How embarrassing and Invasive

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 24, 2009 12:55 AM GMT
    this South African teenager won her races fair and square at the summer games but they will be testing her soon to see if she is a female due to her looks. .i personally believe she is a female its just she was raised ....to be "hard"--plus training can have effects on women...Your thoughts?

    0f654420-67c3-4177-adaa-47055daaf899.jpg.
    Caster_Semenya.jpg

  • silverfox

    Posts: 3178

    Aug 24, 2009 1:01 AM GMT
    I am.......speechless.

    If I saw this girl walking down the street...I would think it was a guy.
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    Aug 24, 2009 5:33 AM GMT
    Her shirt has semen on it. Will that be included in the testing?
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    Aug 24, 2009 6:20 AM GMT
    mickeytopogigio saidHer shirt has semen on it. Will that be included in the testing?

    *giggles* oh your terrible Murial!
  • ASUbusy

    Posts: 79

    Aug 24, 2009 6:23 AM GMT
    DUDE FOR SURE icon_biggrin.gif
  • danisnotstr8

    Posts: 2579

    Aug 24, 2009 6:33 AM GMT
    mickeytopogigio saidHer shirt has semen on it. Will that be included in the testing?


    Funniest thing I have read all day.

    I hope her vagina jumps out and teaches them a lesson. "This just in: South African Olympic-sized vagina swallows testing committee whole..."
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    Aug 24, 2009 7:17 AM GMT
    Let's hear it for androgyny!
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    Aug 24, 2009 7:36 AM GMT
    tereseus1 saidthis South African teenager won her races fair and square at the summer games but they will be testing her soon to see if she is a female due to her looks. .i personally believe she is a female its just she was raised ....to be "hard"--plus training can have effects on women...Your thoughts?


    You know, instead of whining and saying "my daughter is female why can't you believe me," why doesn't the family just convince her to get a DNA test, show the results, and if she IS a female then all of the news networks and idiots who claimed her to be male should feel embarrassed.

    Anyway, I wonder what her BOYFRIEND looks like! icon_eek.gif
  • barriehomeboy

    Posts: 2475

    Aug 24, 2009 7:57 AM GMT
    the Olympic ``testing` board has a much more interesting task now
  • barriehomeboy

    Posts: 2475

    Aug 24, 2009 8:02 AM GMT
    There is no bulge. So, the Soviet Union doctors who abused female athletes there have found new jobs in new places. What a surprise. We are not the victims in the deciet though. Contain your anger..
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    Aug 24, 2009 8:06 AM GMT
    I could have sworn there was a Futurama episode about this. icon_lol.gif
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    Aug 24, 2009 8:45 AM GMT
    They are doing tests on her DNA and chromosomes and what not. They say it will take a few weeks.

    I was watching a sports programme here and one of the panelists was a former runner and another was a former swimmer, and both were saying that female athletes used to have to prove they were females. YOu had to get all the tests done and at the meets flash your "I'm a chick" card. One of them said that if this runner had have come from an advanced country s/he probably would have had these types of tests already.
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    Aug 24, 2009 9:09 AM GMT
    mickeytopogigio saidHer shirt has semen on it. Will that be included in the testing?


    LMFAO! Lks like a guy to me. I'm sure she's highly embarresed but I hope after all is said and done she proves them wrg and shuts them the FUCK up!
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    Aug 24, 2009 11:37 AM GMT
    syd_hockey_79 saidThey are doing tests on her DNA and chromosomes and what not. They say it will take a few weeks.

    I was watching a sports programme here and one of the panelists was a former runner and another was a former swimmer, and both were saying that female athletes used to have to prove they were females. YOu had to get all the tests done and at the meets flash your "I'm a chick" card. One of them said that if this runner had have come from an advanced country s/he probably would have had these types of tests already.




