Talking points on what healthcare reform really means (not what conservatives are trying to scare you into believing).

  • yogadudeSEATT...

    Posts: 373

    Aug 07, 2009 7:24 PM GMT
    The following set of talking points was compiled by Bob Crittenden of the Herndon Alliance. Please use them: at local town hall meetings, in letters-to-the-editor, for public service announcements, for call-in radio, at your neighbor's pot luck. The opponents are selling fear of change. We need to talk about what change means to each person.


    1.This reform will deliver security and stability to Middle America
    2.You will get stable coverage that you can count on to be there.
    You will always have options for coverage – even if you change or lose a job.
    If you cannot afford insurance, you’ll get help with your premiums. If you hit a rough patch, you’ll get help to maintain coverage.
    If you run a small biz, you’ll get tax breaks to buy coverage for yourself and your workers and you’ll have a choice for affordable options.
    3.You will have stable costs that won’t eat more and more of your paycheck
    If you fall ill, your premiums wont go up because you’ve been sick.
    As you grow older, your insurance will remain affordable
    If you work for yourself or a small biz, what you pay for coverage will be the same as what large companies pay.
    4.You will have peace of mind that you can always get the care you need, when you need it, from the doctor you choose!
    You’ll never de denied coverage because you fall sick
    You will have a choice of your doctor and health plan.
    You’ll never leave the hospital with a bill too big to pay because your benefits have run out.




  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 07, 2009 7:49 PM GMT
    FINALLY...someone smart enough to look at the health care problem and the legislation being discussed to improve it.

    There is a very serious organized, well thought out and financed effort by corporate America to derail and demonize current proposals. The tactic used is to fund a huge campaign being played out across the country via TV and internet, to create an image that the average American is outraged and scared about the legislation.

    They are using fear and misinformation to get people to react emotionally without thinking about the real problems and solutions.

    This fabricated "grass roots" movement that they are selling is being sucked up by stupid average people everywhere. To them, current proposals will kill your grandparents and socialize medicine........(ummm...anybody hear of Medicare?).

    If you dig a little deeper and learn who exactly are the guys behind this, you will find that many are wealthy Republicans, corporate groups, religious groups, conservative clubs etc.

    Demonizing Obama also fits nicely into demonizing anybodyelse who would take away our basic American rights by allowing our grandparents to die and to avoid talking about the real issues.

    Some companies and political groups might loose money if current legislation is passed...........GEE.....I wonder which groups?

    More to come.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 07, 2009 9:53 PM GMT
    It's welfare Dork.
  • bchbum

    Posts: 161

    Aug 07, 2009 11:26 PM GMT
    ATLTED saidIt's welfare Dork.


    Welfare is free. No ones giving it away, still has to be purchased.
  • kinetic

    Posts: 1125

    Aug 08, 2009 12:58 AM GMT
    The republican party seems to be preying on American's fear and ignorance when it comes to this issue. Anyone with half a brain can see that the only thing this might hurt is wealthy peoples wallets and profits that greedy insurance companies are making. And all the ones that are having a full-on eppy are the freaks in these companies pockets that act as their puppets in congress, the senate etc.
    Its age old. The right only giving a shit about themselves and their money and the left giving a shit about more than just themselves.
    Those retarded charts they are showing on the news have been created to confuse people as much as possible and have little logic to them. I would LOVE to have someone logically explain one of those charts to me. I guarantee it cannot be done.
    In reality, if this reform goes through its actually pretty simple. You will keep what you got or get something better.
    Just look at Canada and England. They both have a NHS and they are just fine.
    In my opinion the real damage being done is not moving on with this and making it a reality. At the same time, I'm not at all surprised that the shit-storm that has begun is taking place. That's what you get with rich old idiots in power.
    I really am heated about this. I can't afford insurance right now and what the fuck am I supposed to do?
    I spent 4 years living in London and never worried when I was sick or injured; I just took care of myself. Now if I visit the ER for ANYTHING I'm looking at @ least a grand that I can't pay. Its absolutely ridiculous and out of control.
    If people really want to see this country go to shit then keep doing what we're doing and it'll happen faster than you think.
    *WHEW*
    Rant over.
    icon_mad.gif
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    Aug 08, 2009 1:17 AM GMT
    kinetic saidThe republican party seems to be preying on American's fear and ignorance when it comes to this issue.


    That is just a flat out lie. The GOP is only looking out for the best interests of the American people, not trying to frighten anyone. I mean, do you want to have the government kill your parents when they are elderly? Listen to the always reasonable Sarah Palin

    Vie Sarah's Facebook pageThe America I know and love is not one in which my parents or my baby with Down Syndrome will have to stand in front of Obama's "death panel" so his bureaucrats can decide, based on a subjective judgment of their "level of productivity in society," whether they are worthy of health care. Such a system is downright evil.


    See, totally not fear mongering. icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Aug 08, 2009 6:02 AM GMT
    I'm afraid that because of Big Pharm, and Big Medical, and the BILLIONS they've spent in the lobby ($998,000 to George Bush alone), we won't see anything that resembles true universal health care in The United States. Medicine for huge profit will continue.

    Thinking that we are rated 27'th in the world for health care, and knowing of the experiences of our household, personally, I think it's going to end up a huge money trough for the rich, just like the GOP wars, and tax cuts for the extremely wealthy.

    I think that Germany, Cuba, Western Europe, and many "third world" countries have it right in regarding health care as a public service, and a neccesity. Interestingly, Germany has had universal health care since the late 1800's and Western Europe since the end of World War II. In most countries, health care is like the fire department, police, libraries, and so on in that it's considered in the best interest of the public to have those services available to the poplulous at large. In the United States, not having money can be a DEATH WARRANT with regards to health care.

