Self esteem and gay men?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 12:38 AM GMT
    Is it just me or do guys expect other gay guys to have absolutely no self esteem what so ever....


    I swear every time you stand up to them or they think they can get somewhere by being a bitch and shooting insults at you. They act like they have never met someone who just refuses to tolerate their crap and doesn't give a damn about what a stranger thinks.........

    and then, you have to listen to them whine about all the shit from guys they allow themselves to be taken in by

    I'm not saying that it's explicit to the gay world but it seems a whole lot more common
  • NyRuinz

    Posts: 887

    Oct 14, 2009 1:31 AM GMT
    MsclDrew saidIs it just me or do guys expect other gay guys to have absolutely no self esteem what so ever....


    I swear every time you stand up to them or they think they can get somewhere by being a bitch and shooting insulting at you. They act like they have never met someone who just tolerate their crap and doesn't give a damn about what a stranger thinks.........

    and then, you have to listen to them whine about all the shit from guys they allow themselves to be taken in by

    I'm not saying that it's explicit to the gay world but it seems a whole lot more common


    Probably because they are accustomed to walking over people. I see people on this forum do it all the time, they come off rude and obnoxious, but when you come back at them the same way they came at you, your everything in the book. icon_rolleyes.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 1:43 AM GMT
    Details please!

    brenda_eating_popcorn.gif

    icon_biggrin.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 6:07 AM GMT
    _edit will rePly in 8hrs!

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 6:31 AM GMT
    Seems like lots of details are missing. I suppose you were just venting.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 6:32 AM GMT
    joeyveras saidSeems like lots of details are missing. I suppose you were just venting.


    ditto
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 7:15 AM GMT
    lmfao...a lot of guys on here whine entirely too muchicon_lol.gif But it could be da economyicon_eek.gif
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    Oct 14, 2009 7:48 AM GMT
    It's an unwritten law of internet forums. Half of us come here to whine. A quarter of us come to belittle the whiners. An eighth come to offer solutions. The rest come to interact with the whiners, belittlers, and solution-offerers. And all come to boost our self esteem or feel better about ourselves, whatever avenue we take and whatever we might need to do it.

    Or something like that.
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    Oct 14, 2009 7:50 AM GMT
    zdrew saidIt's an unwritten law of internet forums. Half of us come here to whine. A quarter of us come to belittle the whiners. An eighth come to offer solutions. The rest come to interact with the whiners, belittlers, and solution-offerers. And all come to boost our self esteem or feel better about ourselves, whatever avenue we take and whatever we might need to do it.

    Or something like that.


    stop whining... you whiner.
  • Buddha

    Posts: 1765

    Oct 14, 2009 8:04 AM GMT
    It works very well on some people, which is kind of sad. Great way to introduce an abusive dominant relationship (y).

    But yeah, for those with even a sliver of self-esteem, they just come off as obnoxious. I talked to one of those guys that "everyone falls for" (according to his friend) because he insults everyone and everything; after about five minutes all I could think of was to punch him in the face.
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    Oct 14, 2009 8:11 AM GMT
    MsclDrew saidIs it just me or do guys expect other gay guys to have absolutely no self esteem what so ever....


    I swear every time you stand up to them or they think they can get somewhere by being a bitch and shooting insulting at you. They act like they have never met someone who just tolerate their crap and doesn't give a damn about what a stranger thinks.........

    and then, you have to listen to them whine about all the shit from guys they allow themselves to be taken in by

    I'm not saying that it's explicit to the gay world but it seems a whole lot more common


    Firstly, *hugs Drew*, *gets Drew a drink*
    Second, I have no idea what you are talking about, but still think you are hot.
    Third, you probably mean exclusive not explicit.
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    Oct 14, 2009 9:42 AM GMT
    zdrew saidIt's an unwritten law of internet forums. Half of us come here to whine. A quarter of us come to belittle the whiners. An eighth come to offer solutions. The rest come to interact with the whiners, belittlers, and solution-offerers. And all come to boost our self esteem or feel better about ourselves, whatever avenue we take and whatever we might need to do it.

    Or something like that.

    Damn it,if you weren't so sexy I'd sit on ya!
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19129

    Oct 14, 2009 10:15 AM GMT
    masculine31 saidlmfao...a lot of guys on here whine entirely too muchicon_lol.gif But it could be da economyicon_eek.gif


    Nope, I think it's your spelling icon_lol.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 10:58 AM GMT
    I'm just lamenting on gay men in general...