    Although South Africa may be regarded as a non-advanced country in your eyes, maybe you should pay us visit and get a little more informed. We do DNA testing in SA -we even have fully equiped laboratories to do them in - and this lady is definitely a woman. Our "non-advanced" Constitution also forbids any discrimination based on sex and sexual orientation. That is why gay marriage is a fact in our non-advanced country, while in most western "advanced" countries it is still taboo. Most South Africans accept the fact that she does look masculine, but we also accept that she has the right not to be humiliated by the press. I would have expected a little more acceptance from a forum such as this.
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    Aug 24, 2009 11:50 AM GMT
    Elite athletes often have genetic defects. In fact, Micheal Phelps is just one example (he has a disease that has a consequence that allows him to clear lactic acid much faster than regular people). Lance Armstrong is another example of genetics at work (his heart moves fully 3 times more in one stroke than regular people - VO2 max is over the top).

    It's easy enough to tell.

    It raises the question of what's fair and what isn't. Phelps has disease that allows him enhanced recovery. Armstrong has a heart that is unlike most of the world. Is it fair, or is it luck? Should it be allowed?
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    Aug 24, 2009 12:04 PM GMT
    chuckystud saidElite athletes often have genetic defects. In fact, Micheal Phelps is just one example (he has a disease that has a consequence that allows him to clear lactic acid much faster than regular people). Lance Armstrong is another example of genetics at work (his heart moves fully 3 times more in one stroke than a regular people).

    It's easy enough to tell.

    It raises the question of what's fair and what isn't. Phelps has disease that allows him enhanced recovery. Armstrong has a heart that unlike most of the world. Is it fair, or is it luck? Should it be allowed?


    I've been thinking the same thing in regard to this. That, and the notion that what if she had been born intersex and the doctors 'finished' her to make her a physiological female without anyone ever knowing. The situation really speaks the ignorance of most people, esp. Americans, about gender not being as clearly binary as we're taught.
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    Aug 24, 2009 12:08 PM GMT
    It begs the question, what is a man, or what is a woman? I mean, most of us have seen some pretty "different" people along the way.

    In the academic world, some of the greatest minds belong to some very strange folks. Think about Stephen Hawking. A brilliant mind inside a wasted body. Many, many, geniuses have some level of autism or Aspberger's.

    The Black race has testosterone levels about 15% higher than the white race. Is that fair? They also get sickle cell anemia, but, are resistant to malaria because of that difference. If you live in a jungle full of mosquitoes being resistant to malaria can be a very good thing.

    My point is that "sports" fans, sitting on their couches, eating their pizza, smoking their cigs, and sucking their beers, are really quick to shout foul, when in fact maybe they shouldn't be.

    No doubt, the athlete above looks very much like a guy. Hard telling what's up.
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    Aug 24, 2009 12:14 PM GMT
    Native S.A weman share more cromosomes with mencompaired to weman from other geographic locations. She is a woman, but has just intrinsic factors which make her more stronger physically than other weman. Its similar to ethopian marathon runners who have a huge V02 Max score
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    Aug 24, 2009 12:25 PM GMT
    The evolutionary machine, natural adaption, and genetic defects can be fascinating stuff. Human performance can be affected so much by it.

    As we unravel the science of genetics, it'll be interesting to see what scientists come up with. We'll have the ability to re-engineer ourselves; to fix fouled up messages; to even re-create ourselves in a different way.

    Once we understand the science of genetics, we'll be able to engineer ourselves in specific ways for specific purposes. Should we? Shouldn't we? Why? Why not?

    Followers of false belief systems have long resisted science. Genetics causes those folks to go off the deep end. I remember when in-vitro first came out, and the fits they pitched.

    In the not to distant future, we'll be able to fix so much, or make so much.

    Whether it's snake venom (used for bp control), mold (penicillin), algae poop (insulin), testosterone (steriods), The Internet, or any of a long list of technology, it's not the technology that's good nor bad, but, the application of it.

    Folks who live in different parts of the world have their adaptations. Some folks leverage disease in a good way. Some folks have very different genes that allow different levels of performance, or that make them a mess.
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    Aug 24, 2009 1:25 PM GMT
    Jumping off what Chucky and Runin said, I asked in another thread why certain genetic variations, like longer limbs or Phelps' lactic acid, are acceptable but a female with some male secondary sex traits is not? Both are natural, though the latter might be more common.

