Congress is looking to pass resolutions to support the Iranian dissidents. Should the American government be getting into this?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jun 21, 2009 1:12 AM GMT
    Do you think the American government should be passing resolutions or just keep quiet and only urge restraint in use of force?
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    Jun 21, 2009 1:18 AM GMT

    Having solved all domestic problems, the congress proceeded to ...
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    Jun 21, 2009 1:30 AM GMT
    there is no debate to be had here: America OBVIOUSLY needs to keep its mouth closed as ANY statement of support for the moderates will be used by the conservatives to tarnish the moderates as foreign pawns.

    Remember what happened when Bush the Elder urged the Shiites to rise against Saddam Hussein in Iraq? Massacres. Yay for right wing rhetoric. It may make a few stupid people feel better about themselves, but the cost is likely to be horrible.

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    Jun 21, 2009 3:40 AM GMT
    I think it depends entirely on how widespread the uprising is and what the nature of the uprising is. If the protestors simply want to replace one theocracy with another, I fail to see the compelling interest. Everyone can deplore the violence in general without the need for congressional votes. Everyone has.

    If a truly significant portion of the population is actually fighting for democracy and liberty, rather than just another flavor of dictatorship, that is another matter entirely.
  • creature

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    Jun 21, 2009 4:11 AM GMT
    I don't think there is a need to pass resolutions. What for? Because lawmakers want it to be known that the United States supports the dissent? I'm sure the world already knows that.

    I bet some Iranians welcome the support, but the strength to stand up to Ahmadinejad and ousting him comes from the Iranians themselves, not from outside. As noble as Congress wants to appear, it does nothing. For thousands of years, Iranians have been able to handle themselves. And they can continue to do so.
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    Jun 21, 2009 4:28 AM GMT
    I would have been afraid a few days ago that anything said by the US could have been used to incite reaction against the protests by claiming they were US inspired. But I think that time has passed. With the use of twitter and phone vids, people can see that this is Iranian bred.
  • creature

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    Jun 21, 2009 4:41 AM GMT
    But according to the Ayotollah's warning, "bloodshed and chaos" will be coming if the opposition leaders don't stop the protest. And it is mounting, so with or without official U.S. support — there will be [more] blood.

    I just think it's a waste for Congress to pass the resolutions. What real, constructive purpose do they serve? It looks to me like it's self-serving.
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    Jun 21, 2009 4:42 AM GMT
    creature saidI just think it's a waste for Congress to pass the resolutions. What real, constructive purpose do they serve? It looks to me like it's self-serving.

    I agree.
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    Jun 21, 2009 6:11 AM GMT
    Lostboy saidthere is no debate to be had here: America OBVIOUSLY needs to keep its mouth closed as ANY statement of support for the moderates will be used by the conservatives to tarnish the moderates as foreign pawns.

    Remember what happened when Bush the Elder urged the Shiites to rise against Saddam Hussein in Iraq? Massacres. Yay for right wing rhetoric. It may make a few stupid people feel better about themselves, but the cost is likely to be horrible.

    icon_eek.gif


    The moderates are already viewed and they are as such. folks from the Middle East know exactly who Refsanjani is and his close ties to the west. of course you'd never hear about that here. That's the whole point of the crackdown.
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    Jun 21, 2009 2:35 PM GMT
    Yes, resolutions are worthless either way. Also worthless is the worry about the theocratic nutjobs accusing us of meddling. They call us the great satan no matter what and blame us for all their troubles regardless of whether we say anything or not. What are they gonna do, blame us more?

    The only key I am interested in is what they are fighting for. If they just want a different leader, same system, deplore the violence and move on. If they want a real revolution, real democracy, and in truly widespread numbers… I think we should do much more than resolutions.

    I thought it was great that a number of European countries opened their embassies to the protest wounded so they could avoid government agencies at the hospitals. It’s humanitarian, but again, what’s the real desire of the populous?
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    Jun 21, 2009 2:40 PM GMT
    The woman know as Neda, who has quickly become the unfortunate face of the protests.

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    Jun 21, 2009 3:14 PM GMT
    Well we should support the people, to show them we have no problem with them, but their government they too are obviously having a problem with, and want gone.

    Its also kind of interesting how if you look at the face books, the twiters, and youtube ect, with protesters writing about what is going on, and how they feel, you'll notice how its not written in Farsi but in English. That is because they want the world to see, particularly us, they want to show that they do not like the current leadership, they are sick of it, they voted to change it, but were cheated. They dismiss or laugh at the "leadership" when they say this America, Britain, and France's fault. The protesters know this is not true.

    I actually do agree somewhat with what Obama has done so far, though he should have come out a bit sooner with it. Criticized the government's actions on the people, and stand with the protesters, they want our support, and I don't mean troops going up in the country or anything, they want to hear our words about it, and they want us to see and hear what is really going on. That whole argument of "don't say too much because then you'll allow the government to say we are the cause of it" is bullshit, the government and the hardcore people on the side of the government, said that from jump, and were gonna say it anyway. They also blame Britain the most, no surprise they blame others, instead of their own poor and harsh leadership that is the cause of the anger of the people.

