Ok ever since i was a child i would see people like these, individuals of a dark ethnic background...bleaching his/her skin for reasons still unclear to me. I was told however that they did this to be desired more. Being close to light -skin or white was preferred because people would accept you more. There was a thread on here the other day about "racial preference" being another way of being racist. I believe that this might be an effect of such prejudice. Now look at this individual...I always thought he was soo handsome and very attractive. But i dont know why he did this to himself....then i remember what type of society we live in. One where self worth is still measured by ones skin tone. This individual......im at a lost of words....sammy sosa....i have lost respect. In order to be more white he bleached his skin...permed his hair...and put in light brown contacts....this is the result of color picking. People need to learn to accept themselves. The aim of the thread is to explain why individuals resort to skin bleaching.
He looks like a Dominican morenazo (dark-skinned person). I love mis morenos but just like in America, there is prejudice against darker skin tones in the DR. I really do think he looks better moreno but that's just my preference. It's such a shame tho, Lil Kim has lightened her skin as well.
I'm a HUGE Cubs Fan (as you can tell by my screen name) and I really never thought about Sammy in terms of skin tone. I mean I thought he looked amazing with his dark skin, and his hair was fine too.
I don't know. I just feel like people who bleach their skin or do any kind of physically altering procedures should have to go to a therapist/psychologist first to talk it out and make sure there aren't any underlying issues that might have caused this want to radically change their appearance.
Maybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
And its no different than getting your nose changed or your breasts enlarged or your tummy tucked... its about what you feel will make you more beautiful.. and more confident...rather people who keep bringing this topic up sound to be the biggest self haters moaning about it all the time.
Rawrly saidProve that's exactly what he's trying to do before you speak for him.
wont even make a reply to this as you dont understand the history or issue behind skin bleaching...
I understand A LOT about cosmetic procedures, especially when there may be an underlying medical condition. Case in point: the face you see when you look at *my* pictures is mostly reconstructed.
I understand that people who are proud to be dark (which is beautiful, by the way) feel an issue with such things and I do understand the history behind it. You won't make a reply to it because you have no reply to it.
We can't find any good link to prove or disprove bleaching - all speculation by fans and commentators. Some are saying he has a skin mottling (discolouration) and is evening it up.
So what's with the white girls and guys in dreadlocks?
Or the white guys talking gangsta? Or the white guys dressing gangsta?
It looks like he's wearing makeup to me. He could be covering up a skin condition due to vitiligo.
I have a white and an asian friend that both wear dreadlocs. I think it's awesome and they're really deep people. I love them
Talking "gangsta" and dressing "gangsta" has become en vogue because of the charisma of black men within the hip hop culture. It's apparently "cool" to be gangsta. But being gangsta is not a black thing. It's the charisma of black men that people try to emulate more than anything IMHO.
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
He looks freaky now IMHO. He looked much better before.
Is it possible it could be the lighting reflecting off whatever lotion he has on his skin? The flash 'washes out' the color in his skin? (Pic on the left is a bright flash, on the right is a softer flash.) I don't know, I'm just trying to give the guy the benefit of the doubt....
But he looks weird, like the Wayans brothers in the movie "White Chicks".
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
We didnt say he wasn't Dominican..but from what i see.....hes a black Dominican..that better for you? Its the same as saying..black or white, Asian Jamaicans....or black white Americans...
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
HAHA.. how stupid....whats the difference? he looks black to me.. and there are blacks all over the carribbean, south america and africa.
please dont resort to name calling..its not necessary. The aim of the thread is to outline the actions of people and why they resort to skin bleaching.
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
Dominicans have roots in Africa just as the black people of the US. If he was in the US during the 1800's, he would be picking somebody's cotton. Trust that.
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
The big deal is about self acceptance. Anyone who bleaches his/her skin because they have fallen victim to society's image of beauty is sad. The same way we want our gay brother and sisters to be happy about being gay, I'd want my black counterparts to feel the same. however, I'm not so quick to believe any of these pixs. I know frm experience that my own pixs have come out shades darker than my skin tone in person and shades lighter in others. Not to mention if anyone can remember as far back as the OJ simpson scandal where it was alleged that time mag digitally shaded Oj's mugshot to make him appear more sinister and newsweek printed the same mugshot photo in it's true format. I think the only way to know is if you've seen him in person.
It's now 7:30AM Sunday morning. The sun is up and out, and it's already one big blue sky, and it's going to get up in the 30+C today, and I being so white, have to get outside very soon to do my yard work, before it gets to hot, coz then I fry, and burn, I with all my heart would like darker skin; but then so do many other people in Oz, look at all the dough people on the beach, wanting a dark crust. If I was to ever become a father, the kindest thing I could do for this child, would be to make sure it's mum was dark.
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
HAHA.. how stupid....whats the difference? he looks black to me.. and there are blacks all over the carribbean, south america and africa.
Jettsetter99:
There is a vast difference between being a Black American and a Dominican (e.g., language, culture, history, heritage, opportunity for success, et cet.). Shifty84 didn't say something "stupid" by pointing out this difference. Clearly, it's a problem because some of the less educated/cultured routinely lump individuals with dark skin into one category. Sure, our origin might be the same. And our skin color might be similar; however, what happened from circa-1650 onward varies from country to country. And those variations in history are what make us different.
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
HAHA.. how stupid....whats the difference? he looks black to me.. and there are blacks all over the carribbean, south america and africa.
Jettsetter99:
There is a vast difference between being a Black American and a Dominican (e.g., language, culture, history, heritage, opportunity for success, et cet.). Shifty84 didn't say something "stupid" by pointing out this difference. Clearly, it's a problem because some of the less educated/cultured routinely lump individuals with dark skin into one category. Sure, our origin might be the same. And our skin color might be similar; however, what happened from circa-1650 onward varies from country to country. And those variations in history are what make us different.
Saying someone is black does not signify one's national origin. Certainly across the world there are black people with countless languages, history, etc. Have you ever heard the term the black diaspora? Here's a few websites with more info:
It's sad when someone hasnt learned to love themselves,,warts and all... I'v been hated for being too black for some and not black enough for others, i can see how some might resort to bleaching or tanning even to look as they say BETTER.. you gotta love yourselves people,,because--- If you dont love yourselve, how in the hell can you love somebody else.
This is just Doug. I think this guy, being from the Caribbean could very well have mixed ancestry. Some of my relatives, since moving up here from Jamaica, look white. Put them back in Jamaica or out in the sun here for awhile and they tan darker than any white person. Their heritage becomes plainly obvious. One of my cousins mirrors those two pics of Sammy Sosa in skin colour - she's 1/4 black. In the summer she's very black, and in the winter the same lightened tone as him.
Joey, what you just pointed out with those links is interesting, and makes me wonder, with all those divergent cultures etc how is there what people keep referring to as 'black culture'? I suspect it's a US thing.
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
Dominicans have roots in Africa just as the black people of the US. If he was in the US during the 1800's, he would be picking somebody's cotton. Trust that.
AMEN,,, you better preach...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOH GLORY.......
i was watching an episode of oprah about internal racism within ones own ethnic society. she had brought onto a show an asian. and she was of Korean decent and was an american. being Korean and Japanese etc, there is a characteristic that is naturally inherited by them where if u look at their eyelids, there in most cases, there is no "fold" that defines the eyes. there is just "one layer of flat skin". so now in Korea and Japan etc, the most common cosmetic surgery that is being performed is having that eye lid skin cut and formed into a fold. having been told this information and to the suprise of many of the public, this was a perception that was emphasised within the asian community itself, and had nothing to do with racism or prejudice that was expressed through the western society. at this day and age, although racism has been overthrown in the western society, it seems that each ethnic community still has its altered perception of beauty. which of course naturally came from decades of racism. so i understand that its easy to say that the prejudices can come from a racial perception that would have been very prevalent many decades ago. however it is not right to constantly blame the western society for their passed issues, which still prevail to this day. it seems that each ethnic society hasnt let go of the racial prejudices. in short, it means that asians are being racist/prejudicial/critical of other asians. and i choose to talk about asians because i am one. and i think this story can be used as an analogy for racism within a black community.
Its nice to see that now black americans don't want to be lumped with black dominicans or other blacks around the world...and anyone who even refers DARKER| people of african origin with african features as BLACK is considered less cultured and ignorant .... wow!!!!
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
He would be considered black in any other country of the world except for America apparently.
the only episode of tyra banks i watched, she was going around black communities complaining about how they sold skin bleaching solutions there and not in predominantly white areas.. which makes sense.. but black women, and apparently men, who do it that do it of their own choice no one is telling them too.. they are just reinforcing the incorrect racial stereotype that it's better to be white than something else
lifted saidthe only episode of tyra banks i watched, she was going around black communities complaining about how they sold skin bleaching solutions there and not in predominantly white areas.. which makes sense.. but black women, and apparently men, who do it that do it of their own choice no one is telling them too.. they are just reinforcing the incorrect racial stereotype that it's better to be white than something else
Is Tyra doing the same thing in regard to how she modifies her own appearance? Her hair for example.
Jetsetter99 saidIts nice to see that now black americans don't want to be lumped with black dominicans or other blacks around the world...and anyone who even refers DARKER| people of african origin with african features as BLACK is considered less cultured and ignorant .... wow!!!!
No, that's NOT what I'm saying. I KNOW the difference between a dark skinned Dominican and between someone who is just of African descent. I, myself, am a half breed of BLACK and of DOMINICAN. Just because someone has darker skin doesn't mean they are BLACK. Trust me, I'm not ashamed of my heritages at all but they are NOT the same.
So based on your logic, this Indian boy is Black because he's dark-skinned right?
Darker Indians are from the Dravidian race, Darker Dominicans have roots in Africa. Indian races have no roots in Africa - you are an idiot. And this kid does not have AFRICAN features - the man in question whatever his name is - does have AFRICAN features - he is not just dark (black) but has clearly defined Afro features - hair, nose, jawline etc... everything. God is America really so full of dumb people???
Jetsetter99 saidIts nice to see that now black americans don't want to be lumped with black dominicans or other blacks around the world...and anyone who even refers DARKER| people of african origin with african features as BLACK is considered less cultured and ignorant .... wow!!!!
No, that's NOT what I'm saying. I KNOW the difference between a dark skinned Dominican and between someone who is just of African descent. I, myself, am a half breed of BLACK and of DOMINICAN. Just because someone has darker skin doesn't mean they are BLACK. Trust me, I'm not ashamed of my heritages at all but they are NOT the same.
So based on your logic, this Indian boy is Black because he's dark-skinned right?
You are considered black if part of your ethnicity is derived from African stock.
So yes you and Sammy Sosa and I are black. Dominican is not an ethnicity nor a race last time I checked.
I'm bored so... There are only five 'races' on Earth according to most logical scientific, anthropological societies..... Here's a chart... The names vary- but those are the basic five... before there were only three- white, asian, and black--- Dominican is NOT a 'race-' but a nationality/ethnicity. ---- Hard to believe it but... you can actually change your ethnicity by definition... "Identity with or membership in a particular racial, national, or cultural group and observance of that group's customs, beliefs, and language." ------- This topic has also been beaten to death... several times.
I never said Blacks and Dominicans both aren't from African origins. I SAID Blacks and Dominicans are NOT the same. Don't twist my words. Some people think all people of Asian descent look the same. Although they share the same origins, they are NOT the same. Have you ever confused a Chinese person as Japanese or vice versa? They get offended if you happen to do it.
Albert Pujols is Dominican as well. Would you refer to him as latino as opposed to Black simply because his skin is fairer than Sosa's?
Il_Cacasenno saidI'm bored so... There are only five 'races' on Earth according to most logical scientific, anthropological societies.....
*head explodes* Most modern science, anthropological or otherwise, recognize race to be a construct of the local society and is in no way an absolute. Your chart is a rough approximation of genetic relationships between regional genetic groups caused by geographic segregation.
Sirkit said *head explodes* Most modern science, anthropological or otherwise, recognize race to be a construct of the local society and is in no way an absolute. Your chart is a rough approximation of genetic relationships between regional genetic groups caused by geographic segregation.
Yes, some people try to hide their ethnicity with plastic surgery, tanning, bleaching, dying, perms, shaving their head, straightening their hair, wearing wigs or weaves, different colored contact lenses. Sometimes it is very unattractive, but usually it is sad. This effects many ethnicities, and usually they want to be more mainstream looking.
I guess the most widely accepted way to hide ones ethnicity is rhinoplasty.