    Clearly, we need to deal with end-of-life issues that raise costs. Clearly, we need to get for profit administrators out of the decision making process for medical care and have some party, like the goverment, needs to make a fairly impartial determination with health care. I'd rather take my chance s with a goverment doctor, than a HMO cost saver, any day.

    In those countries with universal health care, all the numbers are better than here. The cost is lower. Folks live longer. They enjoy a higher quality of life.

    I'm afraid the current plan caters to the folks of for profit medicine, and while we shouldn't deny medical folks a decent living (they still make a good living in more civilized countries) it shouldn't be entitlement to be extraordinarly wealthy, either.

    Sometimes, you need to the right thing, and pay it forward, as a human being. Sometimes, you need to set captialism aside, as we do with our police, firemen, libraries, roads, and other critical infrastructure.

    The scare tactics, and blatant lies, of the GOP, and the United Health Care campaign, are abomidable. It's dishonesty and manipulation of the worst kind, preying on ignorant folks who don't see beyond the end of their nose.

    In the TURP bailout we gave the banks enough to pay for healthcare for ten years. Shame on us.

    In the car manufacturers bailout much of the same.

    We WASTE a billion dollars a year on The War on Drugs.

    At some point, we need to think clearly about our fellow man, and doing the right thing.
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    Aug 08, 2009 3:07 PM GMT

    kinetic said, "I spent 4 years living in London and never worried when I was sick or injured; I just took care of myself."


    Thanks, that was well put. That's an example of freedom, and it confuses us both that a country so rabid about the concept of freedom wouldn't embrace this, instead remaining under the tyranny of corporate greed.

    As for Ms Palin, some of you should fire off a post on her site - if she has one- about what would happen to all her worse case scenarios if she were a Canadian. None of those scenarios of hers would happen here.

    We so dislike it when people like her pull stuff out of their asses and read it to you...

    ..oh gorsh, aren't those meninlove harsh today, eh? lol!
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    Aug 30, 2009 2:01 PM GMT
    Reprinted from NY Times


    The New York Times
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    August 30, 2009
    Op-Ed Columnist
    Until Medical Bills Do Us Part
    By NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

    Critics fret that health care reform would undermine American family values, not least by convening somber death panels to wheel away Grandma as if she were Old Yeller.

    But peel away the emotions and fearmongering, and in fact it is the existing system that unnecessarily takes lives and breaks apart families.

    My friend M. — you’ll understand in a moment why she’s terrified of my using her name — had to make a searing decision a year ago. She was married to a sweet, gentle man whom she loved, but who had become increasingly absent-minded. Finally, he was diagnosed with early-onset dementia.

    The disease is degenerative, and he will become steadily less able to care for himself. At some point, as his medical needs multiply, he will probably need to be institutionalized.

    The hospital arranged a conference call with a social worker, who outlined how the dementia and its financial toll on the family would progress, and then added, out of the blue: “Maybe you should divorce.”

    “I was blown away,” M. told me. But, she said, the hospital staff members explained that they had seen it all before, many times. If M.’s husband required long-term care, the costs would be catastrophic even for a middle-class family with savings.

    Eventually, after the expenses whittled away their combined assets, her husband could go on Medicaid — but by then their children’s nest egg would be gone, along with her 401(k) plan. She would face a bleak retirement with neither her husband nor her savings.

    A complicating factor was that this was a second marriage. M.’s first husband had died, leaving an inheritance that he had intended for their children. She and her second husband had a prenuptial agreement, but that would not protect her assets from his medical expenses.

    The hospital told M. not to waste time in dissolving the marriage. For five years after any divorce, her assets could be seized — precisely because the government knows that people sometimes divorce husbands or wives to escape their medical bills.

    “How could I divorce him? I loved him,” she told me.

    “I explored a lot of options with an attorney here in town,” she added. “The attorney said, ‘I don’t see any other options for you.’ It took about a year for me to do the divorce, it was so hard.”

    So M. divorced the man she loves. I asked him what he thought of this. He can still speak, albeit not always coherently, and he paused a long, long time. All he could manage was: “It’s hard to say.”

    Long-term care constitutes a difficult and expensive challenge in any health system. But the American patchwork, full of cracks through which people fall, has a special problem with medical expenses of all kinds bankrupting couples.

    A study reported in The American Journal of Medicine this month found that 62 percent of American bankruptcies are linked to medical bills. These medical bankruptcies had increased nearly 50 percent in just six years. Astonishingly, 78 percent of these people actually had health insurance, but the gaps and inadequacies left them unprotected when they were hit by devastating bills.

    M. still helps her husband and, quietly, continues to live with him and care for him. But she worries that the authorities will come after her if they realize that they divorced not because of irreconcilable differences but because of irreconcilable medical bills. There were awkward questions from friends who saw the divorce announcement in the newspaper.

    “It’s just crazy,” she said. “It twists people like pretzels.”

    The existing system doesn’t just break up families, it also costs lives. A 2004 study by the Institute of Medicine, a branch of the National Academy of Sciences, found that lack of health insurance causes 18,000 unnecessary deaths a year. That’s one person slipping through the cracks and dying every half an hour.

    In short, it’s a good bet that our existing dysfunctional health system knocks off far more people than an army of “death panels” could — even if they existed, worked 24/7 and got around in a fleet of black helicopters.

    So, for those of you inclined to believe the worst about President Obama, think it through. Suppose he is indeed a secret, foreign-born Muslim agent who is scheming to undermine American family values while killing off as many grandmothers as possible.

    If all that were true, why on earth would he be trying so hard to reform our health care system? We already know how to prod families into divorce and take a life unnecessarily every 30 minutes — all we need to do is reject reform and stick with exactly what we have.



  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Mar 28, 2010 11:17 AM GMT
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