Abortion

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 4:47 AM GMT
    k i've seen in a couple of other threads people saying things for abortion. Now I'm not particularly contected or knowledgeble of the gay comunity or know what the general consenses amoung gays is on any political issue that is not contacted to gayness or what ever.

    I'd like to know where people here stand on the issue. Do you see it as more of a woman's body issue? Or do you see it as more of a baby's live issue?

    --and watch the tempers icon_rolleyes.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 4:53 AM GMT
    I support a woman's right to choice over her body. A woman's mental, emotional, and physical health comes before a fetus.
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Dec 16, 2007 3:34 PM GMT
    Being a man ...
    I really don't think I should have a say in what a woman does with her body
    ..but since you asked
    pregnancy terminations like Bill Clinton said...
    Should be rare but attainable to women when they need them
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 3:57 PM GMT
    I think it is taking a life. Science views life beginning at conception. With that said, however, I am am man and I will never know what it like to be a women who made a mistake, a women who got pregant from being raped, or someone who has to choose between dying if she continues with the pregancy or having a abortion. So, while personally I think it is wrong, I think people should have the choice to choose what they want to do. Each women has to make the choice that is right for them and I dont fault them for doing so/
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    Dec 16, 2007 6:31 PM GMT
    I believe in choice, the baby's choice. Let the baby choose to live or die. the little girl's choice is just important as the mother's choice. Why should the woman's right supersede the female baby's choice, or male?


    just because people change the word baby to fetus, the name literely turn a living thing into a dead tissue. A woman has the right to choose to take the ovaries, which is a tissue, out then have sex. that's her choice. leave the choice of life to the baby.

    as for rape, if the woman has considered killing the baby via abortion, she won't have problem giving him up for adaption. the only case I see abortion is fitting is when the life of mother is threatened. And this would only account to less then 1% of all current abortion.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 9:06 PM GMT
    i've never understood that "personally opposed"

    I'm personally opposed too people getting guned down in the street

    i mean fuck if you really believed that it is the killing of a baby, then you wouldn't want to let it happen. Or are you just a little pussy, Andrecito?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 9:14 PM GMT
    I say suck that shit out with a Vacuum Cleaner. but make sure to use it in stem cell research.

    I will say I was surprised to see a vegan be pro choice. they are all about we have to help the animals who cant help themselves so it seems to be against helping the fetus who can't help itself.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 9:16 PM GMT
    ^ way to watch your temper Buff icon_rolleyes.gif

    I am opposed to abortion on an individual level because I don't think we can set a standard on when life begins. A fetus is going to become a child under most circumstances so I could never bring myself to think its only a child if it crosses a certain line.

    Politically I respect that the government has no right to interfere with a women's choice. So I am opposed to any regulation. I only hope women would themselves make the choice to birth the child and even give it away if unwanted. At the same time I do not think abortions should be covered under any kind of national health system. If you want an abortion it is your choice and not my duty to help support.
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Dec 16, 2007 9:30 PM GMT
    As a man, I can truly never know what it feels like to be pregnant and happy about it, let alone become pregnant and decide I don't want it.

    I support a woman's right to choose, but it's a fact of life that saddens me.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 9:40 PM GMT
    there was no temper involved in that. I just see an interesting juxtaposition and am intrigued as to why
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 9:46 PM GMT
    oh I just got it... Had to check definitions to be sure. Personally does imply more than it lets on lol.

    Well lets see individually works better. Changes made.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 9:51 PM GMT
    Well since I can't get pregnant or have an abortion, unless it's out my ass, I try not to have too strong of feelings towards this issue. Sometimes I see it as okay to scramble that shit up if the woman was raped or something to that effect. Then other times I see abortion as an easy escape route for those whores that fuck too much.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 9:58 PM GMT
    Because creating a new life takes both a man and a woman, it is both of their issue to come to an agreement on. When the man is MIA, yes, the woman is left to decide, but I think it is a disgrace to murder for convenience. Because there has yet to be a documented instance in which an abortion was necessary to save the mother's life (that I am aware of), I don’t buy that particular argument. Even if a link to a story is provided, how often is that the case truly and is that really the circumstance of which this debate surrounds? I think abortion is wrong. It is a life and deserves rights. I find it particularly interesting that while a woman can have an abortion, a doctor who mismanages the case of a baby at the same age is liable for the lost life. It either is a life or it isn’t. Right now the pro-abortion stance has the best of both worlds and I hope society comes to its senses. As a gay man, it doesn’t directly impact me, but as a person caring about my life and rights, I recognize a call to action to assist those who cannot stand up for themselves. Also, I am not religious, Agnostic at best, so this opinion stems from a personal sense of right and wrong, not a magic book. I have read and understand opposing arguments, in particular, Richard Dawkin’s position in the God Delusion comes to mind, and he can almost convince me.
  • NickoftheNort...

