We in Britain are returning to the churches - and not just for Christmas!

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    Dec 24, 2009 3:41 PM GMT
    HTTP ADDRESS GOES HERhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1238146/Forget-say-religions-irrelevant-Spirituality-making-comeback--thank-heaven-that.htmlE

    While browsing through the paper today, I came across this article:

    O COME ALL YE FAITHFUL

    The journalist, Jonathan Aitken attended a carol service at the Church of the Nazarene in Perth, Scotland, where 3,600 ticketed places were filled within the 2pm, 4pm and the 7pm services. In 2005 only 350 attended.

    Westminster and Oxford Cathedrals have doubled their number of services to cope with popular demand. Other big-city churches across the country has done a similar thing to cope with the same kind of demand.

    After declining for the last three decades, church attendance at a regular basis has risen by more than 2% annually with 7.3 million (imperial numeracy 7,300,000) attending church on a monthly basis and 4.9 million each week. Most of these churches which are growing in attendance numbers are Evangelical and Pentecostal which takes the Bible more seriously.

    In November, Aitken took part in a debate among the Oxford Union, packed with students aged from 19 to 21. The passionate talk was whether Britain as a country should return to its Christian values. A vote was taken, with 245 for and 235 against.

    Aitken then gives possible reasons for this reversal.
    Political Correctness, eg replacing Christmas with Winterval and other non-Christian nonsense.
    Greedy bankers, dishonest polititians, and the "me and my bonus" culture.
    Prominent Atheists like Dawkins and Hitchens publishing and pushing their opinions.
    As a result, because of these, along the arrogant power of Materialism crumbling, the next ten years looks to be the Decade of Anxiety.

    MERRY CHRISTMAS EVERYONE!
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    Dec 24, 2009 6:12 PM GMT
    Does the return to Christian values include the traditional value of burning wise women and non-christains at the stake, including those who dress in the clothing of the opposite gender? Just sayin'.

    As I recall, those were called the Dark Ages for a reason. Just felt compelled to point that out. I'm equally anti-religion though, so don't feel singled out. Hahaha

    Happy Holidays, whatever they may be.

    - James
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    Dec 24, 2009 6:21 PM GMT
    Well it's been a hard year and people act irrational when faced with hard, challenging and stressful situations in their life....

    So this is nothing new... come 6 months less people than ever will be there. religion is declining no doubt about it

    PS. it doesn't surprise me that you read the daily mail, for the benifit of those that are not British

    wikipediaThe Mail takes an anti-EU, anti-abortion view, based upon "traditional values", and is pro-capitalism and pro-monarchy, as well as, in some cases, advocating stricter punishments for crime. It also often calls for lower levels of taxation. The paper is generally critical of the BBC, which it argues is biased to the left.[51]
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    Dec 24, 2009 6:35 PM GMT
    NotThatOld said
    Political Correctness, eg replacing Christmas with Winterval and other non-Christian nonsense.


    I'd like to point out that THIS IS AN URBAN MYTH! IT NEVER HAPPENED!
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    Dec 24, 2009 6:36 PM GMT
    jimbobthedevil saidDoes the return to Christian values include the traditional value of burning wise women and non-christains at the stake, including those who dress in the clothing of the opposite gender? Just sayin'.

    As I recall, those were called the Dark Ages for a reason. Just felt compelled to point that out. I'm equally anti-religion though, so don't feel singled out. Hahaha

    Happy Holidays, whatever they may be.

    - James


    Would you say those were Christian values or an aberration?

    How about we return to the beautiful era of throwing christians to the lions or the era of crucifying people.
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    Dec 24, 2009 6:50 PM GMT
    ... must ... resist ... posting ... nasty comments

    I'm spending X-mas with my mother-in-law. Stuck here in the cabin listening to her flap her trap for the next 48 hours. Normally, I'd be down in the garage beating my head against the wall, but for some reason I can't shake this incredible mood I'm in.

    It seems to happen every year around this time. Maybe it's because I'm able to fully enjoy a four day, work free weekend, or maybe it's because the light of Jesus Christ can only reach my pea-sized heart on 12/24 and 12/25?

    nah, it's definitely because of the four day weekend.

    Merry Christmas, bitches. icon_smile.gif
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    Dec 24, 2009 8:11 PM GMT
    reppaT said... must ... resist ... posting ... nasty comments

    I'm spending X-mas with my mother-in-law. Stuck here in the cabin listening to her flap her trap for the next 48 hours. Normally, I'd be down in the garage beating my head against the wall, but for some reason I can't shake this incredible mood I'm in.

    It seems to happen every year around this time. Maybe it's because I'm able to fully enjoy a four day, work free weekend, or maybe it's because the light of Jesus Christ can only reach my pea-sized heart on 12/24 and 12/25?

    nah, it's definitely because of the four day weekend.