    Nothing in particular but a life time of experience that seems to indicate that when it comes to gay guys dating, everyone seems to expect you to be devoid of self esteem

    Seriously all these stories I hear some of which have happened to me where

    1. Getting hit on or asked out by guys that seem to do nothing but insult and treat the guy like dirt and guys still give them a chance and the guy is an ass and yet they still go back.

    2. Guys that are going out and all seems to be going well and the guy goes crawling straight back to an ex, that they complain about constantly.

    3. Guys that play the nice guy routine, call you bitter and jaded when you expect them to prove somewhat that they are not full of it. No judgment it happens to everyone but after about 3 times guys should learn there lesson





  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 1:33 PM GMT

    lol MsclDrew:

    1. Getting hit on or asked out by guys that seem to do nothing but insult and treat the guy like dirt and guys still give them a chance and the guy is an ass and yet they still go back.

    ....well, most gay men like ass..icon_lol.gif.

    2. Guys that are going out and all seems to be going well and the guy goes crawling straight back to an ex, that they complain about constantly.

    ...a.k.a. co-dependency.

    3. Guys that play the nice guy routine, call you bitter and jaded when you expect them to prove somewhat that they are not full of it. No judgment it happens to everyone but after about 3 times guys should learn there lesson

    ...this last one we didn't get. After 3 times of what?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 3:50 PM GMT
    Sometimes its hard to do, but I found the best way to deal with bitchy, whiny, silly people is to kill them with kindness. They are in a mindset to start trouble and when you respond assertively and with humor, they are left scratching their heads not knowing what to think.

    They may respond with more insults like "do you think you are better than everyone else".......and in many cases the reality is quite simply yes.

    People like that need attention and an apparent feeling of control they may get from getting you to engage them on their terms......HA HA.

    It actualy can be quite fun to (metaphorically speaking) hold a mirror up to the idiot and shame them into realizing how they are acting, and they will probably hate you even more for shaming them. They expected you to play their game, engage them on their terms and most people will fall into that trap. But taking the higher road always works better as a not so subtle way of reminding them that they asked for the humiliation.

    I hardly ever stoop down to the level of stupidity that many guys operate from. In this way, I walk away with a smile on my face and they are left fuming and even more miserable than before.

    Ahhhh........revenge is sweet.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Oct 14, 2009 4:27 PM GMT
    The best reaction is a non reaction.

    Granted, sometimes it's easier said than done. Even better still, agree with them, and that usually throws them for a loop.

    I remember one guy was trying to get me to argue with him, called me a name, and I said thank you. Of course that set him off, and I laughed to myself as I could tell that really got his goat, and my non reaction was getting him all vexed.

    Loser!icon_twisted.gif
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    Oct 14, 2009 4:36 PM GMT
    A lot of gay men are b*tches. Get used to it. icon_smile.gif The gay community is all about narcissism and "me me me" anyway, so is it any surprise? It's about the perfect body, tweezed and plucked, the perfect car, the perfect boyfriend, etc. It's like a long, drawn-out high school fantasy that doesn't end.

    I've found dealing with many gay men similar to dealing with adolescent boys. They don't grow up, and the attitude you describe is indicative of such people. Avoid them. In my experience, they're the majority, certainly out at bars, etc., but they don't represent every gay man. Put your energy into the guys who have grown up and become men and leave the whiny little man-boys alone.
  • NyRuinz

    Posts: 887

    Oct 14, 2009 5:46 PM GMT
    tahoejock saidA lot of gay men are b*tches. Get used to it. icon_smile.gif The gay community is all about narcissism and "me me me" anyway, so is it any surprise? It's about the perfect body, tweezed and plucked, the perfect car, the perfect boyfriend, etc. It's like a long, drawn-out high school fantasy that doesn't end.

    I've found dealing with many gay men similar to dealing with adolescent boys. They don't grow up, and the attitude you describe is indicative of such people. Avoid them. In my experience, they're the majority, certainly out at bars, etc., but they don't represent every gay man. Put your energy into the guys who have grown up and become men and leave the whiny little man-boys alone.