Capital (and largest city) Santo Domingo 19°00′N 70°40′W / 19°N 70.667°W / 19; -70.667
Official languages Spanish
Ethnic groups 73% Mixed Race, 16% White, 11% Black
-----------------------------------------
READ ABOVE - 11% DOMINICANS ARE BLACKS, 73% ARE MIXED RACE AND 16% ARE WHITE. IF WIKIPEDIA CAN CLASSIFY 11% DOMINICANS ARE BLACKS THEN THIS GUY IS CERTAINLY BLACK.
I don' t care what he does to his skin. It's his business. And I'm truly sick and tired of blacks trying to turn non-racial issues into major racial events. Quit manufacturing prejudice.
Sparkycat saidI don' t care what he does to his skin. It's his business. And I'm truly sick and tired of blacks trying to turn non-racial issues into major racial events. Quit manufacturing prejudice.
I agree.. its ridiculous and gotten much worse lately...
Capital (and largest city) Santo Domingo 19°00′N 70°40′W / 19°N 70.667°W / 19; -70.667
Official languages Spanish
Ethnic groups 73% Mixed Race, 16% White, 11% Black
-----------------------------------------
READ ABOVE - 11% DOMINICANS ARE BLACKS, 73% ARE MIXED RACE AND 16% ARE WHITE. IF WIKIPEDIA CAN CLASSIFY 11% DOMINICANS ARE BLACKS THEN THIS GUY IS CERTAINLY BLACK.
Yet your source is wikipedia. If he were fully BLACK he would have less (Quisqueyano) Indian features. I'll give you that he's mixed but fully Black, no. The shape of the eyes, the grain of his hair and pigmentation of his skin say otherwise.
You're in NYC, take a trip to Spanish Harlem and Washington Heights and look at the dominicans/boricuas. Then go to Harlem and look at African-Americans (Blacks), there are distinct differences. Call a boricua or dominicano black and they will tell you they are not. Call a black person a puerto rican or dominican and the least they will do is argue with you. It's not something to be ashamed of but nobody likes to be called something they aren't.
Shifty84 saidIf he were fully BLACK he would have less (Quisqueyano) Indian features. I'll give you that he's mixed but fully Black, no. The shape of the eyes, the grain of his hair and pigmentation of his skin say otherwise.
I also don't think he looks entirely black(african) .. I would have definitely guessed mixed. I think Latin Americans and Hispanics are some of the most mixed race people.
Mexican philosopher José Vasconcelos had some interesting writings about racial mixing long ago ..
wikipediaPublished in 1925, La Raza Cósmica (The Cosmic Race) is an essay written by late Mexican philosopher, secretary of education, and 1929 presidential candidate, José Vasconcelos to express the ideology of a future "fifth race" in the Americas; an agglomeration of all the races in the world with no respect to color or number to erect a new civilization: Universópolis. As he explains in his literary work, armies of people would then go forth around the world professing their knowledge. Vasconcelos continues to say that the people of the Iberian regions of the Americas (that is to say, the parts of the continent colonised by Portugal and Spain) have the territorial, racial, and spiritual factors necessary to initiate the "universal era of humanity". As a form of futuristic race, the people would have major influences from Mongoloids (native Amerindians), Caucasians (colonizing Europeans), and Negroids (black slaves).
...
The phrase, "La raza cósmica", in English "the cosmic race", embodies the notion that traditional, exclusive concepts of race and nationality can be transcended in the name of humanity's common destiny. It originally referred to a movement by Mexican intellectuals during the 1920s[citation needed] who pointed out that Latin Americans have the blood of all the world's races (White Europeans, Asian-descended Native-Americans and Black Africans), transcending the peoples of the "old world".
I hope people realize that most black people in North America are of mixed racial ancestry, with European and indigenous heritage in addition to their African ancesry. I think black people, in general, have mostly African ancestry regardless if they are so black that they are blue or they are the highest yellow.
FYI Skin bleaching isn't exclusive to a black cultural phenomenon. Asians also do it, specifically Asian women from China, Korea, Taiwan, and the Philippines.
Dante_redux saidFYI Skin bleaching isn't exclusive to a black cultural phenomenon. Asians also do it, specifically Asian women from China, Korea, Taiwan, and the Philippines.
This is true, all of the asian skin care companies have "whitening" lines of products. I've actually used a couple to minimize freckles on my forehead.
Here is an interesting story from NPR about how race/color are not fixed .. you can listen to the audio of the story by clicking the link .. there is also an explanation as to why humans change color over time:
Your Family May Once Have Been A Different Color"Our original estimates were that [skin color changes] occurred perhaps at a more stately pace," Jablonski says. But now they're finding that a population can be one color (light or dark) and 100 generations later — with no intermarriage — be a very different color.
Figuring 25 years per generation (which is generous, since early humans walked naked through the world — clothes slow down the rate), that's an astonishingly short interval.
I think it is worthwhile to ask ourselves what skin color really means to us. We are pretty much all shades of the same color .. melanin (besides other possible issues of body chemistry). I think one of the most comforting things we can realize is how much we are all really alike .. much more alike than different.
Sparkycat saidI don' t care what he does to his skin. It's his business. And I'm truly sick and tired of blacks trying to turn non-racial issues into major racial events. Quit manufacturing prejudice.
I agree.. its ridiculous and gotten much worse lately...
And I'm sick of non-blacks, trying to discredit the racial prejudice that black American's continue to face on a daily basis. The only thing that is ridiculous is your level of ignorance. I am half Dominican and I am very much aware of the racism that exists in the Dominican culture, and I see that you live in New York City, try calling a Dominican black and see what type of response you get (it won't be pretty).
This man has straightened his hair, lightened his skin and put hazel contact lenses in his eyes you don't have to be a rocket scientist to realize he is plagued with self hatred. When you have public figures like Sammy Sosa altering his appearance to appear more European, it sends a poor message to darker skinned children who idolize him.
Since you are so sick of blacks screaming discrimination and racism, I would advise you to seek shelter under a rock, because we will continue to voice our opinions on any mistreatment that may be racially motivated, so maybe you need to "GET OVER IT".
Oh yes he is because he is sending a negative message to darker skinned youth, "if your darker than a brown paper bag you must bleach your skin", but honestly I'm over this thread because you and a few other members are really starting to remind me of Alicia Silverstone, straight "Clueless"
Oh yes he is because he is sending a negative message to darker skinned youth, "if your darker than a brown paper bag you must bleach your skin", but honestly I'm over this thread because you and a few other members are really starting to remind me of Alicia Silverstone, straight "Clueless"
The same way Paris Hilton sends out a message to young white girls - to be skinny and slutty??... and sooo many other white actors and actresses play positive or negative role models for young kids?? It all depends on the upbringing of those kids whether or not they buy into what celebrities portray.
Sirkit said *head explodes* Most modern science, anthropological or otherwise, recognize race to be a construct of the local society and is in no way an absolute. Your chart is a rough approximation of genetic relationships between regional genetic groups caused by geographic segregation.
Shifty84 saidI never said Blacks and Dominicans both aren't from African origins. I SAID Blacks and Dominicans are NOT the same. Don't twist my words. Some people think all people of Asian descent look the same. Although they share the same origins, they are NOT the same. Have you ever confused a Chinese person as Japanese or vice versa? They get offended if you happen to do it.
Albert Pujols is Dominican as well. Would you refer to him as latino as opposed to Black simply because his skin is fairer than Sosa's?
This guy is black.
Many people use the latino coinage to pretend they are not black.
Stupid if you ask me. In other parts of the world he is considered black.
Surely you know by now, that blacks come in all shapes and shades of colours
Capital (and largest city) Santo Domingo 19°00′N 70°40′W / 19°N 70.667°W / 19; -70.667
Official languages Spanish
Ethnic groups 73% Mixed Race, 16% White, 11% Black
-----------------------------------------
READ ABOVE - 11% DOMINICANS ARE BLACKS, 73% ARE MIXED RACE AND 16% ARE WHITE. IF WIKIPEDIA CAN CLASSIFY 11% DOMINICANS ARE BLACKS THEN THIS GUY IS CERTAINLY BLACK.
Yet your source is wikipedia. If he were fully BLACK he would have less (Quisqueyano) Indian features. I'll give you that he's mixed but fully Black, no. The shape of the eyes, the grain of his hair and pigmentation of his skin say otherwise.
You're in NYC, take a trip to Spanish Harlem and Washington Heights and look at the dominicans/boricuas. Then go to Harlem and look at African-Americans (Blacks), there are distinct differences. Call a boricua or dominicano black and they will tell you they are not. Call a black person a puerto rican or dominican and the least they will do is argue with you. It's not something to be ashamed of but nobody likes to be called something they aren't.
OK, I think I understand where you are coming from now.
In american there is the 1:16th rule. If you've got 1/16 drop of black blood in you: you are considered black. Now whether this is accurate or not - is another issue altogether. Over the last 10 years or so there has been a move on to create another classification for people of mixed ethnicities. Hence the term bi-racial and multi-racial eg Tiger Woods and Halle Berry and Paula Patto etc, .
So if you are arguing that these guys are not fully black, then perhaps you could be right. Certainly their feature indicate some mixing. They could be considered bi racial or multi racial here in America.
Now to your point that some dominicans do not consider themselves black. That is stupid and goes back to racism. They hope to distance themselves from blacks - who for the most part are at the bottom in American society.
Let them go to any other country and they would be considered black.
Sparkycat saidI don' t care what he does to his skin. It's his business. And I'm truly sick and tired of blacks trying to turn non-racial issues into major racial events. Quit manufacturing prejudice.
I agree.. its ridiculous and gotten much worse lately...
This remark sounds vaguely familiar... hmmmmmmm...... now where have I heard this before....
Sparkycat saidI don' t care what he does to his skin. It's his business. And I'm truly sick and tired of blacks trying to turn non-racial issues into major racial events. Quit manufacturing prejudice.
i just got back from dinner with the significant other and im shocked at how this thread turned out.....i didnt expect to have so many comments. While i commend some of you for pointing out some rather interesting concepts and researched findings...it still leaves me without answers....keep going guys....i know someone will explain to me what i seek..so far its going good.
tereseus1 saidi just got back from dinner with the significant other and im shocked at how this thread turned out.....i didnt expect to have so many comments. While i commend some of you for pointing out some rather interesting concepts and researched findings...it still leaves me without answers....keep going guys....i know someone will explain to me what i seek..so far its going good.
meninlove said This is just Doug. I think this guy, being from the Caribbean could very well have mixed ancestry. Some of my relatives, since moving up here from Jamaica, look white. Put them back in Jamaica or out in the sun here for awhile and they tan darker than any white person. Their heritage becomes plainly obvious. One of my cousins mirrors those two pics of Sammy Sosa in skin colour - she's 1/4 black. In the summer she's very black, and in the winter the same lightened tone as him.
Joey, what you just pointed out with those links is interesting, and makes me wonder, with all those divergent cultures etc how is there what people keep referring to as 'black culture'? I suspect it's a US thing.
From an African American perspective, Black culture ecompasses all the cultures that have African roots. I didn't make this up just now. If you take an African American studies class, you don't learn just about African Americans. Check out W.E.B Dubois when you have a chance.
At some point during our glorious history, leaders recognized that black people around the world suffered as a result of colonialism throughout the continent of Africa. An effort was made to unite, reconnect, recover, and emerge. A major part of black culture is this idea of unity and collective consciousness.
However, I have heard several Puerto Ricans point out that they are not black but hadn't heard a Dominican say that. Funny thing, is I've had people mistake me for being Dominican so now I'm kinda confused about how Dominicans classify themselves. I'm thinking it might have to do with the fact the Dominican Republic is a Sovereign country and they didn't feel the need to be associated with the collective effort.
tereseus1 saidPeople need to learn to accept themselves.
I don't know you from Adam so please, please, please don't take this as judgement because it's more of an observation. After I read the above sentence a second time, I went to your page to see your face and none of your photos show who you are. Why is that?
tereseus1 saidPeople need to learn to accept themselves.
I don't know you from Adam so please, please, please don't take this as judgement because it's more of an observation. After I read the above sentence a second time, I went to your page to see your face and none of your photos show who you are. Why is that?
i didnt even remember that my face shots were hidden.....
tereseus1 saidPeople need to learn to accept themselves.
I don't know you from Adam so please, please, please don't take this as judgement because it's more of an observation. After I read the above sentence a second time, I went to your page to see your face and none of your photos show who you are. Why is that?
i didnt even remember that my face shots were hidden.....