    Merry Christmas, bitches. icon_smile.gif


    Phew. I was starting to worry you´d been Saved icon_eek.gif

    Christianity is nearly dead in europe, thank god.

    icon_rolleyes.gif
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    Dec 24, 2009 8:15 PM GMT
    Empty observance is no promise of real values.
  • t0theheights

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    Dec 24, 2009 8:22 PM GMT
    People always flee to religion and other irrational superstitions when times get tough... and religions capitalize on people's suffering and fear to sucker in as many people as possible. Once times improve people will get back to reality, and stop seeking solace on in imaginary ghosts in the sky.

    Personally when things get rocky in my life, I place my faith in the Flying Spaghetti Monster, faith in whom has just as much credibility as Christianity or any other world religion.
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    Dec 24, 2009 8:27 PM GMT
    People returning to church? Are they sacrficing young children to the high priests for sexual gratification? People will never learn. Churches are perversion mills. If the world economy continues it's southward path, churches will replace the sex club as a haven to meet new, interesting, and now virtuous sex partners. For straight people that is.
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    Dec 24, 2009 8:27 PM GMT
    t0theheights saidPeople always flee to religion and other irrational superstitions when times get tough... and religions capitalize on people's suffering and fear to sucker in as many people as possible. Once times improve people will get back to reality, and stop seeking solace on in imaginary ghosts in the sky.

    Personally when things get rocky in my life, I place my faith in the Flying Spaghetti Monster, faith in whom has just as much credibility as Christianity or any other world religion.


    Have you been touched by his noodly appendage too?
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    Dec 24, 2009 8:57 PM GMT
    t0theheights saidPeople always flee to religion and other irrational superstitions when times get tough... and religions capitalize on people's suffering and fear to sucker in as many people as possible. Once times improve people will get back to reality, and stop seeking solace on in imaginary ghosts in the sky.

    Personally when things get rocky in my life, I place my faith in the Flying Spaghetti Monster, faith in whom has just as much credibility as Christianity or any other world religion.


    Amen to this. Organized religion has always and will continue to be an escape from reality. By 'giving' over our troubles we can forget about them and live life with less 'fear.' Instead, we become lackadaisical and more shut off as a society when we turn to the churches.

    Europe is ahead of the West in being logical about life. We shouldn't need an old book--that has many holes and incorrect translations--to tell us we should respect and care for those around us! It is sad commercialism and capitalism have made us so ME-centered. We have lost so much understanding slide and escape our lives as we shut ourselves into our houses and apartments, instead of going out to a soup kitchen or buying a wrap for the guy on the corner.

    Many mainstream beliefs encourage us to donate to them, but they fail to care for those in true need. Instead they peddle faith in order to fulfill a need for those willing to undergo the saving power of the almighty. I wonder if Jesus wouldn't be flipping the tables of many many charities and churches today.
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    Dec 24, 2009 9:58 PM GMT
    Scally saidYes we should return to Christian ways but with no dogma or know one church saying we have it right, and Lord says , claiming they are prophet or messenger .


    So if you cut out loopy teachings, denominational control and manipulation, what is left of "christian ways"? I guess you´re not referring to killing Jews?
    icon_rolleyes.gif


    Happy Winterval.
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    Dec 24, 2009 10:38 PM GMT
    MadeNUSA said
    jimbobthedevil saidDoes the return to Christian values include the traditional value of burning wise women and non-christains at the stake, including those who dress in the clothing of the opposite gender? Just sayin'.

    As I recall, those were called the Dark Ages for a reason. Just felt compelled to point that out. I'm equally anti-religion though, so don't feel singled out. Hahaha

    Happy Holidays, whatever they may be.

    - James


    Would you say those were Christian values or an aberration?

    How about we return to the beautiful era of throwing christians to the lions or the era of crucifying people.


    I should like to point out that crucifixion was not a form of execution reserved for Christians, but rather pre-dated it. And that the lion-feeding thing was very short lived, beginning and ending with Nero, and even then only a handful of years, compared to the 1,800 years of Christians BEING the persecutors. They ushered in the dark ages, burned 40,000 Jews at the stake during the Plague, and lets not even talk about Crusades or Inquisition (which was ended in 1863 or 1864), the murder of Native American peoples, and the list of persecutions goes on. Including, but not limited to, right up to today. Don't believe me? Tried to get married to your boyfriend. Or exercise your free-speech rights against religious people who are trying legislate their belief system, forcing it upon you, and watch what happens. And the blood-soaked history of the religion, from it's early days as a polytheistic belief system to the dawn of Christianity once they got their hands on some power is not an aberration, but has been the norm for the greater part of its existence. The bizarre persecution complex that Christianity has is bewildering to me given the past 18 centuries of their brand of terror and constant persecution of non-believers, still happening today.

    These days most Christians pick and choose from their belief system what is a value and what isn't. For instance, "God" is down with slavery, and tells you how much to buy and sell people for. Humans find slavery reprehensible, although the trade is still conducted today. If Christians really wanted to return to their values, they would be poverty-striken (as Jesus commands), women would be silent (according to Timothy) and no-one would be wearing blended fabrics or eating shellfish, under penalty of death (Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy).

