexual assault and sexual harrassment already, why not include GLBT training?

    What a farce!



    1969er said
    coolarmydude saidI wish someone would question what evidence of dissention in the military would be caused by repealing DADT. Training and the UCMJ are the tools to prevent or minimize that dissention. We do that with sexual assault and sexual harrassment already, why not include GLBT training?

    What a farce!

    Agreed. The argument is really condescending to servicemembers--suggesting they couldn't keep their bigotry in check for the sake of a professional work environment. How many dozens of countries have already gone through this successfully? Again, that theory implies our folks just can't handle following orders.



    Well said, men! (applause smiley here....)


    Sigh...aren't these the same arguments/reasoning made before Clinton "compromised" on DADT? Yeah, we've made a ton of progress
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    Jun 10, 2009 1:41 PM GMT
    medfordguy said: "Sigh...aren't these the same arguments/reasoning made before Clinton "compromised" on DADT? Yeah, we've made a ton of progress"

    Oddly enough, the general public has advanced far more than military and government leadership--just the opposite when African-Americans and women were integrated into the ranks.
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    Jun 10, 2009 1:55 PM GMT
    KyleAD saidProblems dont come in single file lines... he's the goddamn president, he can multitask.


    Easy for you to say.... think you can multitask a war, an economic crisis, and a civil rights issue? Nobody is Superman.

    Now as for the issue at hand, I am glad someone is stepping to the plate in California... someone who can speak personally to the idiocy of DADT.
  • calibro

    Posts: 8888

    Jun 10, 2009 2:38 PM GMT
    SAHEM62896 said
    KyleAD saidProblems dont come in single file lines... he's the goddamn president, he can multitask.


    Easy for you to say.... think you can multitask a war, an economic crisis, and a civil rights issue? Nobody is Superman.

    Now as for the issue at hand, I am glad someone is stepping to the plate in California... someone who can speak personally to the idiocy of DADT.


    Yes, and if it does get repealed, most likely you can thank Congress, though I doubt Obama would refrain from taking credit for it
  • BeingThePhoen...

    Posts: 1157

    Jun 10, 2009 2:44 PM GMT
    SAHEM62896 said
    KyleAD saidProblems dont come in single file lines... he's the goddamn president, he can multitask.


    Easy for you to say.... think you can multitask a war, an economic crisis, and a civil rights issue? Nobody is Superman.

    Now as for the issue at hand, I am glad someone is stepping to the plate in California... someone who can speak personally to the idiocy of DADT.


    The President has a virtually unlimited staff. If anyone has the ability to multi-task, it is him.
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    Jun 10, 2009 2:49 PM GMT
    dyersburg_dude said
    SAHEM62896 said
    KyleAD saidProblems dont come in single file lines... he's the goddamn president, he can multitask.


    Easy for you to say.... think you can multitask a war, an economic crisis, and a civil rights issue? Nobody is Superman.

    Now as for the issue at hand, I am glad someone is stepping to the plate in California... someone who can speak personally to the idiocy of DADT.


    The President has a virtually unlimited staff. If anyone has the ability to multi-task, it is him.


    That's "designating," not "multitasking."
  • MSUBioNerd

    Posts: 1813

    Jun 10, 2009 3:02 PM GMT
    The bigger issue here is not simply that he's backpedaling on DADT, by not making its repeal a priority. The more flagrant problem is that his administration sent a brief to the Supreme Court saying that the lower court did the right thing by upholding the policy. He crossed the boundary from not acting to repeal it to actively supporting the policy, at a time when roughly 60% of Republicans and weekly church attenders in the country support gay soldiers being able to serve openly. Actively supporting an unpopular and discriminatory policy is very different than merely not working to end it.

    This is the "fierce advocate" for our equality?

    I'm disappointed, but I'm not surprised. Gays have been taken for granted by the Democrats for a long time now, even though we haven't really fared significantly better under Democratic administrations than Republican ones. They've learned that we'll tend to vote for them anyway, even if they don't do much for us, so they spend their political capital elsewhere.
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    Jun 10, 2009 3:03 PM GMT
    Sorry to divert--someone just shared this 4 minute NYT vid on military husbands:
    http://video.nytimes.com/video/2009/06/09/opinion/1194840804819/op-ed-a-gay-soldiers-husband.html
    Worth a look.
  • BeingThePhoen...

    Posts: 1157

    Jun 10, 2009 3:04 PM GMT
    SAHEM62896 said
    dyersburg_dude said
    SAHEM62896 said
    KyleAD saidProblems dont come in single file lines... he's the goddamn president, he can multitask.


    Easy for you to say.... think you can multitask a war, an economic crisis, and a civil rights issue? Nobody is Superman.

    Now as for the issue at hand, I am glad someone is stepping to the plate in California... someone who can speak personally to the idiocy of DADT.


    The President has a virtually unlimited staff. If anyone has the ability to multi-task, it is him.


    That's "designating," not "multitasking."


    No, that is delegating, which is the most effecient form of multi-tasking.
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    Jun 10, 2009 3:07 PM GMT
    MSUBioNerd saidThe bigger issue here is not simply that he's backpedaling on DADT, by not making its repeal a priority. The more flagrant problem is that his administration sent a brief to the Supreme Court saying that the lower court did the right thing by upholding the policy. He crossed the boundary from not acting to repeal it to actively supporting the policy, at a time when roughly 60% of Republicans and weekly church attenders in the country support gay soldiers being able to serve openly. Actively supporting an unpopular and discriminatory policy is very different than merely not working to end it.

    This is the "fierce advocate" for our equality?

    I'm disappointed, but I'm not surprised. Gays have been taken for granted by the Democrats for a long time now, even though we haven't really fared significantly better under Democratic administrations than Republican ones. They've learned that we'll tend to vote for them anyway, even if they don't do much for us, so they spend their political capital elsewhere.


    So maybe we should stop our kvetching here and start contacting our Democratic Reps and Senators, send messages to the White House and to the DNC. Tell them don't come to the LGBT community looking for campaign money until they tackle these issues. And that we will be be happy to support challengers in the primary. Our dollars and votes should not be taken for granted anymore.
  • BeingThePhoen...

    Posts: 1157

    Jun 10, 2009 3:21 PM GMT
    medfordguy said


    So maybe we should stop our kvetching here and start contacting our Democratic Reps and Senators, send messages to the White House and to the DNC. Tell them don't come to the LGBT community looking for campaign money until they tackle these issues. And that we will be be happy to support challengers in the primary. Our dollars and votes should not be taken for granted anymore.


    I said it in another forum, let us all band together and vote Rep. in 4 years if the BS continues. If we vote for a 3rd party, it is still highly likely that Obama will stay in office, but if we vote Rep., then they will have a decisive win and we will have sent a sturn message to our "friends" in Dem. office that we aren't going to take their crap anymore.
  • BeingThePhoen...

    Posts: 1157

    Jun 10, 2009 3:28 PM GMT
    jprichva said
    dyersburg_dude said
    I said it in another forum, let us all band together and vote Rep. in 4 years if the BS continues. If we vote for a 3rd party, it is still highly likely that Obama will stay in office, but if we vote Rep., then they will have a decisive win and we will have sent a sturn message to our "friends" in Dem. office that we aren't going to take their crap anymore.

    You did say it. It was stupidity then and it is stupidity now.
    It would be like Jews voting for Nazis because the Weimar Republic disappointed them.


    I've never been one to call someone stupid, but that is the most stupid and ignorant statement I've heard in quite a while. I'm definately no fan of Reps., but to compare them to Nazis is quite rediculous.