    Too boot, I heard a spokesman for the games say even if she did have these traits there wouldn't be a rule that would disqualify her.
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Aug 24, 2009 1:28 PM GMT
    It's possible she is fully female, but is an XY woman.

    It's probably more likely that intense training and maintaining a very low bodyfat from a young age has reduced the estrogen in her system. Many young female athletes who train will have suspended menstrual cycles.
  • DiverScience

    Posts: 1426

    Aug 24, 2009 2:05 PM GMT
    It's also possible the poor woman is, you know, a perfectly "normal" XX woman who just happens to train her ass off and is good.

    Remember Renee Richards who they made a huge deal about her "guyness" until she got married and started wearing dresses and suddenly no one thought it was weird anymore.

    It's gender policing, nothing more, nothing less. She doesn't look "woman enough" because she's actually got muscles and doesn't wear dresses, so people are flipping out. This is the only one that's gotten media attention of late, but the fact is that women athletes are fairly constantly submitted to this kind of gender policing.

    Incidentally, it isn't the Olympic Committee (IOF) who's forcing testing, they haven't done that for years. It's the IAAF who's demanding the test.
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    Aug 24, 2009 2:12 PM GMT
    Thanks Martin, I agree with you 100%

    Martin5769 said
    syd_hockey_79 saidThey are doing tests on her DNA and chromosomes and what not. They say it will take a few weeks.

    I was watching a sports programme here and one of the panelists was a former runner and another was a former swimmer, and both were saying that female athletes used to have to prove they were females. YOu had to get all the tests done and at the meets flash your "I'm a chick" card. One of them said that if this runner had have come from an advanced country s/he probably would have had these types of tests already.




    Although South Africa may be regarded as a non-advanced country in your eyes, maybe you should pay us visit and get a little more informed. We do DNA testing in SA -we even have fully equiped laboratories to do them in - and this lady is definitely a woman. Our "non-advanced" Constitution also forbids any discrimination based on sex and sexual orientation. That is why gay marriage is a fact in our non-advanced country, while in most western "advanced" countries it is still taboo. Most South Africans accept the fact that she does look masculine, but we also accept that she has the right not to be humiliated by the press. I would have expected a little more acceptance from a forum such as this.
  • Menergy_1

    Posts: 737

    Aug 24, 2009 2:24 PM GMT
    Martin5769 said
    syd_hockey_79 saidThey are doing tests on her DNA and chromosomes and what not. They say it will take a few weeks.

    I was watching a sports programme here and one of the panelists was a former runner and another was a former swimmer, and both were saying that female athletes used to have to prove they were females. YOu had to get all the tests done and at the meets flash your "I'm a chick" card. One of them said that if this runner had have come from an advanced country s/he probably would have had these types of tests already.




    Although South Africa may be regarded as a non-advanced country in your eyes, maybe you should pay us visit and get a little more informed. We do DNA testing in SA -we even have fully equiped laboratories to do them in - and this lady is definitely a woman. Our "non-advanced" Constitution also forbids any discrimination based on sex and sexual orientation. That is why gay marriage is a fact in our non-advanced country, while in most western "advanced" countries it is still taboo. Most South Africans accept the fact that she does look masculine, but we also accept that she has the right not to be humiliated by the press. I would have expected a little more acceptance from a forum such as this.


    I understand your sentiments and reactions as a South African, Martin.

    I'm curious about the implications of your statement "Our....Constitution also forbids any discrimination based on sex and sexual orientation." Does that imply a male or female would be entitled to participate in a female or male (respectively) sports competition if he/she so wanted - since keeping sports separated by gender would be discrimination? Or perhaps I've misunderstood what you meant in terms of gender-"restricted" sports and such. I read this in the context of the original thread topic.

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    Aug 24, 2009 2:26 PM GMT
    They should be testing her. It would not be the first time that a country entered an athlete of debatable genetics in a female race. I believe one of the Eastern German swimmers in the 1970s turned out to be male (or at least hermaphrodite).

    And to be honest based on looks, if I did not know better I would say this person was a male.