    Posts: 1416

    Dec 16, 2007 10:07 PM GMT
    I support the right to choose to terminate a pregnancy.

    My ideal conceptualization of society does not include abortions, largely because my ideal conceptualization includes major positive incentives toward choosing to not terminate pregnancies.

    Those persons who disagree with the right to choose should, in my opinion, work toward improving such positive reinforcement strategies (government child daycare, child welfare, government child health care, massive improvement of the foster care systems, et al.). Denying the right to choose is foolish and risks an undue stress upon the female portion of the population, skewed against those who lack financial resources and those who live within rigid patriarchal communities (where an unwed pregnancy can be devastating toward a woman's social ranking and opportunities).

    As for why the pregnant-woman-in-question gets to decide and the growing fetus / potential baby does not: the woman is alive and the human growing in her stomach is still only a potential human due to its parasitic dependency on her for its survival.

    I am not going to play words on the matter: as I understand the words, it is a fetus while it grows inside a human body and depends on its umbillical cord for sustenance; it is a baby once it has been pushed out of the human body and can survive following the severing of the cord.

    And yes, I will refer to a human as "it" until a gender is designated as being preferred.
    ***
    Given the Enlightenment-modern-based sentinmentality we attach to human lives in Euro-America, I strongly doubt that those who go through an abortion experience it as an easy solution. The concept of the "I'll just have an abortion" abuser comes across as more of myth or an urban legend with little factual basis; essentially, a worst-case scenario used to justify prohibiting the practice.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 10:23 PM GMT
    government daycare icon_eek.gif

    I fear for our children.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 10:46 PM GMT
    NickOfTheNorth is on a roll today! I really couldn't put it better myself so I'll just agree with him completely!

    I would also add that beware of those very emotionally appealing prebirth images of foetuses. They are indirect, manpulated, often highly misleading and need to be interpreted very very carefully.

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 10:48 PM GMT
    a case where aborition is needed to save the life of the woman: Eptopic pregnancy
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 10:50 PM GMT
    "Science views life beginning at conception."


    SEZ WHO??
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 10:50 PM GMT
    Trance--

    Children raised by Christian homeschoolers.

    (shudder) I fear for our children.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 10:52 PM GMT
    What I find most amusing is how this government seems to care so much about the "life" an embryo could eventually become into. But truth is, once that darn thing is born - they don't give a crap.

    Yet another means of distracting and disorienting the public with issues that have no substance or meaning or any sort of importance.

    Pro-choice. Get over it, move on. The issue is not that important. I promise.
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    Dec 16, 2007 11:10 PM GMT
    As long as people let a government illegally interfere with issues they will use abortion as a voting stance. And likewise those seeking office will further the damage by making promises to one side or the other.

    Abortion will always be an issue in a population where some people try and build laws based off the teachings of undead jewish zombies on a stick.

    I think my contempt is slightly showing icon_wink.gif
  • Alan95823

    Posts: 306

    Dec 16, 2007 11:16 PM GMT
    I support a woman's right to choose, but if I were a woman I don't know if I could ever choose to have an abortion.

    I used to work for a gal who had something like 6 abortions.. as much of a nutcase as she was, those 6 fetuses were better off going to the back of the line to get a more responsible parent next time around.

    (Ok, so if you don't believe in reincarnation, that probably didn't make sense, but you get the gist I'm sure.)
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 11:22 PM GMT
    But, that is my whole point. It is a means of diverging the public from issues that really matter towards some with an attached "ethical or moral" importance.

    Democrats and republicans have much overlap. Any modern political scientist would be glad to enlighten you that this is a one-party government, with two factions containing much overlap, a few differences but none to a substantial degree.

    The issues only have a veiled importance. What difference does it make if a woman terminates a pregnancy, really? What difference does it make if two men or two women marry? There is none. But the public is constantly fed an underlying sense of importance to these issues.

    Education is so poor in this country, primary and secondary schooling in particular, that any means of diverting attention by a political authority are so easily followed by the public. And it works. It works in keeping those who are in power in power.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 11:30 PM GMT
    Tool: 100% agree. We should forget so many of the sideline issues that pretend to separate what really are just all faces to the same establishment.

    Clearly the nation has lost its direction, so the only logical answer then is to ignore the small stuff and vote for returning American back to a limited government of informed citizens. Vote Ron Paul!

    Sorry couldn't resist icon_wink.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 16, 2007 11:37 PM GMT
    I am for abortion. I will not give any reason why, because it is too damn long to say, and sometimes I can confuse the hell out of people. SO if you want to know why, then please ask in an e-mail or chat. but other than that, I say pro-choice.