He looks freaky now IMHO. He looked much better before.
he looks like a vampire now- the silvery leather blazer doesn't help... though, to the OP, you have to keep in mind that the people who do this always seem to have awful fashion sense as well, so it may just be personal bad taste as much as social insecurities lol in any case, i wouldn't get up in arms about it- not like there's an epidemic of it, or even a rash- just some eccentric celebrities (and we all know that celebrities are the most insecure people that exist, under the glitz). as long as there are cultural trends about what is and isn't the epitome of physically attractive, you will find people trying too hard to fabricate that.
joeyveras saidIt looks like he's wearing makeup to me. He could be covering up a skin condition due to vitiligo.
I agree. We have a news caster here in michigan that hid that for years and would go as far as to cover himself in brown paint so no one would notice he was turning white.
I think its stupid of anyone to assume that they really know whats going on in the life of a celebrity. Ma ny of us can't even tell you whats going on in the lives of our family and friends, let along someone whom our relationship is with is through tv appearances and magazines.
But should any of these celebrities really be bleaching their skin, I don't see the big deal. Its their body, and their right.
Just as its your right to like men and go out and seek them.
Someone can argue that you do it out of prejudice towards woman. Some may argue that underlining psychological reasons have led you to not find woman attractive and thus you should go seek help before you even kiss another man, but its not going to stop you from doing what makes you happy.
Capital (and largest city) Santo Domingo 19°00′N 70°40′W / 19°N 70.667°W / 19; -70.667
Official languages Spanish
Ethnic groups 73% Mixed Race, 16% White, 11% Black
-----------------------------------------
READ ABOVE - 11% DOMINICANS ARE BLACKS, 73% ARE MIXED RACE AND 16% ARE WHITE. IF WIKIPEDIA CAN CLASSIFY 11% DOMINICANS ARE BLACKS THEN THIS GUY IS CERTAINLY BLACK.
To begin any self respecting researcher will tell you that Wikipedia is an inefficient source of gathering data.
With that being said, you are trying to define an area via your own social constructs rather than their own. The beautiful thing about the Republica Dominicana and Puerto Rica is that if you are born there, then you are from there. I've met many men from all over the world thanks to being in the military and i'll tell you what, people from that area come in all shapes and sizes and all colors. And when I meet a guy puerto rican rather he is brown, peach toned, or tan, he will tell you he is puerto rican. A dominican guy will tell you he is dominican.
I think a lot of what we're discussing here has to do with nuance more than anything. At the turn of the 20th century, there was strong debate in european society as to whether an african woman could be considered beautiful or whether her distinctly "negroid" (their words not mine) features made that fact an impossibility (see: Hottentot Venus). Now, I think part of this comes from communities who have internalized this mentality and champion fairer skin.
But we also can't put the blame 100% on colonialism and racism for this (although they are HUGE factors) for this. For example the indian Caste system shows that people certain castes fit into certain skin colour archetypes. The highest castes then are also the whitest, so white skin comes to be associated with godliness or closeness to a deity, wealth, power, etc.. I think we can also do the same thing with depictions of christ and how the colour white in religious iconography suggests white=holy, black = devil. Or even in traditional societies where light from the sun takes on significance against the dark, predatory night.
I guess what I'm getting at (and I apologize for the essay post) is that there's more to cultural perceptions of light and dark than just racism. There's a whole cultural discourse regarding the subject that I think could use greater study.
In regards to Sammy Sosa, I don't know him nor can I claim to speak for him. For all I know, it could just be steroid use has caused a pigment disorder and he takes medication to even out his complexion like MJ did.
Shifty84 saidI never said Blacks and Dominicans both aren't from African origins. I SAID Blacks and Dominicans are NOT the same. Don't twist my words. Some people think all people of Asian descent look the same. Although they share the same origins, they are NOT the same. Have you ever confused a Chinese person as Japanese or vice versa? They get offended if you happen to do it.
Albert Pujols is Dominican as well. Would you refer to him as latino as opposed to Black simply because his skin is fairer than Sosa's?
This isn't about confusing an African American with a Dominican or a Nigerian with an Ethiopian. This is referring to a Dominican as black which only defines the person as having African roots. It's not a negative term and it does not hint that anyone is referring to him as African American. Chinese and Japanese people are ethnically different but they are both Asian.
Jetsetter99 saidDarker Indians are from the Dravidian race, Darker Dominicans have roots in Africa. Indian races have no roots in Africa - you are an idiot. And this kid does not have AFRICAN features - the man in question whatever his name is - does have AFRICAN features - he is not just dark (black) but has clearly defined Afro features - hair, nose, jawline etc... everything. God is America really so full of dumb people???
Wow guy, you are the true idiot considering the fact that India has numerous roots from Africa. And guess what so do you. Anthropologically speaking, all human beings share DNA straight from africa. Meaning if you trace your roots back, at some point you will wind up in Africa. Believe it or not, the people that would be closest to the first migrations out of Africa would be Asia and India and the middle east. So to say that Indians have no roots in africa is just a complete falicy and its dissapointing to hear you butcher years of scientific research and holistic endeavor just to try to prove a point that you are not fully grasping yourself.
Once the silk road was put into place, You'll find that india will begin to trade and mix with numerous cultures. Especially cultures from the middle east and Asia. Why they don't consider this in their own self defining terms? Because many of them do not know it just like how you don't know that they have roots in africa.
Its ok though, many people make such mistakes. Take hitler for instance, who consider his people to be the perfect example of the aryan race, blond hair, blue eyes etc. That wasn't aryan at all. The incredible Aryan race was in fact indian!
Oh yes he is because he is sending a negative message to darker skinned youth, "if your darker than a brown paper bag you must bleach your skin", but honestly I'm over this thread because you and a few other members are really starting to remind me of Alicia Silverstone, straight "Clueless"
God this thread is so annoying! Dude if you allow yourself or your children to be socialized by celebrities then that is just sad. Where are your parents at telling you that you don't need to bleach your skin? You don't need a fucking athlete to tell you that.
If I allowed myself to be socialized by tv and looked to a bunch of strangers that shared my race for guidance, I would've been shooting people in the 90s, mistreating "bitches", and would've been getting drunk and smoking weed. But that was "Black" television when I was growing up.
Needless to say, I don't need wealthy people to pave the way for me and tell me what I should be or shouldn't. Neither should you.
He is not mistreating anyone. Assuming if he did bleach his skin, he is simply doing what makes him happy. Even though no one here can prove that he did and thus I feel stupid now because I question why am I even entertaining this.
Sparkycat saidI don' t care what he does to his skin. It's his business. And I'm truly sick and tired of blacks trying to turn non-racial issues into major racial events. Quit manufacturing prejudice.
I agree.. its ridiculous and gotten much worse lately...
And I'm sick of non-blacks, trying to discredit the racial prejudice that black American's continue to face on a daily basis. The only thing that is ridiculous is your level of ignorance. I am half Dominican and I am very much aware of the racism that exists in the Dominican culture, and I see that you live in New York City, try calling a Dominican black and see what type of response you get (it won't be pretty).
This man has straightened his hair, lightened his skin and put hazel contact lenses in his eyes you don't have to be a rocket scientist to realize he is plagued with self hatred. When you have public figures like Sammy Sosa altering his appearance to appear more European, it sends a poor message to darker skinned children who idolize him.
Since you are so sick of blacks screaming discrimination and racism, I would advise you to seek shelter under a rock, because we will continue to voice our opinions on any mistreatment that may be racially motivated, so maybe you need to "GET OVER IT".
I can easily see a scenario where he develops this skin condition, tries to cover it with makeup, and uses contacts so his eyes don't appear black and demonic. He's always had pretty straight hair so....I can also see a scenario where's totally comortable with his skin condition in his personal life but not when making public appearances. Do you think I'm discrediting racial prejudice or am I just being open minded?
We shouldn't look so much into the messages that famous people supposedly convey. They're just people like anyone else. We need to stop looking at celebrities as messengers.
Color does have a huge impact. Although some African-Americans are highly sensitized to issues of race and sometimes this can be problematic, I believe that many Caucasian Americans are actually phobic about talking about race which is more of a problem. Race may be more of a social construct than anything rooted in biology, but it has a huge impact on the social lives of people. Just as those persons with perceived beauty get preferential treatment in the social worlds of work and play (men who are perceived as good-looking are also perceived as smarter without any evidence), those who are lighter skinned and of African descent get preferential treatment based on skin color within and outside the African American communities. I have a bias against altering one's body in a major way for cosmetic reasons, but don't want to deny anyone's right to do so.
Jetsetter99 saidDarker Indians are from the Dravidian race, Darker Dominicans have roots in Africa. Indian races have no roots in Africa - you are an idiot. And this kid does not have AFRICAN features - the man in question whatever his name is - does have AFRICAN features - he is not just dark (black) but has clearly defined Afro features - hair, nose, jawline etc... everything. God is America really so full of dumb people???
Wow guy, you are the true idiot considering the fact that India has numerous roots from Africa. And guess what so do you. Anthropologically speaking, all human beings share DNA straight from africa. Meaning if you trace your roots back, at some point you will wind up in Africa. Believe it or not, the people that would be closest to the first migrations out of Africa would be Asia and India and the middle east. So to say that Indians have no roots in africa is just a complete falicy and its dissapointing to hear you butcher years of scientific research and holistic endeavor just to try to prove a point that you are not fully grasping yourself.
You're right about science finding that all roots lead to Africa but so far the hypothesis is that these nomadic tribes evolved once settling in their new territories around the world. This is how we get varying DNA and physical features, which is where the race classifications are made. Just for accuracy's sake.
If I could offer some words of progress to everyone, we are reaching a time where more people are choosing to be called bi-racial and slowly moving to an era where it isn't a big issue. If you spend time around kids a little bit, you'll be amazed at how far we've come. Seriously.
Fountains saidI think a lot of what we're discussing here has to do with nuance more than anything. At the turn of the 20th century, there was strong debate in european society as to whether an african woman could be considered beautiful or whether her distinctly "negroid" (their words not mine) features made that fact an impossibility (see: Hottentot Venus). Now, I think part of this comes from communities who have internalized this mentality and champion fairer skin.
But we also can't put the blame 100% on colonialism and racism for this (although they are HUGE factors) for this. For example the indian Caste system shows that people certain castes fit into certain skin colour archetypes. The highest castes then are also the whitest, so white skin comes to be associated with godliness or closeness to a deity, wealth, power, etc.. I think we can also do the same thing with depictions of christ and how the colour white in religious iconography suggests white=holy, black = devil. Or even in traditional societies where light from the sun takes on significance against the dark, predatory night.
I guess what I'm getting at (and I apologize for the essay post) is that there's more to cultural perceptions of light and dark than just racism. There's a whole cultural discourse regarding the subject that I think could use greater study.
In regards to Sammy Sosa, I don't know him nor can I claim to speak for him. For all I know, it could just be steroid use has caused a pigment disorder and he takes medication to even out his complexion like MJ did.
Actually from this your essay - all that you have proved is that having the right color/light is very much part of racism. Ingrained in many cultures.
The white Jesus The lighter color in the Indian caste system White = Holy Black = Devil India also has a colonialism past
How come on a lot of sites i.e. manhunt, real jock, etc, black men and other "less sought out racial ethnicities" use black & white photos or white out with extra contrast their photos so people cannot tell they are black? They put "ask me" as their ethnicity.
Why do they result to photo altering?
you forgot everyones favorite pop hero:
People get tons of plastic surgery. Why do women get their breasts enlarged?
onstagebuffnaked saidHow come on a lot of sites i.e. manhunt, real jock, etc, black men and other "less sought out racial ethnicities" use black & white photos or white out with extra contrast their photos so people cannot tell they are black? They put "ask me" as their ethnicity.
Why do they result to photo altering?
?
Because they do not want to be dismissed automatically. without being given the minimum of a chance
onstagebuffnaked saidHow come on a lot of sites i.e. manhunt, real jock, etc, black men and other "less sought out racial ethnicities" use black & white photos or white out with extra contrast their photos so people cannot tell they are black? They put "ask me" as their ethnicity.
Why do they result to photo altering?
?
Because they do not want to be dismissed automatically. without being given the minimum of a chance
That the same as lying about one's age? Once you know the truth, you know what you prefer, anyone get dismissed.
Light and dark. White and black. Hero and villain. Good and evil.
When you meet an Asian guy you don't call him a "yellow" guy.
When you meet an Indian guy you don't call him a "brown" guy.
When you meet a Native American guy you don't call him a "red" guy.
So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)? It's because the words black and white have immovable and unchangeable stigmas attached to them. So it should be no surprise that here, in the USA, where every one refers to Caucasians as white and to Africans as black, people also maintain an inherent predisposition to those that are called white when compared to those that are called black. Because who wouldn't prefer the "good" guy over the "bad" guy, right?
