Question to Guys who are Positive...

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 23, 2009 8:31 PM GMT
    Back Story:

    So, I recently met a guy who I had been chatting online with for over two years. I went on vacation and I finally got to meet him; we had always flirted with eachother and talked freely about sex for the past two years (online).

    So, I ended up sleeping with this guy. The next day, I met my friend in the park. I realized both my friend and the guy I slept with were both DJ's and thought I'd ask my friend, Kevin, if he knew the guy. Turns out he did because the first thing that came out of his mouth when I said his name (we'll name him Ryan) was "He's positive".

    I called the guy up and asked him if he was positive; turns out he was. The night before, I was fucking him and the condom came off. I stupidly kept it off because I always have trouble keeping an erection with a condom on. I thought, "well, we've been talking for two years...he woulda told me if he had something serious". Completely stupid of me, I know. It was a dumb decision. I'm am fully aware of my own fault within the situation.

    However, I feel that he should have told me (without me having to ask). I realized, now, that I should have asked (and I should always ask), but I feel that he has the responsibility of sharing this type of information with a person before he sleeps with other people.

    Question: If you're positive, do you feel that its responsibility to share this information with people you sleep with? Should I not feel the way that I do?


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    Aug 23, 2009 8:38 PM GMT
    This is a conversation that I had with him; I get extremely angry when I read it and I wonder if I'm justified for feeling the way that I do...

    Please, If you're positive...I'd like to know your opinion on the situation...

    Conversation:


    ME
    well, i didn't get into details about you
    nor were any questions asked about your health
    9:23pmHIM
    thats OK, but I just thought they would be thorough
    9:23pmME
    no
    they didnt' say much
    9:23pmHIM
    but I thought I told u my viral load was zero
    it makes a big difference
    I mean, its not foolproof, but its like having cancer in remission
    basically it would only go back up if I stopped taking meds or something drastic happened to my immune system
    like a traumatic illness
    9:26pmME
    so, i have pretty good chances here?
    9:27pmHIM
    yes thats why I was trying to reassure you & calm u down
    but its understandable why u would be upset
    9:27pmME
    and you always used a condom when you were fucking me?
    9:28pmHIM
    yes didnt u remember?
    I mean, u probably couldnt tell, but yes
    9:28pmME
    well yes, but i dind't always look
    and that's not why i'm mad
    or freaking out
    9:28pmHIM
    then why?
    9:29pmME
    do i even have to go there?
    you know why...
    9:29pmHIM
    well, we've discussed it, so i dont think it would be a surprise
    9:29pmME
    k ...so...
    9:29pmHIM
    Im sorry I assumyou knew
    9:31pmHIM
    but I went through a lot in the last 3 years that sort of threw me off track, so I have not always known who is privy to all my health details
    I just assume the people i have sex with know, and i use a condom
    9:31pmME
    ??
    9:31pmHIM
    unless theyre someone i have just met
    9:31pmME
    why would you ever assume people know?
    9:31pmHIM
    i mean, people I have known for a while
    9:32pmME
    well, i had never met you.
    9:32pmHIM
    no, but we talk
    9:32pmME
    well...
    9:32pmHIM
    i cant remember what we said 2-3 years ago
    9:32pmME
    i hope this wakes you up from your assumptions
    9:32pmHIM
    yes of course
    9:32pmME
    assumptions, in this case, can change ones life for the bad
    9:32pmHIM
    but I have also had the same problems with eemployers
    not knowing
    and some knowing, and then others finding out, and me losing work over it
    its been a nightmare
    the social implications have been worse than the health issues
    9:35pmME
    well...i'm not too sure what that has to do with not telling people you sleep with and making assumptions that they know...but, i'm not just gonna forgive you
    at least, not yet...maybe one of these days...
    9:35pmHIM
    well, it just has caused confusion with who I have known I have told
    9:35pmME
    but, something this big...a pretty big mistake on your behalf
    9:37pmHIM
    I don't expect you to understand
    its been very frustrating handling it
    9:38pmME
    well, i find it very difficult to give you sympanthy at the moment
    9:38pmHIM
    well ok fair enough
    but i do like you, and didnt want that to happen
    9:39pmME
    well, unfortunately, the mistake was already made
    9:40pmHIM
    I just never have sex without condoms
    9:40pmME
    that doesn't mean somebody shouldn't know of your status yo
    people you sleep with must know
    even if you wear a condom, that doesn't mean anything...
    like, your playing with people's lives here...
    9:41pmHIM
    so if someone said to you they were negative, you wouldnt wear one?
    I just dont understand that
    9:42pmME
    well, now i definitely will
    9:42pmHIM
    always
    i hated it at first, now used to it
    9:43pmME
    i dont' know what this has to do with you not telling people
    9:43pmHIM
    nothing, I am saying, why would u take a condom off in the first place?
    9:43pmME
    it's like you're trying to justify yourself not telling people ...and putting that responsibility on everybody else that they should always be careful
    9:43pmHIM
    why wouldnt you always be careful?
    9:44pmME
    There's this magical thing known as trust. which obviously doesn't exist .
    9:44pmHIM
    I mean, that goes without saying, the same for me
    about being careful
    9:44pmME
    anyway
    9:44pmHIM
    trust?
    can u trust that everyone knows their status?
    or trust that everyone has been tested properly?
    9:45pmME
    i still can't believe you giving ME a lecture
    9:45pmHIM
    some people say they are negative and dont know because they have no symptoms
    9:45pME
    this isn't my fault.
    9:45pHIM
    Im not giving you a lecture
    9:45pmME
    i mean, it is.
    9:45pmHIM
    we are having a discussion
    9:45pmME
    no, it is my fault.
    for trusting you...
    it is your fualt for telling me...
    for not*
    9:46pmHIM
    well, i was a bit shocked when you called me the next day and asked
    did I not tell you yes?
    I could have said No
    I thought u knew!
    9:47pmME
    and what if i caught you at the lie?
    assuming you said no..
    9:47pmHIM
    well, I just dont know why i would have lied
    9:47pmME
    what difference does it make??
    9:47pmHIM
    it makes a difference because there was miscommunication
    and there shouldnt be
    9:48pmME
    you coulda/shoulda/woulda dude...what you should have done is told me before i came into your apartment
    what you shoulda done is said "hey, by the way ...just to be clear..you know of my status right?"
    that's what you should ahve done.
    9:48pmHIM
    do u think i make it a point of reminding everyone I have sexual interest in over and over that i am positiv?
    thats just absurd
    9:48pmME
    NO
    IT ISN'T
    okay...
    well, this discussion is over.
    9:49pmHIM
    ok, you obviously dont think that there is a problem with playing unsafe
    9:49pmME
    of course i do...this isn't about that.
    9:50pmHIM
    well, I know that, but u are trying to make this about blame, and its not
    9:50pmME
    this is about you not telling me of your status
    9:50pmHIM
    its about communication and responsibility on both parts
    well, you could have asked me when you walked in the door as well
    9:50pmME
    Yes, i could have.
    and I made the horrible mistake of trusting you ..since we've formed a friendship
    9:51pmHIM
    for someone i have been chatting with for so long, why didnt it occur to you if I had not mentioned it?
    9:51pm

    9:51pmHIM
    and so I am not allowed to make the mistake in assuming that you knew?
    9:51pmME
    this is a trust issue, when it comes down to it.
    9:52pm

    9:52pmHIM
    why do I have to advertise my status to every guy online?
    9:52pmME
    you don't
    but if somebody is comign over for sex
    it should DEFINITELY be advertised
    how do you not understand that concept?
    9:52pmHIM
    ...when they come over, then yes
    but those are people I have not known
    9:53pmME
    well, anyway...
    i'm done talking with you..
    So, have a good night.
    and we'll just both hope and pray that everything goes okay for me.

