My dad wanted some father son bonding time..

  • DrobUA

    Posts: 1331

    Dec 23, 2009 6:35 PM GMT
    My dad and I aren't very close. Both of us are equally stubborn and have extremely different views on things. Most of our talks end in an argument. So today he said I want to take you clothes shopping.. I found this suspicious because my parents haven't bought me clothes since I was 15, however, I went along with it. We get to the store and he starts looking at dress shirts. Now, 99% of my clothes consist of bball shorts and t-shirts so I said I don't really need dress shirts. He said well you need dress clothes for church.. Oh jesus, here we go.. Dad, I'm not going to church. Yes you are, you need jesus in your life. I'm 20 years old it's a little late to be trying to force religion on someone.

    I have soo many problems with organized religion I don't even know where to start. I can't understand why everyone feels the need to make everyone else believe what they believe. Is it a problem for everyone to just believe what they want and leave others out of it? Am I the only one who thinks religion is a form of brainwashing? Here, give me 15% of your income and you'll go to heaven. No one finds it odd that it's a multi-billion dollar a year industry?
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Dec 23, 2009 6:52 PM GMT
    You should have saved yourself the headache and let him buy you some dress clothes.

    a) you'll need some eventually anyway

    b) you still wouldn't be going to church
  • drypin

    Posts: 1798

    Dec 23, 2009 6:57 PM GMT
    Take him out for coffee, let him talk himself out, try to understand his perspective, then tell him you still disagree and cannot support the "organisation" with any integrity. If he pushes, ask him if he is really condoning that you act without integrity. If he still pushes, tell him the answer is no and the subject is closed. If he still pushes, (assuming you are still a dependant) tell him you'll let him coerce you into going to his church service but that will be it for Christmas with the family from now on.
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    Dec 23, 2009 7:15 PM GMT
    At age 20, your beliefs and choices should not be dictated by anyone. It doesn't matter if you're "under his roof," because if he is making your attendance of church a mandatory condition of his continued support, then it's time to set out on your own. I think it's important to hold your ground without bring critical of his own beliefs, because he has a right to his religion.

    Of course it's a tough balance, especially where family is concerned, so I hope you work it out without damaging your relationship with your parents.

  • CarbGoggles

    Posts: 705

    Dec 23, 2009 7:27 PM GMT
    Timberoo saidYou should have saved yourself the headache and let him buy you some dress clothes.

    a) you'll need some eventually anyway

    b) you still wouldn't be going to church


    Do you have parents or family? When they give you a "gift" it's not something you can bolt with. There are always strings attached. The mob and family are interchangeable.
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    Dec 23, 2009 7:29 PM GMT
    At 20, you are a grown ass man. You are not obligated to spend time with your father and if he pulls shit like this, you need to remind him that if he doesn't respect who you are and what you believe then he will not have the pleasure of your company.

    Now, that doesn't mean he can't engage you. But being deceitful in order to trap you into an uncomfortable situation is a shitty thing to do.

    That said. You need a dress shirt, honey. Job interviews, weddings, and flirting with closeted men in power is in your immediate future. icon_biggrin.gif
  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Dec 23, 2009 7:30 PM GMT
    CarbGoggles said
    Timberoo saidYou should have saved yourself the headache and let him buy you some dress clothes.

    a) you'll need some eventually anyway

    b) you still wouldn't be going to church


    Do you have parents or family? When they give you a "gift" it's not something you can bolt with. There are always strings attached. The mob and family are interchangeable.


    no, I emerged fully grown from the sea
  • rnch

    Posts: 11524

    Dec 23, 2009 7:31 PM GMT
    let 'em buy you whatever he wants...then return the stuff next week. icon_cool.gif
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    Dec 23, 2009 7:31 PM GMT
    so, the point is about parental control or organized religion ?

    haha, when your dad tells you you need Jesus in your life
    just tell him "yeah, but you know he's in Cuba and only loves me for my visa" .

  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Dec 23, 2009 7:34 PM GMT
    I hear you loud and clear
    I was the same way with my folks at your age

    What I didn't hear you say is if you're are out to your parents or not
    because that little fact clouds the whole issue
    you're dad might be just going on the fact that you don't go to church
    but he also might have an inkling that you're a big fat "Mo" and he doesn't know how to bring it up to you

    You sound like a guy who knows what he wants
    and who's not afraid to show it
    I'm not telling you to come out to your folks
    Just to tell you be sure of where they might be coming from

    Good Luck and Have a Happy icon_wink.gif
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    Dec 23, 2009 7:38 PM GMT
    Hey DrobUA.......I won't go into the gory details about my dad and his religion and how it has affected our relationship only to say that its a tragic situation. I've tried everything.