    I'm a former born-again Christian, and Christian values are what led me to leave the church. But, as I said, my problem is with all religion. It's fascist by nature. If the Supreme Being wants something done a particular way, let's see him show up on the evening news. Until then, faith is just another way to control people, and blind faith is outright dangerous. Case in point: Bomb Vests.

    And my original point is that attempting to take the moral high-ground because you are religious or because of your religious faith is perhaps the finest form of hypocrisy I've witnessed in the human race.

    Me, I'll take my chances with compassion. Or follow the Wiccan Creed: Do as you will but harm none.
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    Dec 24, 2009 10:40 PM GMT
    MadeNUSA said
    jimbobthedevil saidDoes the return to Christian values include the traditional value of burning wise women and non-christains at the stake, including those who dress in the clothing of the opposite gender? Just sayin'.

    As I recall, those were called the Dark Ages for a reason. Just felt compelled to point that out. I'm equally anti-religion though, so don't feel singled out. Hahaha

    Happy Holidays, whatever they may be.

    - James


    Would you say those were Christian values or an aberration?

    How about we return to the beautiful era of throwing christians to the lions or the era of crucifying people.


    PS: Let's not return to any era, but rather move ahead, hopefully with some learning from our many mistakes of the past and present.
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    Dec 24, 2009 10:49 PM GMT
    Woweee! So far it looks as if I had opened a can of worms to feed a pack of hungry wolves.

    But let's put a thing or two right:
    The atrocities in the Dark Ages were not the fruit of Biblical Christianity nor the true Christian church. If you really want to know how the true Christian church was defined in the Bible, read the whole book of the Acts of the Apostles in the New Testament. (And you don't need to read the King James Version, there are various modern translations.)

    The Dark Ages was the result of merging the Church to the State by the Pontiff, Emperor Constantine in AD 313, to form the Roman Catholic Church which the Emperor as the Bishop of Rome united to stabilise his Empire politically. It had nothing to do with Jesus Christ or his teaching nor that of his Apostles.

    The Book of Revelation symbolise the Roman Catholic Church as a woman riding a creature with seven heads and ten horns. Nowadays known as the Whore of Babylon, this woman is dressed in purple - the official RC clergy cloak is purple, she is drunk with the blood of the saints (true Christians) defining the Dark Ages as well as the Inquisition, and wears precious jewllery, which a way to say that she is incredibly wealthy, she sleeps around with the kings of the earth, that is to say, she wields political power, deposing some kings and setting up others. In her hand she is holding a cup full of stinking abomination. The teaching of celebacy among the clergy has made full of sexual perversion, prostitution, bribery and murder, from the Pope down. Finally this woman is also the city which sits on seven hills. This can only be Rome.

    I'm for the return to Christian values in our country. But by saying that, I wasn't meaning becoming a Catholic country.
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    Dec 24, 2009 10:52 PM GMT
    Hahaha...in a way, that was kind of my point. Religion is rarely about the deities they subscribe to.

    I think what's more important is being guided by compassion and kind acts, which are values that transcend religion entirely. And those are values I can subscribe to.
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    Dec 25, 2009 12:02 AM GMT
    There is just so much crazy here, and I'm having a lovely holiday, so I think I'll just back away slowly whilst nodding my head.

    Hope you're all having a great break, and 2010 is a wonderful new year.

    NotThatOld saidWoweee! So far it looks as if I had opened a can of worms to feed a pack of hungry wolves.

    But let's put a thing or two right:
    The atrocities in the Dark Ages were not the fruit of Biblical Christianity nor the true Christian church. If you really want to know how the true Christian church was defined in the Bible, read the whole book of the Acts of the Apostles in the New Testament. (And you don't need to read the King James Version, there are various modern translations.)

    The Dark Ages was the result of merging the Church to the State by the Pontiff, Emperor Constantine in AD 313, to form the Roman Catholic Church which the Emperor as the Bishop of Rome united to stabilise his Empire politically. It had nothing to do with Jesus Christ or his teaching nor that of his Apostles.

    The Book of Revelation symbolise the Roman Catholic Church as a woman riding a creature with seven heads and ten horns. Nowadays known as the Whore of Babylon, this woman is dressed in purple - the official RC clergy cloak is purple, she is drunk with the blood of the saints (true Christians) defining the Dark Ages as well as the Inquisition, and wears precious jewllery, which a way to say that she is incredibly wealthy, she sleeps around with the kings of the earth, that is to say, she wields political power, deposing some kings and setting up others. In her hand she is holding a cup full of stinking abomination. The teaching of celebacy among the clergy has made full of sexual perversion, prostitution, bribery and murder, from the Pope down. Finally this woman is also the city which sits on seven hills. This can only be Rome.

    I'm for the return to Christian values in our country. But by saying that, I wasn't meaning becoming a Catholic country.
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    Dec 25, 2009 12:39 AM GMT
    In life's banquet, have a nice wine or fresh juice, and skip the Jim Jones Punch.

    jjpunch.gif


    do good to others, but don't drink the punch!!
  • Nodak

    Posts: 72

    Dec 25, 2009 12:50 AM GMT
    Going to church doesn't make one a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes one a car.