    HIM
    ok, well, I am trying to resolve this...and I do want things to turn out for the best of course
    9:54pmME
    in all honest, there is nothing to be resolved
    9:54pmHIM
    but you simply have a narrow vision of the whole thing
    9:55pmME
    that's funny...because i've told this story to several people...and they all say the same thing.
    9:55pmHIM
    for someone who doesnt know what a viral load is, that tells me narrow
    have you talked to anyone who is poz?
    9:56pmME
    well, that's fine. you can think i have a narrow view of it.
    not yet, but i think i might.
    9:56pmHIM
    have you talked to anyone who is poz?
    ok please do
    9:56pmME
    will do.
    9:56pmHIM
    u might get a different perspective
    9:56pmME
    if you say so, buddy
    9:56pmHIM
    I do
    thats the nly thing about this whole thing that makes me angry
    you are so presumptive and judgemental
    and you dont think you are
    9:57pmME
    of course i'm judgemental, man
    how can i not judge you?
    how do you expect me to sit here and not judge your actions...
    when your actions have caused stress and fear?
    9:58pmHIM
    well, i could judge yours too, but it doesnt solve anything
    and your actions were so noble?
    you simply should talk to someone poz and get their opinion, talk to SEVERAL poz guys
    I cant explain it any further
    9:59pmME
    i will.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 23, 2009 8:40 PM GMT
    I forgot to mention, that I got on a program called PEP that if you find out within a certain amount of hours within contact...you can take medication to see if it stops it. So, part of the conversation is referring to me going to the clinic and them giving me drugs.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 23, 2009 9:21 PM GMT

    It's yers to ask.
  • torontoguy222...

    Posts: 410

    Aug 23, 2009 10:42 PM GMT
    Not positive here, but just as a general response I would think that when something as serious as HIV is involved the guy should have had AMPLE opportunity to mention is some time along the 2 years that you spoke. What an ass. I probably would have made similar assumptions as you. Get tested, but I hope you're alright.
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    Aug 24, 2009 1:00 AM GMT
    hey, thanks for your response.
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    Aug 24, 2009 1:25 AM GMT


    If there is one thing in life I despise more than anything else the belief that anyone (including government) my decisions. By not telling you, this guy did not allow you to decide whether you wanted to have sex with an HIV positive person and in effect made the decision for you. That is just flat evil.

    I see manypeople all aroud me who are like that: take the nuts on here who think I should pay more tax -- when they want to pay none or little -- for grandiose __cked up dream of universal health care.

    If you learn anything from this, I think it should be the need to always out manuever such folks long before they make your choice for you. Unfortunately, it is those personal relationships that are the most difficult in which to know someone is about to attempt just that.
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    Aug 24, 2009 1:53 AM GMT
    He's an asshole for having sex with you and not telling you his status. You're a fucktard for not asking and assuming he is negative. You deserve each other.
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    Aug 24, 2009 1:54 AM GMT
    thank you...

    Anybody out there who's positive have any opinions on this??
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 24, 2009 1:55 AM GMT
    rad1980 saidthank you...

    Anybody out there who's positive have any opinions on this??


    You just got one from a poz guy.
  • calibro

    Posts: 8888

    Aug 24, 2009 1:59 AM GMT
    The way I see the situation is that it's not the responsibility, but rather the benefit of the negative guy to ask. There is nothing on you for not asking, therefore no responsibility, but it is to your benefit of doing so. The positive guy, however, does have the responsibility, since he clearly is the one that would cause the infection, and he has the responsibility to let another person know so that they can decide for themselves. Side note, hopefully you didn't get infected, but you have a pretty strong criminal/civil case against the guy.
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    Aug 24, 2009 2:01 AM GMT
    Hmm... from the transcript, it looks like there's a fair amount of rationalization on both sides.

    You should certainly have asked. If you can't be bothered to ask, you're sending the message that it isn't that important to you.