It's all just speculation on my part but it is a pretty obvious observation to make.
Shifty84 saidI never said Blacks and Dominicans both aren't from African origins. I SAID Blacks and Dominicans are NOT the same. Don't twist my words. Some people think all people of Asian descent look the same. Although they share the same origins, they are NOT the same. Have you ever confused a Chinese person as Japanese or vice versa? They get offended if you happen to do it.
Albert Pujols is Dominican as well. Would you refer to him as latino as opposed to Black simply because his skin is fairer than Sosa's?
This isn't about confusing an African American with a Dominican or a Nigerian with an Ethiopian. This is referring to a Dominican as black which only defines the person as having African roots. It's not a negative term and it does not hint that anyone is referring to him as African American. Chinese and Japanese people are ethnically different but they are both Asian.
Albert Pujols is a brother.
It is what I have said before. black and mixed Dominicans refer to themselves as Dominicans and not black because of one simple factor - blacks are perceived as being on the bottom rung.
Do 100% pure white Dominicans refer to themselves as Dominicans or as white?
Once I post a topic "Asian dont find Asian attractive, Black dont find black attractive", But I got a response like , it individual preferences, difficult to answer, a silly posting and etc. The truth is most non white people have a highly inferiority complex, deep inside wishing they are a white, they wish they have narrow and higher nose, . They want to look like Brad Pitt or other white movie star. They dont want to date non white people especially their own kind.
Skin bleaching, skin lightening cream, are no 1 cosmetic best seller in most Asian country. For those white guys, just be thankful you dont have to go thru the hell , we unfortunate people who are born darker and tan with thicker lips and slanted eyes.
Joeyvoyeras said, "In the good ole USA, you would be considered Black but you'd be referred to as someone who is "passing".
Shit gets deep haha!"
Oh gorsh....I wonder what it is I'm passing? A street sign? A driver on the right? A kidney stone? lol....oh well...
Well, I didn't really want to take the thread down this dark road but passing refers to passing for white. It goes back to slavery days when lighter skinned slaves were treated better than darker skinned slaves. If you didn't appear black at all, then you had the ability to "pass" for white and avoid being a slave.
Joeyvoyeras said, "In the good ole USA, you would be considered Black but you'd be referred to as someone who is "passing".
Shit gets deep haha!"
Oh gorsh....I wonder what it is I'm passing? A street sign? A driver on the right? A kidney stone? lol....oh well...
Well, I didn't really want to take the thread down this dark road but passing refers to passing for white. It goes back to slavery days when lighter skinned slaves were treated better than darker skinned slaves. If you didn't appear black at all, then you had the ability to "pass" for white and avoid being a slave.
RyanReBoRn saidLight and dark. White and black. Hero and villain. Good and evil.
When you meet an Asian guy you don't call him a "yellow" guy.
When you meet an Indian guy you don't call him a "brown" guy.
When you meet a Native American guy you don't call him a "red" guy.
So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)? It's because the words black and white have immovable and unchangeable stigmas attached to them. So it should be no surprise that here, in the USA, where every one refers to Caucasians as white and to Africans as black, people also maintain an inherent predisposition to those that are called white when compared to those that are called black. Because who wouldn't prefer the "good" guy over the "bad" guy, right?
It's all just speculation on my part but it is a pretty obvious observation to make.
Wow, so white is "good" and black is "bad". Look at the bigger picture dude, as humans we classify. You hit the nail on the head, white, black, Asian, Native American, Indian, gay, straight - are all ways we classify people. EVERYONE uses those terms. An Indian says, "He's black," a Jew says, "He's Christian," a Native American says, "He is WHITE."
I know plenty of blacks who want to be called black. They are not from Africa, they are not African American. I am Hungarian and a lot of other things, but I am not Hungarian-Italian-French-Bohemian-German-Native American-American. So like Jetsetter99 said, "rather people who keep bringing this topic up sound to be the biggest self haters moaning about it all the time."
Shifty84 saidI never said Blacks and Dominicans both aren't from African origins. I SAID Blacks and Dominicans are NOT the same. Don't twist my words. Some people think all people of Asian descent look the same. Although they share the same origins, they are NOT the same. Have you ever confused a Chinese person as Japanese or vice versa? They get offended if you happen to do it.
Albert Pujols is Dominican as well. Would you refer to him as latino as opposed to Black simply because his skin is fairer than Sosa's?
This isn't about confusing an African American with a Dominican or a Nigerian with an Ethiopian. This is referring to a Dominican as black which only defines the person as having African roots. It's not a negative term and it does not hint that anyone is referring to him as African American. Chinese and Japanese people are ethnically different but they are both Asian.
Albert Pujols is a brother.
It is what I have said before. black and mixed Dominicans refer to themselves as Dominicans and not black because of one simple factor - blacks are perceived as being on the bottom rung.
Do 100% pure white Dominicans refer to themselves as Dominicans or as white?
Yeah, I figured as much but if it was as easy as just denying it then any ethnicity can claim whatever race they choose. I realize that some see the word black as a negative term but I don't. Black is the only color that embodies all colors in the spectrum. Consdering it's the color of the original man, it seems quite symbolic to me.
Shifty84 saidI never said Blacks and Dominicans both aren't from African origins. I SAID Blacks and Dominicans are NOT the same. Don't twist my words. Some people think all people of Asian descent look the same. Although they share the same origins, they are NOT the same. Have you ever confused a Chinese person as Japanese or vice versa? They get offended if you happen to do it.
Albert Pujols is Dominican as well. Would you refer to him as latino as opposed to Black simply because his skin is fairer than Sosa's?
This isn't about confusing an African American with a Dominican or a Nigerian with an Ethiopian. This is referring to a Dominican as black which only defines the person as having African roots. It's not a negative term and it does not hint that anyone is referring to him as African American. Chinese and Japanese people are ethnically different but they are both Asian.
Albert Pujols is a brother.
It is what I have said before. black and mixed Dominicans refer to themselves as Dominicans and not black because of one simple factor - blacks are perceived as being on the bottom rung.
Do 100% pure white Dominicans refer to themselves as Dominicans or as white?
Yeah, I figured as much but if it was as easy as just denying it then any ethnicity can claim whatever race they choose. I realize that some see the word black as a negative term but I don't. Black is the only color that embodies all colors in the spectrum. Consdering it's the color of the original man, it seems quite symbolic to me.
Well it can me done here in America. Only in America is there this preponderance on racial classification. I hope it doesn't spread to other parts of the world like the rest of the bad aspects of our culture.
I'm always amused by guys who introduce themselves as Germans and Italians here. The funny thing - none of them speak German or Italian and none of them have even ever left NYC. They too are doing something similar to what negroid dominicans are doing. All a form of insecurity methinks
"For several years after Haiti won independence from the French in a bloody 13-year war, it disputed with France and Spain over control of the Western part of the island. The Spanish prevailed but a few weeks after Dominicans first declared independence in 1821, President Boyer of Haiti conquered the eastern side of the island and began an occupation that lasted until 1844. A largely bloodless uprising led by the romantic philosopher Juan Pablo Duarte succeeded in ousting the Haitians on February 27. Today Dominicans celebrate as this as Independence Day.
Partly in reaction to Haiti’s role in its history, Dominican leaders have often promoted Spanish cultural identity, along with occasional pride in Indian ancestry, although few traces of the indigenous culture actually remain in the country, all in order to dispel ideas of any African/Haitian heritage. Color and class stratification run together in great measure, with the traditional economic elite largely white, and widespread popular color prejudice of the sort that finds its way into everyday language calling hair "fine" or "bad."
RyanReBoRn saidLight and dark. White and black. Hero and villain. Good and evil.
When you meet an Asian guy you don't call him a "yellow" guy.
When you meet an Indian guy you don't call him a "brown" guy.
When you meet a Native American guy you don't call him a "red" guy.
So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)? It's because the words black and white have immovable and unchangeable stigmas attached to them. So it should be no surprise that here, in the USA, where every one refers to Caucasians as white and to Africans as black, people also maintain an inherent predisposition to those that are called white when compared to those that are called black. Because who wouldn't prefer the "good" guy over the "bad" guy, right?
It's all just speculation on my part but it is a pretty obvious observation to make.
Wow, so white is "good" and black is "bad". Look at the bigger picture dude, as humans we classify. You hit the nail on the head, white, black, Asian, Native American, Indian, gay, straight - are all ways we classify people. EVERYONE uses those terms. An Indian says, "He's black," a Jew says, "He's Christian," a Native American says, "He is WHITE."
I know plenty of blacks who want to be called black. They are not from Africa, they are not African American. I am Hungarian and a lot of other things, but I am not Hungarian-Italian-French-Bohemian-German-Native American-American. So like Jetsetter99 said, "rather people who keep bringing this topic up sound to be the biggest self haters moaning about it all the time."
You seem to have missed the point of my post. Allow me to reiterate it for you.
"So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)?"
Just because you know "plenty" of Africans (ie: people who's lineage stems from the continent of Africa) that want to be called black doesn't mean there isn't an equal number that would prefer to be called by a more accurate label.
Well it's certainly interesting to see what US blacks call my mixed racedness.
But then there's this, guys - I'm also part Chinese, East Indian and even have some Arawak. That and the 'fruit flavor' (hahaha) makes for an interesting mix, says Bill.
So am I a WhiBlaChinIndawak?
-Doug ..... and what race should I try look like to be correct and set a proper example? Any one that I pick will have people screaming that I'm prejudiced or full of self loathing about the others.
meninlove said Well it's certainly interesting to see what US blacks call my mixed racedness.
But then there's this, guys - I'm also part Chinese, East Indian and even have some Arawak. That and the 'fruit flavor' (hahaha) makes for an interesting mix, says Bill.
So am I a WhiBlaChinIndawak?
-Doug ..... and what race should I try look like to be correct and set a proper example? Any one that I pick will have people screaming that I'm prejudiced or full of self loathing about the others.
HELP!!!
Well since you asked so nicely.
How obvious are all of these different ethnicities in you?
I wouldn't worry about it. Call yourself whatever you want. Bi-racial - multi-racial. Whatever you are comfortable with.
If your country does not have this preponderance on race as we have here in America, where even job application forms ask for this data - then live your life as you see fit.
I've always disliked simplistic skin color terms for people. I've never seen a truly white person in my life, not even in an Albino, someone who lacks skin pigmentation. Genuinely ebony black skin is not too common, either, just in a few places in Africa. I've spent time on Native American reservations in the US and never seen a "Red Man" and I have no idea how Asians got tagged as being yellow. Those on the Indian subcontinent are supposedly brown, but I've seen blondes on a South Florida beach who are darker.
Somebody in the past was seeing with eyes more subtle to color hues than I can, one dubious ability I am happy to lack. Or else seeing with the eyes of cultural bias, another talent I can do without.
With world populations increasingly intermingling thanks to modern travel, I can easily imagine skin coloration differences minimizing over time, leveling & equalizing as it were, along with other physical traits we use to distinguish the concept we call race. Humans will look much more "homogenized" and that will likely be a good thing, insofar as it hopefully would reduce discrimination & prejudice, leveling the playing field for everyone.
Yet I can also see how some would wish differences to be preserved, in the same way the loss of identifying cultures and languages is opposed, or species to become extinct. In a logical sense I see the advantage of speaking a single universal language, for instance, to end the Tower of Babel confusion & inefficiency we have today. Others, however, say all these languages are treasures to be preserved. I dunno, our differences seem to be both our human heritage and our curse, with skin color being just one of them.
Thanks Blackguy4you...I had a couple of pissed off gays in Vancouver refer to me as that chinaman. I've had another call me a jigaboo (summer when the too easy tan becomes obvious). This is very minor for me, and isolated.Canadian people are pretty color blind.
Obvious? lol, the squinty eyes, the 'shelf' (and I know you know what I mean by that - Bill loves it) the too easy tan that Bill says can happen in the shade - no tanning for me - basal skin carcinoma - ongoing.
The tan itself, which looks an odd reddish bronze (the Arawak?).
That said, Canada is very different than the US. It's against the law to ask race questions on job apps. JP Morgan got around it by asking and declaring it was only for 'equal opportunity' quota verification. I reported them anyway. What a nuts job interview that was, lol!
meninlove said Well it's certainly interesting to see what US blacks call my mixed racedness.
But then there's this, guys - I'm also part Chinese, East Indian and even have some Arawak. That and the 'fruit flavor' (hahaha) makes for an interesting mix, says Bill.
So am I a WhiBlaChinIndawak?