    Well Said icon_biggrin.gif
  • CAtoFL

    Posts: 834

    Oct 14, 2009 6:03 PM GMT
    tahoejock saidI've found dealing with many gay men similar to dealing with adolescent boys.


    I completely disagree. With the bitching, cliquishness and gossip, they're more like adolescent girls. icon_wink.gif
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    Oct 14, 2009 6:42 PM GMT
    I'm sure everyone is put off by the guy or girl that needs to put down other people in order to solidify there own self esteem. Those type of people annoy me to no end as I'm sure they do everyone reading this.

    I don't know anyone here beyond pics and text so I can't claim to know you but I recommend you take moment to look over your posts again and revisit the title of this thread. There's quite a bit of irony here no?

    Just saying.


    Peace!
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    Oct 14, 2009 7:17 PM GMT
    PSCalif said
    tahoejock saidI've found dealing with many gay men similar to dealing with adolescent boys.


    I completely disagree. With the bitching, cliquishness and gossip, they're more like adolescent girls. icon_wink.gif


    Yeah, well, I was trying to be nice. icon_smile.gif I don't really think they act like girls, though. No adolescent girl I've ever known has acted like some of the gay men I've met!
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    Oct 14, 2009 7:37 PM GMT
    tahoejock saidA lot of gay men are b*tches. Get used to it. icon_smile.gif The gay community is all about narcissism and "me me me" anyway, so is it any surprise? It's about the perfect body, tweezed and plucked, the perfect car, the perfect boyfriend, etc. It's like a long, drawn-out high school fantasy that doesn't end.

    I've found dealing with many gay men similar to dealing with adolescent boys. They don't grow up, and the attitude you describe is indicative of such people. Avoid them. In my experience, they're the majority, certainly out at bars, etc., but they don't represent every gay man. Put your energy into the guys who have grown up and become men and leave the whiny little man-boys alone.


    Agreed. Unfortunately this delayed adolescence is a big problem for the gay community. Too many gay guys have repressed themselves throughout high school, so when they're adults or middle aged they're learning what heteros learned in high school (this includes boys AND girls). And the fact many guys act like this creates an expectation that this is how gays act.

    I do think there is a place for narcissism and fantasy as a source of strength against rejection from mainstream society. They are negative personality traits but they allow many gays to survive the repression. People do need to unlearn these traits in order to move on into a more accepting social environment.

    I blame the mainstream society's fixation on sexuality as the raison d'etre for everyone. It's not and shouldn't be. Most of life's important pursuits do not involve sex. Your sexuality doesn't define you, and your gayness shouldn't define you either. This fixation on sexuality breeds narcissism in gays and heteros alike. I've heard many hetero friends complaining about the same sorts of behavior of their dates.
  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Oct 14, 2009 7:41 PM GMT
    To be fair, we have an awful lot of internalized homophobia to deal with, which effects our dealings with one another. Sort of like women in the postwar years (repressed, subjugated and obsessed with finding and keeping the perfect man. They devoured each other in order to gain supremacy). Much of our social interaction is eerily similar. We are overly competitive with each other, as in "it is not enough that I succeed. All others must fail"...
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    Oct 14, 2009 9:10 PM GMT
    jarhead5536 saidTo be fair, we have an awful lot of internalized homophobia to deal with, which effects our dealings with one another. Sort of like women in the postwar years (repressed, subjugated and obsessed with finding and keeping the perfect man. They devoured each other in order to gain supremacy). Much of our social interaction is eerily similar. We are overly competitive with each other, as in "it is not enough that I succeed. All others must fail"...


    I agree. To me,some comments on RJ or so blatantly homophobic and self destructive, as well as out in the real world. Its scary. But mention internalzed homophobia to many gay people and they will be the first ones to ridicule the idea.

    Basicaly, when you are secure in who you are, there is no need to be nasty and bitchy towards people....no need to the loudest, most critical.....the most flamboyant anything that comes at the expense of others.....In fact, you have the strenght to shrug off idiots easily and understand that peole are fallable. That's being human.

    Nobody is 100% secure all the time or perfect, but those people who are stuck in bitchy mode should take a good look at themselves in the mirror and realize that their behavior betrays how they really feel about themselves inside.

    As I mentioned earlier, I come across gay guys all the time who are nothing but idiots. In these situations, its better to not fight fire with fire. Let them set themselves on fire and self destruct.

    And I ain't going throw water on em.