An interesting thought from a magician

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    Jul 20, 2009 7:06 AM GMT
    I was watching an interview Penn Jillette gave last year for Night Talk and he said something very interesting about the supernatural. On the subject of psychics:

    Penn JilletteThe fact that I can't explain it doesn't make it supernatural. That's a very important thing to say. You can describe something to me that someone did that was a trick, and I can not be able to tell you how it was done, that does not mean automatically that it was supernatural, it means I don't know everything. There's a humility involved. And what strikes me about believers is the lack of humility. They're essentially saying "I can't figure it out, therefore it's supernatural." And a lot of stuff we can't figure out.


    I know a lot of you guys claim to be athiest. However, I've encountered quite a few threads regarding beliefs in things such as karma, reincarnation, spirits, naturism, and a variety of other spiritual topics. Sometimes, those who confess belief in these topics are also critics of the beliefs of major religions such as Christianity. I also know a lot of you guys are Christian. So I was just curious of everyone's thoughts on spiritual beliefs, the difference between the spirituality of major religions and "new age" stuff, and your thoughts on the quote from Penn Jillette.

    (If you'd like to hear the quote in full context, watch part 5 of the interview http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UChsszEL5ok or watch all five parts on youtube. It's very interesting.)
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    Jul 20, 2009 2:19 PM GMT


    I agree with Pen on just about everything except this, "And what strikes me about believers is the lack of humility. They're essentially saying "I can't figure it out, therefore it's supernatural."

    He forgot to put 'some' in front of the word believers.

    -Doug
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    Jul 20, 2009 2:27 PM GMT


    it's a matter of accuracy, and the OP has asked, "and your thoughts on the quote from Penn Jillette."

    ...so we complied.
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    Jul 20, 2009 2:36 PM GMT
    I can make my dick disappear in one.icon_wink.gif
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    Jul 20, 2009 2:40 PM GMT


    oh lordee, lilTanker. We were asked for our opinion. We gave it.

    Penn said believers. Some believers is true. All believers is not.

    Penn states he's humble , but that believers are not. We disagree.

    ... we are not allowed to say that? lol
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    Jul 20, 2009 2:49 PM GMT



    ...you're implying our opinion is somehow wrong. It isn't.


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    Jul 20, 2009 2:51 PM GMT
    Both Penn & Teller are atheists and have very similar views. Teller, BTW, who's the short one in the duo, is legally just "Teller" with no first name, even on his passport.

    While Penn Jillette is an admitted polygamist, and has even dated Debbie Harry (whom he credits with inspiring him to invent a patented woman's sex device while they were sharing a hot tub), Teller's orientation is less clear.

    I've always assumed him to be gay, but does anyone know for sure? I can't learn anything on this. He's as silent in his private life as his character is onstage.
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    Jul 20, 2009 2:56 PM GMT
    "why should he have to change what he says to make it nice for everyone.. "

    is not what we were saying and you know that.

    "Why am I not allowed to question your opinion though without this flustering of hands in the air.. "


    is baiting us.

    good evening to you



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    Jul 20, 2009 2:58 PM GMT
    meninlove said

    "why should he have to change what he says to make it nice for everyone.. "

    is not what we were saying and you know that.

    "Why am I not allowed to question your opinion though without this flustering of hands in the air.. "


    is baiting us.



    yeah look, make what ever assumptions you want, I wanted to know why you felt a particular way, you don't like being questioned, so terribly sorry and considering I've never "baited" either of you before in a conversation and you just make that assumption.. well.. yeah.. what ever!
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    Jul 20, 2009 3:04 PM GMT


    "and considering I've never "baited" either of you before in a conversation and you just make that assumption."

    LOL where did that come from. We referred to this topic only.

    There's no past tense in the following: 'is baiting us'

    Now this threads deserves its time, so if you want to discuss this more, our email is available.
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    Jul 20, 2009 3:09 PM GMT
    The way I see it....

    Religions and belief systems have a lot in common--whether people want to admit it or not.

    People believe certain things today despite contridictions from science--I never fully realized how many uneducated people there were until several years ago. (by uneducated I mean one's lack of general knowlegde, and more important... one's inability to find respected and relatively unbiased research on a specific subject and teach oneself about that subject/.)

    Anyway, Why should I believe in God (Christian) but not Allah? Karma but not reincarnation? etc..

    None have credible, undenible, relatively unbiased proof to support their beliefs.

    It all comes down to faith.

    I am not against the possiblity of any belief system--I just have not seen evidence to believe in anything yet.

    <---Agnostic
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    Jul 20, 2009 3:35 PM GMT
    Religion and belief can be very complicated concepts.
    .....

    It seems I cant organize my thoughts at the moment. Maybe sleep would do me good.

    If you want to read something really interesting that concerns religion, please check out this essay:
    http://www.opheliaofthespirits.com/2008/05/02/the-notion-of-truth-2/