-Doug ..... and what race should I try look like to be correct and set a proper example? Any one that I pick will have people screaming that I'm prejudiced or full of self loathing about the others.
HELP!!!
im shocked you typed part Arawak..i thought they were way all destroyed way before the British colonized jamaica.....
meninlove said...I had a couple of pissed off gays in Vancouver refer to me as that chinaman. I've had another call me a jigaboo (summer when the too easy tan becomes obvious). This is very minor for me, and isolated.Canadian people are pretty color blind... -Doug
You mean you're both NOT French fur trappers, plying your trade near modern Vancouver???
(Sorry, I just couldn't resist using that silly clip with you guys one more time)
meninlove said Thanks Blackguy4you...I had a couple of pissed off gays in Vancouver refer to me as that chinaman. I've had another call me a jigaboo (summer when the too easy tan becomes obvious). This is very minor for me, and isolated.Canadian people are pretty color blind.
Obvious? lol, the squinty eyes, the 'shelf' (and I know you know what I mean by that - Bill loves it) the too easy tan that Bill says can happen in the shade - no tanning for me - basal skin carcinoma - ongoing.
The tan itself, which looks an odd reddish bronze (the Arawak?).
That said, Canada is very different than the US. It's against the law to ask race questions on job apps. JP Morgan got around it by asking and declaring it was only for 'equal opportunity' quota verification. I reported them anyway. What a nuts job interview that was, lol! -Doug
LOL- the shelf & jigaboo - HAHAHAHA- Haven't heard those terms for a long while.
Most countries are different from the USA in this respect. In most other countries - it's black, white, indian and asian and the matter is put to rest. But of course you will always find the one or two exceptions in any society
This preponderance on racial classification here can someone times be annoying and sometimes interesting.
That's why I love some parts of the Caribbean. As soon as I win the lotto I'm moving there. I'm gonna buy an island and invite only men who are not ashamed to wear speedos.
But I still cannot figure out why guys who have never left Brooklyn and speak not one word of Italian- call themselves Italians.... you are Americans - damnit!!!!!
I love that as gay men, we feel comfortable looking at a picture of someone, deciding who they are, what they stand for, what they did or didn't "do" then crafting elaborate statements about how all of the above affect YOU.
In doing so you've not only managed to make something that is none of your business into an issue, but you've managed to use all of your assumptions to build a case for it to be a race issue.
I urge you, before you open your mouth, to think about whether or not what you are about to say would stand up in a court of law if you were sued for slander/ libel. If it would not stand up then it's not factual information and there is a "cost" for brandishing it as the truth.
The fact of the matter is if you want to find out why a black person would bleach their skin you need to find someone who does it or wants to do it and ask them why directly. If mediatakeout.com is a source you feel good about citing for medical information on sammy sosa then you've got bigger fish to fry my friend.
Make sure that as we ask for equality out of one side of our mouths that the other side isn't drooling ignorance. In the meantime there are real fights out there that deserve our time and effort. We'll have plenty of time to decide who's what kind of black-chinese after we've banded together to secure our fair share of equal rights.
My late father was more racially aware & sensitive in the 1950s than I once gave him credit for, until years later when he told me some things, that matched my memories from that time. I've told this story here before, but it still makes me proud of him to relate it again, even if it has a bit of the "some of my best friends are Jewish" quality to it. Just keep in mind this was the USA in the 1950s, when Black civil rights was a flashpoint and still opposed by a majority of voters.
My father would sometimes take me to one of his Acme supermarkets in the US Northeast, to spend the whole day there with him when I was very young, about 5 through 8, and less often after that until about 13. Essentially babysitting me because my mother had her own professional & elective career (an exceptional thing itself for a woman back then), he'd take me for a lunch break with him, at one of the blue-collar lunch counter diners he loved so much.
And the places we went were owned by Blacks. Not a single white customer was to be seen, just us, typical of the total color separation of that era. And everyone there called my father by his first name, and mine, too, everybody on terms of perfect equality (though as a child I conformed to "Sir" and "M'am" with all adults, would never dare call them by their first names, regardless of color).
They used no "Mister Steve" with my father, no "Master Robert" with me, none of that crap still common then. And the genuine joy they showed when my father came in, and the easy & unpretentious manner he had with everyone, employees & customers alike, are lessons I still haven't fully mastered myself in any of my own social dealings.
Years later my dad told me all that had been deliberately done with me. Not those aspects of his own behavior, which were natural and genuine. Rather, he chose to take me to those places to teach me subtle lessons about race, and did other similar things for me as well, at a time when I was beginning to see terrible scenes of racial violence on TV from the Deep South. And knowing that I still had never met any Black children in my school, or anywhere else in our wealthy all-White community.
Today it sounds like simplistic & patronizing stuff, almost laughable. That any White father did that with his son in 1954 nevertheless remains to my mind a remarkable tribute to my late dad. I miss him very much, wish he was still here to guide me by his example.
Red_Vespa saidMy late father was more racially aware & sensitive in the 1950s than I once gave him credit for, until years later when he told me some things, that matched my memories from that time. I've told this story here before, but it still makes me proud of him to relate it again, even if it has a bit of the "some of my best friends are Jewish" quality to it. Just keep in mind this was the USA in the 1950s, when Black civil rights was a flashpoint and still opposed by a majority of voters.
My father would sometimes take me to one of his Acme supermarkets in the US Northeast, to spend the whole day there with him when I was very young, about 5 through 8, and less often after that until about 13. Essentially babysitting me because my mother had her own professional & elective career (an exceptional thing itself for a woman back then), he'd take me for a lunch break with him, at one of the blue-collar lunch counter diners he loved so much.
And the places we went were owned by Blacks. Not a single white customer was to be seen, just us, typical of the total color separation of that era. And everyone there called my father by his first name, and mine, too, everybody on terms of perfect equality (though as a child I conformed to "Sir" and "M'am" with all adults, would never dare call them by their first names, regardless of color).
They used no "Mister Steve" with my father, no "Master Robert" with me, none of that crap still common then. And the genuine joy they showed when my father came in, and the easy & unpretentious manner he had with everyone, employees & customers alike, are lessons I still haven't fully mastered myself in any of my own social dealings.
Years later my dad told me all that had been deliberately done with me. Not those aspects of his own behavior, which were natural and genuine. Rather, he chose to take me to those places to teach me subtle lessons about race, and did other similar things for me as well, at a time when I was beginning to see terrible scenes of racial violence on TV from the Deep South. And knowing that I still had never met any Black children in my school, or anywhere else in our wealthy all-White community.
Today it sounds like simplistic & patronizing stuff, almost laughable. That any White father did that with his son in 1954 is to my mind a remarkable tribute to my late dad. I miss him very much, wish he was still here to guide me by his example.
A shame there aren't/weren't more fathers like yours
RyanReBoRn saidLight and dark. White and black. Hero and villain. Good and evil.
When you meet an Asian guy you don't call him a "yellow" guy.
When you meet an Indian guy you don't call him a "brown" guy.
When you meet a Native American guy you don't call him a "red" guy.
So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)? It's because the words black and white have immovable and unchangeable stigmas attached to them. So it should be no surprise that here, in the USA, where every one refers to Caucasians as white and to Africans as black, people also maintain an inherent predisposition to those that are called white when compared to those that are called black. Because who wouldn't prefer the "good" guy over the "bad" guy, right?
It's all just speculation on my part but it is a pretty obvious observation to make.
Wow, so white is "good" and black is "bad". Look at the bigger picture dude, as humans we classify. You hit the nail on the head, white, black, Asian, Native American, Indian, gay, straight - are all ways we classify people. EVERYONE uses those terms. An Indian says, "He's black," a Jew says, "He's Christian," a Native American says, "He is WHITE."
I know plenty of blacks who want to be called black. They are not from Africa, they are not African American. I am Hungarian and a lot of other things, but I am not Hungarian-Italian-French-Bohemian-German-Native American-American. So like Jetsetter99 said, "rather people who keep bringing this topic up sound to be the biggest self haters moaning about it all the time."
You seem to have missed the point of my post. Allow me to reiterate it for you.
"So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)?"
Just because you know "plenty" of Africans (ie: people who's lineage stems from the continent of Africa) that want to be called black doesn't mean there isn't an equal number that would prefer to be called by a more accurate label.
I'm happy being called white. I don't see a problem. (Might be because i'm the "good" guy.) I don't know any black people who have a problem being called black.
Your post is subjectively racist. Why African - Americans? Boo hoo. I must know some pretty progressive black people because they dont have the same argument you do. You're referring specifically to color. If you want to get technical with the rainbow, I have seen some black people - so they must be black, not everyone is that dark, just like Caucasian people come in all shades of white and yellows and red.
Tell me 2 things. 1.Have you ever told a racial joke? Redneck, Blonde (which refers to a hair color that cannot be absolute either, yet classifies 'intelligence'), Jewish, White, Asian? I'm sure you haven't nor used any words to classify people. So politically correct. Now God forbid a white guy steal your ipod when you're walking through campus @ Texas A&M. What are you going to tell the police? A Guy did it. ...Let me get out a Sherwin Williams paint swab book so you can pick his color.
2. What should we call you, specifically? Guy? If were at a bar and there are 132 people there, you're the only "b" guy. My friend from Alaska thinks your cute, I know everyone at this bar tonight, he wants to know who you are. Everyone is in togas, it's a Greek (oh a classification word) party. How would he get me to tell you who you are, without saying the "b" word.
Sparkycat saidI don' t care what he does to his skin. It's his business. And I'm truly sick and tired of blacks trying to turn non-racial issues into major racial events. Quit manufacturing prejudice.
As Nicely as I can. I must say that you being truly sick and tired of what you think blacks are trying to do is typical. Of course you don't care, it effects you in know way. If you took the time to think of what racism has done internally for blacks, gays and anyone else who's had the privilege of being disliked, unaccepted, harassed or ostracized you'd give a damn. While I might not be so quick to judge, I will say that any image that might have some influence on a child and there perception of selfworth which could be potentially damaging is worth concern. The same way many gay men and women hide who they are sexually and the choice some make to live there life open and honest should be applied across the board. People of color should feel the same strength, pride and joy in who they are and should not have to feel so bad about something like skin tone that they feel the need to bleach his or her skin. Who the hell said this was a major racial event anyway besides YOU!
Sparkycat saidI don' t care what he does to his skin. It's his business. And I'm truly sick and tired of blacks trying to turn non-racial issues into major racial events. Quit manufacturing prejudice.
As Nicely as I can. I must say that you being truly sick and tired of what you think blacks are trying to do is typical. Of course you don't care, it effects you in know way. If you took the time to think of what racism has done internally for blacks, gays and anyone else who's had the privilege of being disliked, unaccepted, harassed or ostracized you'd give a damn. While I might not be so quick to judge, I will say that any image that might have some influence on a child and there perception of selfworth which could be potentially damaging is worth concern. The same way many gay men and women hide who they are sexually and the choice some make to live there life open and honest should be applied across the board. People of color should feel the same strength, pride and joy in who they are and should not have to feel so bad about something like skin tone that they feel the need to bleach his or her skin. Who the hell said this was a major racial event anyway besides YOU!
He would only have to think of being gay and the harrassment some gay people receive.
But the thing about this... one can rarely empathize unless one walks in the same shoes
RyanReBoRn saidLight and dark. White and black. Hero and villain. Good and evil.
When you meet an Asian guy you don't call him a "yellow" guy.
When you meet an Indian guy you don't call him a "brown" guy.
When you meet a Native American guy you don't call him a "red" guy.
So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)? It's because the words black and white have immovable and unchangeable stigmas attached to them. So it should be no surprise that here, in the USA, where every one refers to Caucasians as white and to Africans as black, people also maintain an inherent predisposition to those that are called white when compared to those that are called black. Because who wouldn't prefer the "good" guy over the "bad" guy, right?
It's all just speculation on my part but it is a pretty obvious observation to make.
Wow, so white is "good" and black is "bad". Look at the bigger picture dude, as humans we classify. You hit the nail on the head, white, black, Asian, Native American, Indian, gay, straight - are all ways we classify people. EVERYONE uses those terms. An Indian says, "He's black," a Jew says, "He's Christian," a Native American says, "He is WHITE."
I know plenty of blacks who want to be called black. They are not from Africa, they are not African American. I am Hungarian and a lot of other things, but I am not Hungarian-Italian-French-Bohemian-German-Native American-American. So like Jetsetter99 said, "rather people who keep bringing this topic up sound to be the biggest self haters moaning about it all the time."
You seem to have missed the point of my post. Allow me to reiterate it for you.
"So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)?"