    He seems to be saying that he "assumed" he told you over two years ago. Since I can't know what's going on inside his head, I can only assume he's being honest (as opposed to him secretly being sure that he never told you).
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    Aug 24, 2009 2:02 AM GMT
    GuerrillaSodomite saidHe's an asshole for having sex with you and not telling you his status. You're a fucktard for not asking and assuming he is negative. You deserve each other.


    So, because I made a stupid decision I deserve to be with an asshole?
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    Aug 24, 2009 2:05 AM GMT
    GuerrillaSodomite saidHe's an asshole for having sex with you and not telling you his status. You're a fucktard for not asking and assuming he is negative. You deserve each other.


    I think I have a new favorite RJ member... And remember the rule- ASSUME EVERYONE IS POZ until you actually get tested with them... and then its only as true as they are loyal... Flings should always be assumed poz anyway...

    And, yeah, ASK... depending on what state it is, not disclosing your status in certain situations is a crime, just like any other STD, but much harder to live with.
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    Aug 24, 2009 2:05 AM GMT
    FitExecutive saidHmm... from the transcript, it looks like there's a fair amount of rationalization on both sides.

    You should certainly have asked. If you can't be bothered to ask, you're sending the message that it isn't that important to you.

    He seems to be saying that he "assumed" he told you over two years ago. Since I can't know what's going on inside his head, I can only assume he's being honest (as opposed to him secretly being sure that he never told you).


    Good point. However, I had asked him if he wanted to get a third person involved before any of this occurred. However, he never once asked if the third guy knew of his status. Because of this, I almost have to throw out the idea that he "assumed" after two years of talking to him. Because, he didn't ask anything when it came to third guy (which never happened, thank God). This all happened a day before the event took place.
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    Aug 24, 2009 2:16 AM GMT
    rad1980 saidBecause of this, I almost have to throw out the idea that he "assumed" after two years of talking to him. Because, he didn't ask anything when it came to third guy (which never happened, thank God). This all happened a day before the event took place.


    Sounds plausible, but certainly not rock-solid. Bottom line, you are in a he-said/he-said situation that we won't really be able to answer for you.

    You must be sure about what's important to you and communicate that unequivocally to your partners. Conversely, anyone with an STD of any kind is also responsible for communicating their status to their partners.

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    Aug 24, 2009 2:35 AM GMT
    GuerrillaSodomite saidHe's an asshole for having sex with you and not telling you his status. You're a fucktard for not asking and assuming he is negative. You deserve each other.


    You're so...edgy sometime. You make me want to ask a pos guy something. icon_razz.gificon_redface.gif

    OP, if you make it out of this unscathed, remember, If it happens again you will be with the asshole forever, in a manner of speaking.
    ....................................
    I wish you the best, I'm pr--pr--praying for you.
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    Aug 24, 2009 2:40 AM GMT
    GuiltyGear said
    You're so...edgy sometime. You make me want to ask a pos guy something. icon_razz.gificon_redface.gif



    I was trying to be nice! Or as nice as I can be after hearing this story over and over and over and over and over again, ad nauseum at least 2-3 times a month on here the last couple years..icon_biggrin.gif
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    Aug 24, 2009 2:40 AM GMT
    GuerrillaSodomite saidHe's an asshole for having sex with you and not telling you his status. You're a fucktard for not asking and assuming he is negative. You deserve each other.


    This.

    If you have trouble keeping an erection with a condom on, the solution is not barebacking. You could use a dildo on him while he sucks you off, or you could get a cockring, but never is it reasonable to just take off the condom because it isn't getting your rocks off. That is textbook stupidity and I hope you learned something from this.
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    Aug 24, 2009 2:57 AM GMT
    GuerrillaSodomite said

    I was trying to be nice! icon_biggrin.gif


    I'm not mad, you are still the man to me.

    s26462_gc_1.jpg
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    Aug 24, 2009 3:37 AM GMT
    I'm not positive, either, and for very good reason.

