Unhappy Thanksgiving - Day of Massacre

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 22, 2007 4:40 PM GMT
    I am NOT thankful for our systematic massacre of 300 million turkeys.





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  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 22, 2007 5:00 PM GMT
    Good thing we're having roast duckling!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 22, 2007 5:30 PM GMT
    mmmmmm turkey!


    hippie - you know the name of the native tribe that lived a solely vergetarian lifestyle?
  • Laurence

    Posts: 942

    Nov 22, 2007 5:41 PM GMT
    Yum turkey. It's not even thanksgiving here in the Uk, but I really fancy a nice big turkey sandwich with mayo and stuffing.

    Thanks Hippie for helping me decide what to have for tea.

    Lozx
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    Nov 22, 2007 5:43 PM GMT
    There are many cultures that do live and have lived as vegetarian, close to vegetarian, or vegan. The Hunza of Pakistan, many Hindu, Sikh, Buddhist sects and villages and the list goes on.

    I don't know of any Native American tribes that were veg, they may or may not exist but not to my knowledge.
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    Nov 22, 2007 5:44 PM GMT
    LoL you people make me laugh. I am glad I helped you decide what is for teatime. You think I am offended? I don't care if you respond mmm I love Turkey. I am doing what I feel is right, and that is putting the information out there. It is up to you to choose the path you see fit, but ultimately the karmic consequences of a meat eating diet are heavy. Best of luck!
  • Laurence

    Posts: 942

    Nov 22, 2007 5:48 PM GMT
    Well 'the karmic consequences' of eating carrots is something I'd rather not live with.

    Those turkeys are dead anyways it would be ecologically unsound not to eat them (between two slices of wholemeal bread...yum).

    Lozx
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    Nov 22, 2007 5:51 PM GMT
    =) okay dokes...

    I'll opt for the tofurkey, yum.
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    Nov 22, 2007 7:34 PM GMT
    icon_twisted.gif 1. Giving the Bird - Urban Dictionary (PLUCK YOU)

    The 100 Years War (which actually lasted 116 years) was a bloody war fought between the British and the French. This was the first war in which long range artillery was used, and the first deadly long range weapon to be invented was the longbow, which was invented by the British. The longbow had an effective accurate range of about 300 feet.
    The longbowmen were not the most battle worthy men, as they were usually trained to shoot an arrow long distances, and not to fight with close range weapons. The longbow was used in an almost machine gun like fashion. The archer would stick all of his arrows in the ground in order to get to them quickly. He would grab an arrow and quickly shoot at the approaching army, then quickly reload and fire again. He would use his index and ring finger to draw and fire the bow. This was known as “plucking”, as it resembled plucking a stringed instrument.
    The French hated the longbow. Whenever a longbowman was captured, the French would cut of their index and ring fingers, so they couldn’t fire their weapons, and hence be useless to the war.
    The captured English prisoners returned with nothing left but their middle fingers, and in a short period of time learned to use their middle finger to draw their longbows, and “pluck” once again.
    Before one battle, the French, knowing they had their opponent greatly outnumbered (around six to one), had a grand party the night before the battle was to begin. Realizing this, the English attacked early the next morning, surprising the French, and destroying their advantage. As the English realized their victory, they began their victory celebrations while still waging a victorious battle.
    One of the most notable celebrations was the dancing and cheering done by the mutilated longbowmen. They would dance and skip around the dead and wounded Frenchmen, showing them their only remaining useful finger (their middle finger), and yelling (in a British accent), “Look! I still have me middle fingah! I can still pluck you!!! I can still pluck you!!!”
    This phrase was later modified to something else we say when we give someone the finger…
    So the next time someone gives you the finger and says what they normally say, correct them by saying, “Actually, the correct term is pluck you!”, and see what kind of results you get!
    It is also because of the pheasant or goose feathers on the arrows used with the longbow that the symbolic gesture is known as "Giving the Bird."

    “Look! I still have me middle fingah! I can still pluck you!!! I can still pluck you!!!”

    icon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gificon_lol.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 22, 2007 9:10 PM GMT
    Ahhhhh Agincourt... our finest hour!

    In all seriousness though, the Turkey carnage today is certainly pause for thought.... but do you not think there are gradations, hippie4life? The bird I'm cooking atm for my friends was purchased from a local farmer where it lived in excellent free-range conditions (I've been to the farm) and was killed humanely. Is this not better than a factory-farmed turkey?

    There are also socio-economic issues: poor people cannot afford to buy free-range food? Should we impose such restrictive moral obligations on them?