Just because you know "plenty" of Africans (ie: people who's lineage stems from the continent of Africa) that want to be called black doesn't mean there isn't an equal number that would prefer to be called by a more accurate label.
I'm happy being called white. I don't see a problem. (Might be because i'm the "good" guy.) I don't know any black people who have a problem being called black.
Your post is subjectively racist. Why African - Americans? Boo hoo. I must know some pretty progressive black people because they dont have the same argument you do. You're referring specifically to color. If you want to get technical with the rainbow, I have seen some black people - so they must be black, not everyone is that dark, just like Caucasian people come in all shades of white and yellows and red.
Tell me 2 things. 1.Have you ever told a racial joke? Redneck, Blonde (which refers to a hair color that cannot be absolute either, yet classifies 'intelligence'), Jewish, White, Asian? I'm sure you haven't nor used any words to classify people. So politically correct. Now God forbid a white guy steal your ipod when you're walking through campus @ Texas A&M. What are you going to tell the police? A Guy did it. ...Let me get out a Sherwin Williams paint swab book so you can pick his color.
2. What should we call you, specifically? Guy? If were at a bar and there are 132 people there, you're the only "b" guy. My friend from Alaska thinks your cute, I know everyone at this bar tonight, he wants to know who you are. Everyone is in togas, it's a Greek (oh a classification word) party. How would he get me to tell you who you are, without saying the "b" word.
OK so lets be real for a minute.....PLEASE I often use the word black when referring to other ppl of color. It's something that I have questioned myself as I'm not BLACK in the sense of color. we all know what color black is as it's the color of the letter that form wrds in which you read now. I am brown and as some of you read this and passively laugh it off I don't mind as it's something I don't give much argument to anyway. If I were to list all the wrds that that are conjoined w/ the wrd black, many of them have negative meanings. If some ppl decide they want to distance themselves and take on a new more insightful headliner....What's it to you? Not to mention you have some balls to refer to your friends or associates as progressive just because your like minded in thought. I'm sure many issues you find separate what are they to you then? Race is not an easy issue to understand and every person of color who voices a opinion other than yours does not mean it's the rants frm an angry person of color. Your nonchalant attitude and take as if you have all the answers and those that still take pause to find solace is insensitive and in some terms prejudice. your ability to prejudge what you thought he meant frm what he wrote is evident.
thatguy520 saidI love that as gay men, we feel comfortable looking at a picture of someone, deciding who they are, what they stand for, what they did or didn't "do" then crafting elaborate statements about how all of the above affect YOU.
In doing so you've not only managed to make something that is none of your business into an issue, but you've managed to use all of your assumptions to build a case for it to be a race issue.
I urge you, before you open your mouth, to think about whether or not what you are about to say would stand up in a court of law if you were sued for slander/ libel. If it would not stand up then it's not factual information and there is a "cost" for brandishing it as the truth.
The fact of the matter is if you want to find out why a black person would bleach their skin you need to find someone who does it or wants to do it and ask them why directly. If mediatakeout.com is a source you feel good about citing for medical information on sammy sosa then you've got bigger fish to fry my friend.
Make sure that as we ask for equality out of one side of our mouths that the other side isn't drooling ignorance. In the meantime there are real fights out there that deserve our time and effort. We'll have plenty of time to decide who's what kind of black-chinese after we've banded together to secure our fair share of equal rights.
meninlove said Well it's certainly interesting to see what US blacks call my mixed racedness.
But then there's this, guys - I'm also part Chinese, East Indian and even have some Arawak. That and the 'fruit flavor' (hahaha) makes for an interesting mix, says Bill.
So am I a WhiBlaChinIndawak?
-Doug ..... and what race should I try look like to be correct and set a proper example? Any one that I pick will have people screaming that I'm prejudiced or full of self loathing about the others.
HELP!!!
Hey Doug! I too have Chinese roots, as well as German in addition to Black and Native American (Blackfoot). It's important to note that black people didn't make up the rules, we just know how the game is played.
You were probably being facetious but I'll answer your question anyway. Don't ACT like anything. Be you! Actually, embrace all people. My ultimate goal in life is to travel and see the world, experience different cultures, different food, customs, traditions, etc. I strive to live life without the barriers we often put up.
It's important to note that black people didn't make up the rules, we just know how the game is played.
You were probably being facetious but I'll answer your question anyway. Don't ACT like anything. Be you! Actually, embrace all people. My ultimate goal in life is to travel and see the world, experience different cultures, different food, customs, traditions, etc. I strive to live life without the barriers we often put up.
True. I've been all over the world, and many many times to my favorite cities. Bottomline - I've found many people don't give a damn. It only seems to matter here in America. Perhaps it does in other countries, but since I don't live there I'm not aware ...
It's funny: I'm a Jewish/Black mixture. Some people say I look north African or Indian. I don't see it, but I don't really care anyhow.
I've only ever had American white guys tell me that I'm not black enough. You just gots to live your life to suit you
USA is the best country for ethnic minorities - try being black in Poland or even Japan... or worse Italy... things are much worse outside the US but still Americans don't realize it. In Europe there is still so much xenophobia - how many blacks or even asians in Europe do you ever hear of being super successful or getting ahead in life like they do in the US? Forget about ethnic minorities - in Europe they don't even like each other...lol.. Italians dont like french... french dont like British... most of them dont like turkish..even the eastern europeans have issues with each other...and they are all whites... its much more messed up than the US..lol. Maybe some americans might be racist - but the US system is not racist... otherwise you would not have a Black (oops I mean mixed race) President.
zakariahzol saidOnce I post a topic "Asian dont find Asian attractive, Black dont find black attractive", But I got a response like , it individual preferences, difficult to answer, a silly posting and etc. The truth is most non white people have a highly inferiority complex, deep inside wishing they are a white, they wish they have narrow and higher nose, . They want to look like Brad Pitt or other white movie star. They dont want to date non white people especially their own kind.
Skin bleaching, skin lightening cream, are no 1 cosmetic best seller in most Asian country. For those white guys, just be thankful you dont have to go thru the hell , we unfortunate people who are born darker and tan with thicker lips and slanted eyes.
White guys who are fat and ugly have to go through much more hell than idiots like you... fact is UNATTRACTIVE people have to go through hell finding someone regardless of their race - and most of the time they desire to be with someone better than them.
Damn Albert Pujols is fine. I have like three or four magazines that I bought just because of him. Gorgeous man. [/quote]
Question: why doesn't anybody actually admit to bleaching their skin? I have heard from people I know that it was because of a disease. Bitch, tell the truth. You bleached your damn skin.
Balljunkie saidDamn Albert Pujols is fine. I have like three or four magazines that I bought just because of him. Gorgeous man.
Question: why doesn't anybody actually admit to bleaching their skin? I have heard from people I know that it was because of a disease. Bitch, tell the truth. You bleached your damn skin.[/quote]
I don't know, Balljunkie. But I'll take it. Cause shit! Seattle has me looking high yellow! haha!
RyanReBoRn saidLight and dark. White and black. Hero and villain. Good and evil.
When you meet an Asian guy you don't call him a "yellow" guy.
When you meet an Indian guy you don't call him a "brown" guy.
When you meet a Native American guy you don't call him a "red" guy.
So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)? It's because the words black and white have immovable and unchangeable stigmas attached to them. So it should be no surprise that here, in the USA, where every one refers to Caucasians as white and to Africans as black, people also maintain an inherent predisposition to those that are called white when compared to those that are called black. Because who wouldn't prefer the "good" guy over the "bad" guy, right?
It's all just speculation on my part but it is a pretty obvious observation to make.
Wow, so white is "good" and black is "bad". Look at the bigger picture dude, as humans we classify. You hit the nail on the head, white, black, Asian, Native American, Indian, gay, straight - are all ways we classify people. EVERYONE uses those terms. An Indian says, "He's black," a Jew says, "He's Christian," a Native American says, "He is WHITE."
I know plenty of blacks who want to be called black. They are not from Africa, they are not African American. I am Hungarian and a lot of other things, but I am not Hungarian-Italian-French-Bohemian-German-Native American-American. So like Jetsetter99 said, "rather people who keep bringing this topic up sound to be the biggest self haters moaning about it all the time."
You seem to have missed the point of my post. Allow me to reiterate it for you.
"So why, then, of all the races are Africans referred to as black, despite that not being an accurate depiction of the actual color of our skin (the same question also applies to Caucasian people)?"
Just because you know "plenty" of Africans (ie: people who's lineage stems from the continent of Africa) that want to be called black doesn't mean there isn't an equal number that would prefer to be called by a more accurate label.
I'm happy being called white. I don't see a problem. (Might be because i'm the "good" guy.) I don't know any black people who have a problem being called black.
Your post is subjectively racist. Why African - Americans? Boo hoo. I must know some pretty progressive black people because they dont have the same argument you do. You're referring specifically to color. If you want to get technical with the rainbow, I have seen some black people - so they must be black, not everyone is that dark, just like Caucasian people come in all shades of white and yellows and red.
Tell me 2 things. 1.Have you ever told a racial joke? Redneck, Blonde (which refers to a hair color that cannot be absolute either, yet classifies 'intelligence'), Jewish, White, Asian? I'm sure you haven't nor used any words to classify people. So politically correct. Now God forbid a white guy steal your ipod when you're walking through campus @ Texas A&M. What are you going to tell the police? A Guy did it. ...Let me get out a Sherwin Williams paint swab book so you can pick his color.
2. What should we call you, specifically? Guy? If were at a bar and there are 132 people there, you're the only "b" guy. My friend from Alaska thinks your cute, I know everyone at this bar tonight, he wants to know who you are. Everyone is in togas, it's a Greek (oh a classification word) party. How would he get me to tell you who you are, without saying the "b" word.
OK so lets be real for a minute.....PLEASE I often use the word black when referring to other ppl of color. It's something that I have questioned myself as I'm not BLACK in the sense of color. we all know what color black is as it's the color of the letter that form wrds in which you read now. I am brown and as some of you read this and passively laugh it off I don't mind as it's something I don't give much argument to anyway. If I were to list all the wrds that that are conjoined w/ the wrd black, many of them have negative meanings. If some ppl decide they want to distance themselves and take on a new more insightful headliner....What's it to you? Not to mention you have some balls to refer to your friends or associates as progressive just because your like minded in thought. I'm sure many issues you find separate what are they to you then? Race is not an easy issue to understand and every person of color who voices a opinion other than yours does not mean it's the rants frm an angry person of color. Your nonchalant attitude and take as if you have all the answers and those that still take pause to find solace is insensitive and in some terms prejudice. your ability to prejudge what you thought he meant frm what he wrote is evident.
It's ones own fault if they associate "bad" meaning to words conjoined with black. Change your perception and look at the bigger picture. Clearly you can read his argument, people are not the color we say they are. His headliner is 'poor me I'm brown skinned and I hate the people for calling me a term that is associated with being BAD and no one else's color word means bad.
I do have balls, big ones. My black friends are integrated and happy in the USA. Not some self-loathing woah-is-me- I hate people for oppressing my ancestors. [I hate this attitude.] Get over it. Move north of the Mason-Dixon.
Next time I get my hair done and I want to go blonde I'll make sure I ask for golden sun, I wouldn't want to associate myself with the oppressed bad words that have been conjoined to being "blond" like: slutty, stupid, uneducated, ditsy, easy, dumb, senseless, shallow, mean, or just "having more fun" .
Call me prejudice - I'm over it. Maybe I'll just start a forum post - how white are always criticized and why so many of us want to tan people should be happy with their color and stay out of the sun.
It looks like we finally have an explanation behind that widely-circulated picture in which Sammy Sosa(notes) appears as a combination of a Twilight extra, a big Charlie Chaplin fan and someone who is taking the death of Michael Jackson just a little bit too hard.
According to a friend of Sosa's, the former Cubs slugger is (thankfully) not suffering from Vitiligo or another type of disease. Sosa's appearance, rather, is a result of an elective "rejuvenation process" for his skin and he was apparently "surprised" when he came out looking whiter than his old home run buddy, Mark McGwire.
zakariahzol saidOnce I post a topic "Asian dont find Asian attractive, Black dont find black attractive", But I got a response like , it individual preferences, difficult to answer, a silly posting and etc. The truth is most non white people have a highly inferiority complex, deep inside wishing they are a white, they wish they have narrow and higher nose, . They want to look like Brad Pitt or other white movie star. They dont want to date non white people especially their own kind.
Skin bleaching, skin lightening cream, are no 1 cosmetic best seller in most Asian country. For those white guys, just be thankful you dont have to go thru the hell , we unfortunate people who are born darker and tan with thicker lips and slanted eyes.