    A couple of years ago there was a resolution that was to support the people of Iran, because people knew this stuff was coming, and the senator that fought the hardest against it, and knocked it down, was our loquacious dimwitted. now vice president Joe loose lips Biden ha. Now the resolution has been passed, but we'll see if it should have been done sooner.

    My friend was showing me some pretty crazy photos from what is going on over there, wild stuff.
  • coolarmydude

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    Jun 21, 2009 3:23 PM GMT
    It would be a stonger statement if we could get Jordan and Egypt, amongst other Arab nations, to come out in support of the protestors. Obama's speech in Cairo was intended to precipitate a new way of dealing with the extremism in the Middle East and it's time Arab nations to start walking the walk on these types of issues.
  • zakariahzol

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    Jun 21, 2009 3:28 PM GMT
    Do you guys ever learn , the lesson of Iraq and Afghanistan?
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    Jun 21, 2009 3:46 PM GMT
    coolarmydude saidIt would be a stonger statement if we could get Jordan and Egypt, amongst other Arab nations, to come out in support of the protestors. Obama's speech in Cairo was intended to precipitate a new way of dealing with the extremism in the Middle East and it's time Arab nations to start walking the walk on these types of issues.


    Iran is not an Arab nation.
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    Jun 21, 2009 4:00 PM GMT
    That and why would one theocracy say anything in support of those revolting in any fashion within another theocracy? Dictatorships do not knock other dictatorships for keeping the people in line. They simply study the situation to see if they can learn anything that will help them keep their own people in line more effectively.
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    Jun 21, 2009 4:07 PM GMT
    zakariahzol saidDo you guys ever learn , the lesson of Iraq and Afghanistan?


    No, some of them don´t. Amazingly they don´t.
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    Jun 21, 2009 4:21 PM GMT
    Caslon11000 saidWith the use of twitter and phone vids, people can see that this is Iranian bred.
    But on the other hand, people accessing Twitter in Iran can see that people in the US and the world offer their support for what the demonstrators are doing.

    From the "green overlays" to all the kind words of support people are offering, the message is hopefully getting through.

    And I would guess that's a far more powerful and effective message than anything Pres Obama, the Congress or any other world governments could offer.
  • coolarmydude

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    Jun 21, 2009 9:45 PM GMT
    wrustle said, "Iran is not an Arab nation."


    I didn't say Iran was. I said Jordan and Egypt amongst other Arab Nations. The point of the policy on Iran is to contain Ahmajenidad's rhetoric and in order to do that, he needs to be rebuked by the Middle East. He tries to seek an alliance with the extreme factions of the Middle East with his contempt against Israel.
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    Jun 21, 2009 10:23 PM GMT
    But it has nothing to do with America!

    Would America like it, if a country more advanced on human rights, come to America to sort out it's backwardness on human rights?

    let rename America to jesusland, and replace the flag with that of a banjo, and then we can also give Hawaii back to the hawaiians too.
  • GQjock

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    Jun 22, 2009 1:30 AM GMT
    Why The HELL should we give Ahmedinejad an excuse to accuse the dissidents of collaborating with America?
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    Jun 22, 2009 2:07 AM GMT
    We have a 6 decade history of fucking in Iranian affairs that has had nothing to do with democracy. If we interfere, any resulting regime change will be forever viewed as an America puppet government. The louder we support them, the more likely we are to undermine the legitimacy of their cause in the region.
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    Jun 22, 2009 11:24 AM GMT
    coolarmydude saidwrustle said, "Iran is not an Arab nation."


    I didn't say Iran was. I said Jordan and Egypt amongst other Arab Nations. The point of the policy on Iran is to contain Ahmajenidad's rhetoric and in order to do that, he needs to be rebuked by the Middle East. He tries to seek an alliance with the extreme factions of the Middle East with his contempt against Israel.


    I know what you wrote, but it assumed or implied that Iran is among like minded friends who will influence them within the Arab sphere. If anything the Arab world has viewed Iran with a lot of suspicion.
    Being rebuked by Egypt or Saudi Arabia would not necessarily be viewed in a positive way.
    Our policy for decades has been to counter Iranian power within the middle east by bolstering Egypt, Saudia Arabia and Pakistan with money and weapons. I would think that because of this these countries leaders or spokesmen would be seen as our immediate proxies.
  • coolarmydude

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    Jun 22, 2009 12:21 PM GMT
    wrustle said, "Being rebuked by Egypt or Saudi Arabia would not necessarily be viewed in a positive way. "


    By whom? Iran? Great! That's the objective. If Iran is isolated from the Arab world, who else do they have to turn to?
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    Jun 22, 2009 12:40 PM GMT
    Resolutions are cheap little PR moves. I like them.

    A resolution supporting transparency in the democratic process in Iran and basic human rights would be wonderful.

    A resolution denouncing the Iranian government as corrupt and undemocratic would be a train wreck.