    Ever study your capacity for judgment in a state of sexual arousal? In women it goes away almost completely. In men, less so, but, good judgment is greatly diminished. It takes a few seconds for you to use the upper part of your brain, rather than the bottom part. The military teaches soldiers how to put that delay in by habit.

    I had a guy pull this same shit on me one night, expect, he wanted to blow me. I knew something wasn't quite right, so I confronted him several times, and he finally admitted it saying his viral load was next to nothing. I told him "you lied to me." He admitted he had. I had asked him several times, and he had lied to me repeatedly.

    I had myself tested, and walked away clean.

    The HIV guy was RICH (money-wise), you see he had been the beneficiary of 7 guys...all of whom had died from AIDS.

    True story.

    Train yourself how to use that upper part of your brain. Understand that the HIV guy was a selfish prick who could give a shit about you. Tell others about your experience. In 2009, there's no excuse for getting HIV.

    Why on earth didn't you confront the guy about it before you started fucking him? Where were your brains?
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    Aug 24, 2009 3:55 AM GMT
    GuerrillaSodomite, I love you!! LOL A little harsh, but target, hit.

    Now....Rad1980 my first 2 boyfriends were poz. I'm still negative thanks to their love, support, understanding, and concern for my well being. The first thing they taught me is that it's YOUR responsibility as well as the persons to discuss status FIRST and foremost. That way, you can decide to just end the date or start kissing. Knowledge is power handsome.

    You didn't ask. You were waiting to be told. If you don't give 2 shits about your life, who will? What I find to be the truly boneheaded stunt was not putting on another condom. Thank you MunchingZombie!! If you're not going to ask and take control of YOUR life, then it sounds like you need to practice fucking with a condom on all the time. That way, if you get lost in the moment, you're protected.

    Now the question is....until your status is cleared (and I hope it comes back negative), what are YOU going to tell potential sex partners?

    Play safe....or not at all.
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    Aug 24, 2009 3:57 AM GMT
    rad1980 saidI had asked him if he wanted to get a third person involved before any of this occurred. However, he never once asked if the third guy knew of his status.

    Just because he didn't ask doesn't mean you shouldn't. There is nothing to be assumed when you hookup with a guy that you meet online or in person. ASK
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    Aug 24, 2009 4:06 AM GMT
    Here's another question.. (specifically for positive people)...i guess towards Guerrilla since he's the only one who's replied who is positive...

    Do you always tell people about your status before you have sex with them? Or do you only say something unless asked?
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    Aug 24, 2009 4:44 AM GMT
    For starters, you should know better. I am sure a lesson has been learned. At least I hope.

    Now to the other matter. In many states it is against the law to not disclose being HIV Pos to a sex partner prior to engaging in the act. That does not mean the guys will of course, so you should never assume the guy is negative. The laws vary from state to state and like most things are subject to interpretation and the way cases are prosecuted.

    States with laws on the books.
    http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparetable.jsp?ind=569&cat=11

    I know I will get shit for saying this but, but I don't care. If you are HIV Positive, you need to tell the guy/girl you are about to have sex with. If you don't you are single handedly taking their future and possibly altering it forever in ways that person can't even begin to comprehend. That is no power anyone should ever take advantage of, and you have no right to exert that kind of power over another person. If you are of the mind set that it is their responsibility for their health, as right as you may be, you obviously have absolutely no dignity and little awareness of the far-reaching impact your selfish choices will have on others lives long after you are gone. Be the bigger man and give that person notice. Negative guys are not off the hook either. If you have sex with someone and do not at least ask AND/OR then (regardless of the answer) neglect to take the proper precautions, then eventually you will contract HIV or some other Virus or bacteria. You to are no better than the assholes that think they shouldn't have to tell you or worse lie to you. Use your brain people!

    Bottom line, everyone needs to take responsibility! Passing it on for someone else to bring up is so incredibly cowardly it makes me wanna slap someone. - Save someones face from my back-hand, protect yourself and others. Thank you!

    bitchslap.jpg

    -- Will someone grab the soap box, I've got my hands full here.