White guys who are fat and ugly have to go through much more hell than idiots like you... fact is UNATTRACTIVE people have to go through hell finding someone regardless of their race - and most of the time they desire to be with someone better than them.
I am at a loss to explain your response to Zakariahzol...
Why and how dare you call the poster an idiot. Do you know him personally?
So are you equating blacks and Asians with fat and ugly white guys? Is that how you view minorities?
It looks like we finally have an explanation behind that widely-circulated picture in which Sammy Sosa(notes) appears as a combination of a Twilight extra, a big Charlie Chaplin fan and someone who is taking the death of Michael Jackson just a little bit too hard.
According to a friend of Sosa's, the former Cubs slugger is (thankfully) not suffering from Vitiligo or another type of disease. Sosa's appearance, rather, is a result of an elective "rejuvenation process" for his skin and he was apparently "surprised" when he came out looking whiter than his old home run buddy, Mark McGwire.
Sorry - I don't buy this argument. Sounds like BS to me.
How often has this been the result of skin rejuvenation. So if I go to do mine. Do I become invisible or do I turn black/
Jetsetter99 saidUSA is the best country for ethnic minorities - try being black in Poland or even Japan... or worse Italy... things are much worse outside the US but still Americans don't realize it. In Europe there is still so much xenophobia - how many blacks or even asians in Europe do you ever hear of being super successful or getting ahead in life like they do in the US? Forget about ethnic minorities - in Europe they don't even like each other...lol.. Italians dont like french... french dont like British... most of them dont like turkish..even the eastern europeans have issues with each other...and they are all whites... its much more messed up than the US..lol. Maybe some americans might be racist - but the US system is not racist... otherwise you would not have a Black (oops I mean mixed race) President.
As a so called "black" person (despite my really nice cinnamon brown skin tone), I have traveled extensively around Europe (Italy, Scandinavia etc) and South East Asia. I experienced none of the hardships you allude to. Perhaps because I am American and not African.
Contrarily, I was treated quite nicely and constantly received attention and compliments regarding my skin color. Especially in Asia.
It is not wise to speak of that which you clearly have no experience nor ever will.
Jetsetter99 saidUSA is the best country for ethnic minorities - try being black in Poland or even Japan... or worse Italy... things are much worse outside the US but still Americans don't realize it. In Europe there is still so much xenophobia - how many blacks or even asians in Europe do you ever hear of being super successful or getting ahead in life like they do in the US? Forget about ethnic minorities - in Europe they don't even like each other...lol.. Italians dont like french... french dont like British... most of them dont like turkish..even the eastern europeans have issues with each other...and they are all whites... its much more messed up than the US..lol. Maybe some americans might be racist - but the US system is not racist... otherwise you would not have a Black (oops I mean mixed race) President.
As a so called "black" person (despite my really nice cinnamon brown skin tone), I have traveled extensively around Europe (Italy, Scandinavia etc) and South East Asia. I experienced none of the hardships you allude to. Perhaps because I am American and not African.
Contrarily, I was treated quite nicely and constantly received attention and compliments regarding my skin color. Especially in Asia.
It is not wise to speak of that which you clearly have no experience nor ever will.
Unless you go for this look:
Visiting and Living are completely different experiences - try living in Europe and finding a job.. then talk to me about your experiences.
He didn't mean to lighten his skin. He went in for an elective skin rejuvination therapy that had the accidental effect of bleaching him out. He was simply trying to reverse some of the damage done to his skin by years and years of abuse from being in the sun. Yahoo had an article on it, not the best article out there but an easy one to find. Here's the link.
Jetsetter99 saidUSA is the best country for ethnic minorities - try being black in Poland or even Japan... or worse Italy... things are much worse outside the US but still Americans don't realize it. In Europe there is still so much xenophobia - how many blacks or even asians in Europe do you ever hear of being super successful or getting ahead in life like they do in the US? Forget about ethnic minorities - in Europe they don't even like each other...lol.. Italians dont like french... french dont like British... most of them dont like turkish..even the eastern europeans have issues with each other...and they are all whites... its much more messed up than the US..lol. Maybe some americans might be racist - but the US system is not racist... otherwise you would not have a Black (oops I mean mixed race) President.
As a so called "black" person (despite my really nice cinnamon brown skin tone), I have traveled extensively around Europe (Italy, Scandinavia etc) and South East Asia. I experienced none of the hardships you allude to. Perhaps because I am American and not African.
Contrarily, I was treated quite nicely and constantly received attention and compliments regarding my skin color. Especially in Asia.
It is not wise to speak of that which you clearly have no experience nor ever will.
Visiting and Living are completely different experiences - try living in Europe and finding a job.. then talk to me about your experiences.
I am black. Have lived, went to school and worked in Europe. My experience is not as you have indicated. I have visited many countries for business and pleasure. I have experienced more racism in America than any where else.
zakariahzol saidOnce I post a topic "Asian dont find Asian attractive, Black dont find black attractive", But I got a response like , it individual preferences, difficult to answer, a silly posting and etc. The truth is most non white people have a highly inferiority complex, deep inside wishing they are a white, they wish they have narrow and higher nose, . They want to look like Brad Pitt or other white movie star. They dont want to date non white people especially their own kind.
Skin bleaching, skin lightening cream, are no 1 cosmetic best seller in most Asian country. For those white guys, just be thankful you dont have to go thru the hell , we unfortunate people who are born darker and tan with thicker lips and slanted eyes.
White guys who are fat and ugly have to go through much more hell than idiots like you... fact is UNATTRACTIVE people have to go through hell finding someone regardless of their race - and most of the time they desire to be with someone better than them.
I am at a loss to explain your response to Zakariahzol...
Why and how dare you call the poster an idiot. Do you know him personally?
So are you equating blacks and Asians with fat and ugly white guys? Is that how you view minorities?
NOOOO - you are twisting my words and reading too much into it. This guy was loathing about how no one wants to date him because of his ethnicity - I simply meant to say that it may not be because of your ethnicity at all... there are hot guys in every race - and hot black guys have no problems getting anyone they want.. just as hot white guys dont... and then again the not-so-hot white, black, asian etc... all have to face the same issues... nothing more.
Jetsetter99 saidUSA is the best country for ethnic minorities - try being black in Poland or even Japan... or worse Italy... things are much worse outside the US but still Americans don't realize it. In Europe there is still so much xenophobia - how many blacks or even asians in Europe do you ever hear of being super successful or getting ahead in life like they do in the US? Forget about ethnic minorities - in Europe they don't even like each other...lol.. Italians dont like french... french dont like British... most of them dont like turkish..even the eastern europeans have issues with each other...and they are all whites... its much more messed up than the US..lol. Maybe some americans might be racist - but the US system is not racist... otherwise you would not have a Black (oops I mean mixed race) President.
As a so called "black" person (despite my really nice cinnamon brown skin tone), I have traveled extensively around Europe (Italy, Scandinavia etc) and South East Asia. I experienced none of the hardships you allude to. Perhaps because I am American and not African.
Contrarily, I was treated quite nicely and constantly received attention and compliments regarding my skin color. Especially in Asia.
It is not wise to speak of that which you clearly have no experience nor ever will.
Unless you go for this look:
Visiting and Living are completely different experiences - try living in Europe and finding a job.. then talk to me about your experiences.
I lived in Bristol England for a year when I was 25 and worked at Pizza Express as a waiter. I made a lot of tips and had much fun!
I was offered a job as an After Effects editor last summer when I was in Copenhagen but turned it down as my focus is on something else.
This past June a friend I went to Thai massage school with, offered me a job at his spa in Malayasia. When I finish school and am an LMT, I may take him up on the offer.
I tend to speak about things I am sure of. I don't assume.
zakariahzol saidOnce I post a topic "Asian dont find Asian attractive, Black dont find black attractive", But I got a response like , it individual preferences, difficult to answer, a silly posting and etc. The truth is most non white people have a highly inferiority complex, deep inside wishing they are a white, they wish they have narrow and higher nose, . They want to look like Brad Pitt or other white movie star. They dont want to date non white people especially their own kind.
Skin bleaching, skin lightening cream, are no 1 cosmetic best seller in most Asian country. For those white guys, just be thankful you dont have to go thru the hell , we unfortunate people who are born darker and tan with thicker lips and slanted eyes.
White guys who are fat and ugly have to go through much more hell than idiots like you... fact is UNATTRACTIVE people have to go through hell finding someone regardless of their race - and most of the time they desire to be with someone better than them.
I am at a loss to explain your response to Zakariahzol...
Why and how dare you call the poster an idiot. Do you know him personally?
So are you equating blacks and Asians with fat and ugly white guys? Is that how you view minorities?
NOOOO - you are twisting my words and reading too much into it. This guy was loathing about how no one wants to date him because of his ethnicity - I simply meant to say that it may not be because of your ethnicity at all... there are hot guys in every race - and hot black guys have no problems getting anyone they want.. just as hot white guys dont... and then again the not-so-hot white, black, asian etc... all have to face the same issues... nothing more.
I am black. Have lived, went to school and worked in Europe. My experience is not as you have indicated. I have visited many countries for business and pleasure. I have experienced more racism in America than any where else.[/quote]
Ok if that is true then its clear you can live anywhere in the world - then why live in the US if the US is so bad to you?? You are clearly lying here to make Americans look bad... sorry I don't believe you at all.
I lived in Bristol England for a year when I was 25 and worked at Pizza Express as a waiter. I made a lot of tips and had much fun!
>
How sweet.. you were a waiter in Pizza express... I wonder why you never got promoted to Manager... oh and all the waiters in UK are foreigners... mostly... but all the managers are British.. mostly... get the picture? I'm not saying the UK is an unfair country - but in this aspect I would give USA the credit for being much far ahead than anywhere in Europe.....
I am black. Have lived, went to school and worked in Europe. My experience is not as you have indicated. I have visited many countries for business and pleasure. I have experienced more racism in America than any where else.
Ok if that is true then its clear you can live anywhere in the world - then why live in the US if the US is so bad to you?? You are clearly lying here to make Americans look bad... sorry I don't believe you at all.[/quote]
you don't have to believe me. il ne m'est d'aucune importance si vous me croyez ou non. The facts remain as they are.
you certainly have made a leap from my living in europe to living anywhere in the world, haven't you?
i am american as well- I chose to live here. and if I want to make americans look bad - I can. I am one.
I am black. Have lived, went to school and worked in Europe. My experience is not as you have indicated. I have visited many countries for business and pleasure. I have experienced more racism in America than any where else.
Ok if that is true then its clear you can live anywhere in the world - then why live in the US if the US is so bad to you?? You are clearly lying here to make Americans look bad... sorry I don't believe you at all.
you don't have to believe me. il ne m'est d'aucune importance si vous me croyez ou non. The facts remain as they are.
you certainly have made a leap from my living in europe to living anywhere in the world, haven't you?
i am american as well- I chose to live here. and if I want to make americans look bad - I can. I am one.
[/quote]
Hah! I got that one! It just kills me that I can barely comprehend French now even though I took it from Kindergarten to 5th grade....but I got that one even without your translation beforehand woohoo! hehe
I lived in Bristol England for a year when I was 25 and worked at Pizza Express as a waiter. I made a lot of tips and had much fun!
>
How sweet.. you were a waiter in Pizza express... I wonder why you never got promoted to Manager... oh and all the waiters in UK are foreigners... mostly... but all the managers are British.. mostly... get the picture? I'm not saying the UK is an unfair country - but in this aspect I would give USA the credit for being much far ahead than anywhere in Europe.....
It was very sweet!
At 25 (almost 20 years ago) I didn't want that responsibility and as you stated, I was a foreigner who overstayed his visa.
I think you are generalizing your point a bit much. And I'm not sure what the debate is anymore.You are saying that there are no people of African descent in positions of authority anywhere in Europe? I'm finding it hard to agree with you on that. I distinctly remember my friend Lloyd was a manager of a pub in Bristol at the time and he was "black" & British.
I don't think that is something you should take such a strong stance on.
That being said, Yep I agree I'd rather be an American "black or white" than anything else.
You really can't speak on the experiences of Americans of African descent when you clearly are not one. Just because we now have a black President doesn't mean prejudice and racism are extinct in this country.
That's like saying since Oprah is wealthy black people make the highest salaries in the country now.
I am black. Have lived, went to school and worked in Europe. My experience is not as you have indicated. I have visited many countries for business and pleasure. I have experienced more racism in America than any where else.