    However, I think your dad is making a gesture, even if it is flawed and conditional about the church thing. Unfortunately, my dad wouldn't even consider being in my company, much less buy me clothes, because of the gay thing.

    If I were you, I would accept his offer to go clothes shopping, but make it clear that you can't promise, in fact you won't agree to go to church. But you would enjoy the time together.

    If he agrees, at least you will have that time with him doing "stuff" and you never know what good feelings might arise out of that. Stand your ground, but be open to communicating on some other level.

    Good luck! I hope you at least get a good suit out of it!
  • CarbGoggles

    Posts: 705

    Dec 23, 2009 7:39 PM GMT
    OP I have to deal with the same crap from my dad even to this day and I'm 29yo. When I decided I was tired of the BS I joined the military and said peace out bitches. I'm def not saying that's what you should do. My dad and I still argue when I go home on vacation. However I'm totally responsible for myself. Feast or famine it's all on me. I don't have to justify my actions to my parents for their approval and I've never gone back to ask for help since I left 11yrs ago. My dad and I will never agree and I'm ok w/ that. I know he still loves me and I love him. That's good enough for me.
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    Dec 23, 2009 7:41 PM GMT
    CarbGoggles said
    Timberoo saidYou should have saved yourself the headache and let him buy you some dress clothes.

    a) you'll need some eventually anyway

    b) you still wouldn't be going to church


    Do you have parents or family? When they give you a "gift" it's not something you can bolt with. There are always strings attached. The mob and family are interchangeable.


    Haha what? It still doesn't mean you can't just say NO!

    I'm always confused with people who grew up thinking that having your own will and contradicting your parents is disrespectful. It should be normal, no one should be able to control you and make you do things you don't want to and parents should be the ones to know that in the first place.
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    Dec 23, 2009 7:45 PM GMT
    well yes it is a multi billion dollar a year enterprise. however I don't think it is so much "give me 15% of your income and you will go to heaven" kind of thing. for most people it is a "I will give 15% of my earnings so as to propagate my faith and my church" Realistically, and with the sheer massiveness of the Christian religion, it is not a cheap thing to run. historically the church has always taxed people in order to attain money to keep it running and it's unfortunate that in times of dire need they used the ploy of "donate this much and you go to heaven" or what have you, ie the Papal Indulgences. but I think in a more modern sense people donate of their own will so as to ensure their church is able to continue to run. they see it as an act of charity not so much an act of guaranteeing them entrance into the pearly gates. that being said however, yeah the Catholic church is a bunch of bull honkey.
  • LuckyPierre

    Posts: 192

    Dec 23, 2009 7:46 PM GMT
    I know you can't see it now-but having a relationship with your father is going to mean a whole lot more to you as you get older. Now is the time to be respectful and do whatever you can to make sure your relationship doesn't go from bad to non-existent. Doing what you can to make your parents as happy as you can has nothing to do with your integrity. Attending a church service to appease your father doesn't compromise your integrity. That's like saying a vegetarian looses their integrity by entering a grocery store where meat is sold. Take a look at the bigger picture and remember that you have a whole lot of life left-and a good portion of that probably will be without your father.

    Good luck. It's tough being young! icon_smile.gif
  • CarbGoggles

    Posts: 705

    Dec 23, 2009 7:53 PM GMT
    NGL4ever said
    CarbGoggles said
    Timberoo saidYou should have saved yourself the headache and let him buy you some dress clothes.

    a) you'll need some eventually anyway

    b) you still wouldn't be going to church


    Do you have parents or family? When they give you a "gift" it's not something you can bolt with. There are always strings attached. The mob and family are interchangeable.


    Haha what? It still doesn't mean you can't just say NO!

    I'm always confused with people who grew up thinking that having your own will and contradicting your parents is disrespectful. It should be normal, no one should be able to control you and make you do things you don't want to and parents should be the ones to know that in the first place.


    Saying no is my point. To accept the gift and think you can bail is a whorish tactic. Unless your dad was trying to buy you cheap clothes lol. Really though if you're not independent of your parents then you kinda owe them. At least that's how I was raised. I know if I were a dad and my kid were living off of me he better do what I tell him or he can get the F out of my house and pay for his own shit.
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    Dec 23, 2009 7:57 PM GMT
    CarbGoggles said
    NGL4ever said
    CarbGoggles said
    Timberoo saidYou should have saved yourself the headache and let him buy you some dress clothes.

    a) you'll need some eventually anyway

    b) you still wouldn't be going to church


    Do you have parents or family? When they give you a "gift" it's not something you can bolt with. There are always strings attached. The mob and family are interchangeable.


    Haha what? It still doesn't mean you can't just say NO!

    I'm always confused with people who grew up thinking that having your own will and contradicting your parents is disrespectful. It should be normal, no one should be able to control you and make you do things you don't want to and parents should be the ones to know that in the first place.