    I think, for my part, that is important that people raise awareness about how food is produced and how animals are treated; and for those of us who can afford to do so, to buy food produced sustainably and humanely. And I think those who make the choice to be vegetarian ought to be lauded for a virtuous decision.

    I am on the other hand very much thankful for my turkey --- it smells *delicious*! I'm also introducing to my american friends the delights of yorkshire puddings.
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    Nov 22, 2007 9:28 PM GMT
    you are indeed correct hippe4lyfe. There were no tribes that were solely vegetarian and if there were they were never heard of or remembered. Think about it. icon_lol.gif



  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 22, 2007 9:32 PM GMT
    I hope you are not having Yorkshire Pudding with turkey?!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:00 PM GMT
    Yorkshire pud with everything as far as I'm concerned
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:24 PM GMT
    TigerTim I am glad that you made the effort to purchase from a local more humane farm. These videos are not about small family owned farms, these are massive operations, factory farms. In this particular video it was butterball.
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:27 PM GMT
    without mass farm production how do the vegetarians propose to feed the world population?

    Sign up here, to forgo your food ration.

    Or is in other countries that they ought to forgo their rations?

    Alternately how much are you willing to pay for scarce food if the peta folks have their way?


  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:28 PM GMT
    Mass farm production with plants, is quite different. You really do bring about silly arguments my friend.
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:30 PM GMT
    "...our systematic massacre of 300 million turkeys..."
    OK mass meat production that you are so outraged about.
    What is your alternative? Or is that still too silly a question to answer?


  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:30 PM GMT
    Vegetarianism is the best thing you can do to stave off world hunger.

    Nearly half of the grains from world harvests are fed to "livestock." According to Robbins, it takes sixteen times more resources to produce a pound of food from livestock than it does to produce a pound of food without raising animals as "livestock." It takes only one pound of grain to produce a pound of bread. In his book May All Be Fed, Mr. John Robbins wrote: "By cycling our grain through livestock and into beef, we end up with 6 percent as much food to feed human beings as we would have if we ate the grain directly."
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:41 PM GMT
    Utter nonsense. yes it takes a lot of grain to produce meat but we cannot live on just grain.
    Spoken like a man who's never raised his own food - to sustain oneself solely on vegetables requires more energy than one is taking in - which is why we evolved omnivorously.

    - I have yet to meet a PETA advocate who knows the first thing about farming, raising crops or animal husbandry.

    - I never met a vegetarian living in the country - they live downtown where food is brought to them - the only way being vegetarian doesn't occupy so much survival time it is a barely viable way of life - even so, take away all the vitamin supplements and you have pretty unhealthy vegetarians with the dentition of a carnivore but lacking the digestive system of an herbivore.

    - Our species evolved omnivorously because vegetarianism is just not conducive to human survival. Without eating meat any previous group died out.
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:42 PM GMT
    Well put.
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:43 PM GMT
    Dead critters are YUMMY!
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:47 PM GMT
    I always wished to set up a challenge.

    Two dwellings - both fully stocked with vegetables and a freezer full of meat. Vegans in one; omnivores in the other The occupants must live for one winter. My guess is by November the vegetarians will be pounding on the other homestead door begging for food. The meat will sustain a household over the whole winter while the vegetables will be rotted before Christmas.

    This contributed in proto-societies to the greater value placed on the hunters (men) compared to the gatherers (the women). Men (the hunters) were considered (with good reason) to be "the providers" because of the quantity of food they brought compared to the gatherers.
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    Nov 22, 2007 10:56 PM GMT
    "...It takes only one pound of grain to produce a pound of bread...."

    What is the Vegan recipe for bread?icon_lol.gif

    300 million turkeys???

    How many turkeys will each family eat in America today? Good Gawd no wonder there is an obesity epidemic!!

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    Nov 22, 2007 10:58 PM GMT
    People aren't starving because grain is being fed to animals instead of people. Right now, there is enough food being produced to feed the entire human population. People are starving because of greed, corruption, evil dictators, pressure on countries to grow cash crops instead of food crops, etc.
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    Nov 23, 2007 12:19 AM GMT
    We get heritage turkeys every year, endorsed by the international slow food movement, and they live like this:

    heritage.jpg

    hippieIt is up to you to choose the path you see fit, but ultimately the karmic consequences of a meat eating diet are heavy. Best of luck!

    Not as heavy as the karmic consequences of passive-aggressive condescension on a national holiday. Cheers!