Ok if that is true then its clear you can live anywhere in the world - then why live in the US if the US is so bad to you?? You are clearly lying here to make Americans look bad... sorry I don't believe you at all.
you don't have to believe me. il ne m'est d'aucune importance si vous me croyez ou non. The facts remain as they are.
you certainly have made a leap from my living in europe to living anywhere in the world, haven't you?
i am american as well- I chose to live here. and if I want to make americans look bad - I can. I am one.
Hah! I got that one! It just kills me that I can barely comprehend French now even though I took it from Kindergarten to 5th grade....but I got that one even without your translation beforehand woohoo! hehe[/quote]
LOL - it always comes back : when you least expect it to
Tereseus...before you make Sosa the black anti-christ, reserve judgment and don't make knee-jerk reactions. Apparently it's an unexpected side effect of a skin treatment he's undergoing. Whether it's true or not only time will tell. Give it some time before you string him up.
In India, it is preferable to be lighter skinned, and most women bleach their skin and its a big industry. They don't want to look like darker skinned poor people and laborers.
If you watch most Latin soap operas, the main characters are lighter skinned but the hired help looks darker skinned.
In Italy, the darker skinned southerners from Sicily and Naples are shunned by lighter skinned northern Italians.
But seriously, Tereseus makes a valid point. Why the colored contacts? Just saying, man. It reminds me of Carlton from the Fresh Prince when he went blond and had blue contacts.
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
HAHA.. how stupid....whats the difference? he looks black to me.. and there are blacks all over the carribbean, south america and africa.
This quote "whats the difference" is so ignorant in many ways... yes there are "blacks all over south america and the carribean" Im Cuban! And my ancestors came from africa, how ever... because you were born in america does that make you american? No.... Ask any american what their nationality is... they say anything but american no matter color (spanish, dutch, french, german, mexican even if they are born here..... lol... yes there are blacks... and we still call ourselves latino being that we are born in latin america...
Shifty84 saidI never said Blacks and Dominicans both aren't from African origins. I SAID Blacks and Dominicans are NOT the same. Don't twist my words. Some people think all people of Asian descent look the same. Although they share the same origins, they are NOT the same. Have you ever confused a Chinese person as Japanese or vice versa? They get offended if you happen to do it.
Albert Pujols is Dominican as well. Would you refer to him as latino as opposed to Black simply because his skin is fairer than Sosa's?
This guy is black.
Many people use the latino coinage to pretend they are not black.
Stupid if you ask me. In other parts of the world he is considered black.
Surely you know by now, that blacks come in all shapes and shades of colours
He is clearly not black (ethnically yes nationality no)... lol... If you are born in america no matter color you are american.... lol... same anywhere else in the world...
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
HAHA.. how stupid....whats the difference? he looks black to me.. and there are blacks all over the carribbean, south america and africa.
This quote "whats the difference" is so ignorant in many ways... yes there are "blacks all over south america and the carribean" Im Cuban! And my ancestors came from africa, how ever... because you were born in america does that make you american? No.... Ask any american what their nationality is... they say anything but american no matter color (spanish, dutch, french, german, mexican even if they are born here..... lol... yes there are blacks... and we still call ourselves latino being that we are born in latin america...
Nationality and ethnicity are different. Any American who says their nationality is "Italian" when they haven't even been to Italy, for instance, is mistaken and ought to be told otherwise.
YES THEY ARE DIFFERENT.. THATS WHY I IDENTIFIED THAT ETHNICALLY HE IS BLACK.. BUT HIS NATIONALITY IS DOMINICAN.... IM BLACK AND MY NATIONALITY IS CUBAN... HOWEVER, THE ITALIAN THING IS 100% FALSE... SOMEONES PARENTS ARE BORN IN ITALY COME TO AMERICA AND HAVE A BABY... HE IS ETHNICALLY ITALIAN (WHICH SOMETIMES IS EVEN CONSIDERED LATIN) BUT HE IS AMERICAN...
qbanjock saidYES THEY ARE DIFFERENT.. THATS WHY I IDENTIFIED THAT ETHNICALLY HE IS BLACK.. BUT HIS NATIONALITY IS DOMINICAN.... IM BLACK AND MY NATIONALITY IS CUBAN... HOWEVER, THE ITALIAN THING IS 100% FALSE... SOMEONES PARENTS ARE BORN IN ITALY COME TO AMERICA AND HAVE A BABY... HE IS ETHNICALLY ITALIAN (WHICH SOMETIMES IS EVEN CONSIDERED LATIN) BUT HE IS AMERICAN...
There's really no need to shout :
And to be consistent in your argument:
That chiled would either have to be considred ethnically white if you are considering yourself black
Or you would have to consider yourself ethnically Nigerian or Zambian or one of the other West African countries. If you are going to consider that child ethnically Italian.
And when do they stop being considered ethnically Italian BTW? At what generation?
qbanjock saidYES THEY ARE DIFFERENT.. THATS WHY I IDENTIFIED THAT ETHNICALLY HE IS BLACK.. BUT HIS NATIONALITY IS DOMINICAN.... IM BLACK AND MY NATIONALITY IS CUBAN... HOWEVER, THE ITALIAN THING IS 100% FALSE... SOMEONES PARENTS ARE BORN IN ITALY COME TO AMERICA AND HAVE A BABY... HE IS ETHNICALLY ITALIAN (WHICH SOMETIMES IS EVEN CONSIDERED LATIN) BUT HE IS AMERICAN...
There's really no need to shout :
And to be consistent in your argument:
That chiled would either have to be considred ethnically white if you are considering yourself black
Or you would have to consider yourself ethnically Nigerian or Zambian or one of the other West African countries. If you are going to consider that child ethnically Italian.
And when do they stop being considered ethnically Italian BTW? At what generation?
They never stop being considered ethnically italian... Until they are intermixed with americans... south americans.. or other european races... or african races... and lose track... and as fact i do know my roots beyond cuba in africa... which are from libya and egypt... and i found that alot of black hispanics can trace ancestry, however, African Americans cannot...which nobody is at fault. African Americans honestly just say black because alot cannot trace ancestry back to africa, i found most of my caucasian, asian and hispanic american friends that have never even left the country or state sometimes and only speak english, ive asked what nationality are you right off the bat they start naming and listing... When i came to america people didnt know what the hell to think... The dark skinned guy with curly hair and only speaks french or spanish and crappy english... but bottom line and to get back to the thread.. bleaching can be a way of acceptance... white cubans are often wealtheir and looked up at than black cubans...
Last I checked, Italians and French are not seperate races...this business with Americans saying they're 1/5 irish or whatever is just a way to make themselves feel less bland/more ethnically rich than they really are (and real talk, many Americans who claim to be "italian" or whatever can neither speak the language nor know anything really about the country to which they claim they're a part of). Just say you're "White" and leave it alone, I say.
It's truly disheartening that we continue as a society to place so much emphasis on skin color and to actually rank certain shades above others. Sorry, I don't really have anything to add to this thread other than that. (And hello, "caucasian" means people from the caucasus which has its roots in racist German/Nazi theory from the 1930's...my god, can we drop the fiction and term already as it neither applies nor works for the majority of Americans who use it/claim it!)
ChojinXI saidWow, this thread is out of control...
Last I checked, Italians and French are not seperate races...this business with Americans saying they're 1/5 irish or whatever is just a way to make themselves feel less bland/more ethnically rich than they really are (and real talk, many Americans who claim to be "italian" or whatever can neither speak the language nor know anything really about the country to which they claim they're a part of). Just say you're "White" and leave it alone, I say.
It's truly disheartening that we continue as a society to place so much emphasis on skin color and to actually rank certain shades above others. Sorry, I don't really have anything to add to this thread other than that.
True... But unfortunately it is diheartening that people put emphasis on skin color and the whole white cuban black cuban thing is still huge in cuba... ! Over all... Just like who you are... and i guess things have changed because people used to say like yourself because thats the way you are going to be for the rest of your life.. but now you can be anything.. literally... lol... All i know is im 100% proud to be Afro cuban! im proud of my cuban roots! and im proud of the african roots before cuba!!!
KissingPro saidIn India, it is preferable to be lighter skinned, and most women bleach their skin and its a big industry. They don't want to look like darker skinned poor people and laborers.
If you watch most Latin soap operas, the main characters are lighter skinned but the hired help looks darker skinned.
In Italy, the darker skinned southerners from Sicily and Naples are shunned by lighter skinned northern Italians.
Go figure.
My partner is 100% 2nd generation Italian, and he tells me the same thing about Italy as you state. One of his grandmothers was born Sicilian, a great family scandal when his grandfather married her, his people from the Abruzzo Region of Italy, east of Rome on the Adriatic. Which itself is considered by some as Southern Italy, despite the actual geography, because of past political divisions.
Which demonstrates that the US is not unique in suffering from discrimination based on color and other arbitrary factors. But neither does that make it correct, which I know you are not suggesting, but merely goes to show that humans everywhere have much work to do regarding prejudice. That's why I said I would forward to do the day when such differences disappear, a nearer possibility in time than we might guess, as someone here noted with a scientific link.
Italians from the north are completely different from the southern italians.. and they don't like each other much... sicilians are considered another race alltogether... and romans have their own peculiar habbits... while most other italians hate milan.. which is considered the big bad city in Italy with all the big bad people... lol.
Its a bit like that in most european countries... east germans differentiate themselves from west germans... polish differentiate themselves from eastern europeans... and western europeans differentiate themselves from southern and eastern euros... also in Spain its divided between catalan and spanish.... so yes its all there in europe too but the degree of discrimination may not be as much as what exists between different groups in the US.
Italy used to be a bunch of separate countries with differences in language, custom, etc. The Two Sicilies (Naples and Sicily), Tuscany, Sardinia, Lombardy, Parma, Modena, Venice, Genoa etc. No wonder, in Italy, they don't always see eye to eye.
Some say that darker skin was associated with working outdoors (tanning). That's why in some cultures being paler is sought after because it gives the impression that one can afford to stay indoors and not toil outside.
qbanjock saidYES THEY ARE DIFFERENT.. THATS WHY I IDENTIFIED THAT ETHNICALLY HE IS BLACK.. BUT HIS NATIONALITY IS DOMINICAN.... IM BLACK AND MY NATIONALITY IS CUBAN... HOWEVER, THE ITALIAN THING IS 100% FALSE... SOMEONES PARENTS ARE BORN IN ITALY COME TO AMERICA AND HAVE A BABY... HE IS ETHNICALLY ITALIAN (WHICH SOMETIMES IS EVEN CONSIDERED LATIN) BUT HE IS AMERICAN...
There's really no need to shout :
And to be consistent in your argument:
That chiled would either have to be considred ethnically white if you are considering yourself black
Or you would have to consider yourself ethnically Nigerian or Zambian or one of the other West African countries. If you are going to consider that child ethnically Italian.
And when do they stop being considered ethnically Italian BTW? At what generation?
They never stop being considered ethnically italian... Until they are intermixed with americans... south americans.. or other european races... or african races... and lose track... and as fact i do know my roots beyond cuba in africa... which are from libya and egypt... and i found that alot of black hispanics can trace ancestry, however, African Americans cannot...which nobody is at fault. African Americans honestly just say black because alot cannot trace ancestry back to africa, i found most of my caucasian, asian and hispanic american friends that have never even left the country or state sometimes and only speak english, ive asked what nationality are you right off the bat they start naming and listing... When i came to america people didnt know what the hell to think... The dark skinned guy with curly hair and only speaks french or spanish and crappy english... but bottom line and to get back to the thread.. bleaching can be a way of acceptance... white cubans are often wealtheir and looked up at than black cubans...
Well I for one do not consider that child from your example ethnically italian. i do not subscribe to this nonsense. you are italian american if you were born in italy and migrated to america
If you are born in america and grow up in america -you are american. fullstop.
Jetsetter99 saidMaybe it has nothing to do with changing one's race - but simply to look what is more "attractive" in one's own view. Some people are happy being black... some aren't - those who aren't and if they would rather feel happier being light skinned then so be it.. whats the big deal really?? Get over it.
For the LAST time, Sammy Sosa is NOT black, he's Dominican!!! Damn...
HAHA.. how stupid....whats the difference? he looks black to me.. and there are blacks all over the carribbean, south america and africa.
In south america mostly just brasil! being from argentina the people of black heritage that I have met were either from brasil, or tourist from the USA or Europe. Even though now there are few Africans popping up as street vendors, but still very rare. you won't find many black people in Argentina, Uruguay, Paraguay, Chile, Bolivia, Colombia, or Venezuela. While they may exist it´s rare.
The names vary- but those are the basic five... before there were only three- white, asian, and black--- 
what the hell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. How can you blame him? 
Loving the lips
that comment was for everyone.