    Saying no is my point. To accept the gift and think you can bail is a whorish tactic. Unless your dad was trying to buy you cheap clothes lol. Really though if you're not independent of your parents then you kinda owe them. At least that's how I was raised. I know if I were a dad and my kid were living off of me he better do what I tell him or he can get the F out of my house and pay for his own shit.



    Demanding that his 20-year-old son go pray in church with him — or else! — is not the same as demanding he pitch in with housework!

  • Timbales

    Posts: 13993

    Dec 23, 2009 8:00 PM GMT
    CarbGoggles said
    NGL4ever said
    CarbGoggles said
    Timberoo saidYou should have saved yourself the headache and let him buy you some dress clothes.

    a) you'll need some eventually anyway

    b) you still wouldn't be going to church


    Do you have parents or family? When they give you a "gift" it's not something you can bolt with. There are always strings attached. The mob and family are interchangeable.


    Haha what? It still doesn't mean you can't just say NO!

    I'm always confused with people who grew up thinking that having your own will and contradicting your parents is disrespectful. It should be normal, no one should be able to control you and make you do things you don't want to and parents should be the ones to know that in the first place.


    Saying no is my point. To accept the gift and think you can bail is a whorish tactic. Unless your dad was trying to buy you cheap clothes lol. Really though if you're not independent of your parents then you kinda owe them. At least that's how I was raised. I know if I were a dad and my kid were living off of me he better do what I tell him or he can get the F out of my house and pay for his own shit.


    You must be a great date, someone buys you dinner and you obey them. Then again, you were raised by the mob?

    If Dad gets him into a store and starts to publicly lay into him about church, then yes my advice is shut up and let him by the shirt. I'd also tell him that if he can't discuss a topic without being disrespectful to me then I won't discuss it with him.
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    Dec 23, 2009 8:07 PM GMT
    i agree with munchyzombie -- take the clothes, you'll need em.
    if dad starts in on religion again, tell him the only way you're continuing the conversation is in a nordstroms or a saks, it's not a conversation for banana republic. that way he'll either ease up on the church chat or it'll cost him a pricey new wordrobe that you'll enjoy for years! good luck..icon_cool.gif
    .
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    Dec 23, 2009 8:10 PM GMT
    MunchingZombie saidAt 20, you are a grown ass man. You are not obligated to spend time with your father and if he pulls shit like this, you need to remind him that if he doesn't respect who you are and what you believe then he will not have the pleasure of your company.

    Now, that doesn't mean he can't engage you. But being deceitful in order to trap you into an uncomfortable situation is a shitty thing to do.

    That said. You need a dress shirt, honey. Job interviews, weddings, and flirting with closeted men in power is in your immediate future. icon_biggrin.gif


    LOL Well Said - love the last sentence. icon_cool.gificon_eek.gificon_biggrin.gif
  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Dec 23, 2009 8:15 PM GMT
    Good luck! I hope you at least get a good suit out of it!

    Haha .... Now that's an idea
    Go for it
    Take him to the most expensive designer clothes
    There's a Hugo Boss that's just callin' your name icon_cool.gif

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 23, 2009 8:18 PM GMT
    Timberoo said
    Do you have parents or family? When they give you a "gift" it's not something you can bolt with. There are always strings attached. The mob and family are interchangeable.


    no, I emerged fully grown from the sea

    I nearly spat my cough lozenge at the computer. icon_lol.gif
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    Dec 23, 2009 8:19 PM GMT
    evilgemini saidi agree with munchyzombie -- take the clothes, you'll need em.
    if dad starts in on religion again, tell him the only way you're continuing the conversation is in a nordstroms or a saks, it's not a conversation for banana republic. that way he'll either ease up on the church chat or it'll cost him a pricey new wordrobe that you'll enjoy for years! good luck..icon_cool.gif
    .


    I like this answer best. At least make him pay for expensive nice clothes.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 23, 2009 8:22 PM GMT
    As I've said in many threads, I believe religion is a total crock.

    Your Dad may be well-meaning, but I can tell you the religion thing will never end with him. He'll be trying to convert you FOREVER.

    Maybe you can reach some kind of understanding with him.

    That is, 'let's do things together, but let's agree not bring up this one miserable subject. That way, you and I can still have a relationship. Otherwise, our sole interaction will be reduced to an endless argument about going to church, getting "saved," and some fake god in the sky.'

    Good luck. And keep the clothes.
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    Dec 23, 2009 8:23 PM GMT
    There is something more here going on than shirt buying & Dad making references to church...hmmm...have you had "The Talk" with him yet?

    Organized religion....chuckle....icon_wink.gif

    Maybe Dad is reaching out...trying for some sort of closeness with you in the only way he knows how.
    Or perhaps just a last ditch effort to save your soul...lol