Obama wins it... Hilary a distant third

  • GQjock

    Posts: 11649

    Jan 04, 2008 10:32 AM GMT
    Wow...
    I feel like Santa Claus left a shiny new bicycle under the tree when I woke up this morning
    I would've voted for Hilary if her candidacy came down the pike but I was always worried that the republicans would have ready artillery for her
    ...but Obama sends a message that we need change here in this country and to vote for him will do just that and more
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    Jan 04, 2008 12:52 PM GMT
    ya, Obama's calling for a change in Democrate, while Hilary's just calling for a change of central govenment, from republican to democrate. Most voters want to see both party to change. but can Obama really do it? or what can he do?
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    Jan 04, 2008 1:00 PM GMT
    Have to say I was disappointed that Hillary was third, but I don't think we should count her out just yet. She was just 0.2% behind 2nd place John Edwards.

    In fairness I'd be happy with any of the three (anything but Bush or another republican) as they all seems to be much the same, as least in terms of gay rights ..i.e all for civil partnerships/rights, but not for gay marriage, etc. Would like to see Hillary make it tho!

    BTW, haven't really done much research on the republicans, are they all towing the typical conservative/republicain line, or are any of them supporting the idea of civil partnerhips for gay couples, etc?
  • HndsmKansan

    Posts: 16311

    Jan 04, 2008 1:18 PM GMT
    Well I was certainly disappointed with the result, but I think there is a lesson for all here: This country is sick of the track we have been on... and there had better be changes coming! If Hillary adopts that, then she may well win New Hampshire.. if not.. Obama may be the nominee.

    Remember there was a former govenor in 1992 that was truly a "distant third" (after the Iowa caucas), not a close third and that was Bill Clinton. I wouldn't write Hillary (or for that matter, Edwards off) yet.
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    Jan 04, 2008 2:21 PM GMT
    They are not all the same with regards to gay rights.

    Obama, Edwards want to eliminate the DOMA (Defense of Marriage Act) placed by Bill Clinton, Hillary has not promised to get rid of this terrible legislation.

    Hillary = no change for gay America.
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    Jan 04, 2008 3:43 PM GMT
    Hippie,
    You're right about DOMA. The only candidate who has been quick to condemn homophobic statements from the rightwingers has been Edwards. When Peter Pace made his disgusting comments, Edwards spoke out the same day. Obama and Hillary waited TWO DAYS before their campaigns put out a tepid statement of polite disagreement. As usual, they both waited to see how the wind was blowing.

    I'm afraid Edwards may be dead in the water, and that's a shame. Barack McClurkin Obama still disappoints me, however.
  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Jan 04, 2008 3:54 PM GMT
    GQjock saidWow...
    I feel like Santa Claus left a shiny new bicycle under the tree when I woke up this morning
    I would've voted for Hilary if her candidacy came down the pike but I was always worried that the republicans would have ready artillery for her
    ...but Obama sends a message that we need change here in this country and to vote for him will do just that and more


    Hillary will at least be ready for them. Barack Obama, for all his idealism and optimism, has never had to face a serious Republican opponent. They are going to eat him for lunch in the GE if he wins the primary. I don't think he's tough enough to handle what's coming his way...
  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Jan 04, 2008 3:57 PM GMT
    hippie4lyfe saidThey are not all the same with regards to gay rights.

    Obama, Edwards want to eliminate the DOMA (Defense of Marriage Act) placed by Bill Clinton, Hillary has not promised to get rid of this terrible legislation.

    Hillary = no change for gay America.


    Obama was also the one who put that God-awful "exgay" Donnie McClurkin onstage in SC to pander to evangelical blacks. Unforgivable, and he will not get my support in the GE if he gets the nomination. I will vote for my local offices and that's it...
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    Jan 04, 2008 4:03 PM GMT
    jarhead I think its unfair to use McClurkin against Obama. He never said he endorsed the ex-gay position. Obama has always been about conversation. He said in order to make progress you need to talk to your adversaries. In order to be one America, liberals, and conservatives, atheists, and faith based people need to come together hear each other out and make progress.
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    Jan 04, 2008 4:04 PM GMT
    Also as a New Yorker and someone represented by Hillary Clinton as senator of my state I can say she has gone to all gay pride parades but conveniently did not attend this year! Why? because she is pandering to right wing America. God forbid she be seen at the gay pride parade when she runs for President.
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    Jan 04, 2008 4:05 PM GMT
    Yes, hippie, he wanted to make conversation so badly that his organization allowed McClurkin thirty minutes of time to preach against homosexuals at the rally. Did they stop him?



    Did Obama then come out with some mealy-mouthed disclaimer about dialogue?

    Doesn't he ALWAYS?
  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Jan 04, 2008 4:07 PM GMT
    hippie,

    that's what makes it so dissapointing. Obama was good, even very good, on gay rights, then this. He made a deliberate choice to pander to a more powerful and politically influential constituency. Looks like betrayal, feels like betrayal, ya know? Also doing this exposed for all the world to see the incredible levels of homophobia in the AA community, and sowed division in the Democratic party. We begged, pleaded with him beforehand not to do this, and he did it anyway.

    And what did McClurkin do once he got onstage? Why, he delivered an anti-gay rant and got applauded for it.
  • HndsmKansan

    Posts: 16311

    Jan 04, 2008 4:11 PM GMT
    While I don't want to get drawn into some sort of political argument over democratic candidates.. I prefer ANY democrat most generally to a republican
    (but flexible enough to always consider all running).

    Where I differ with Hippie and some of the other remarks and why I will (most certainly) support Hillary or John Edwards is because of a balance of issues.. not just one. I'm not a single issue voter.
    While positions on issues such as gay rights is important, its just one thing I weigh when making a choice.

    If Obama turns out to be the nominee, I will certainly vote for him. But I think its far too early to make that determination.
  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Jan 04, 2008 4:13 PM GMT
    Okay, maybe I will vote for him if it comes to that. But I will certainly not look to the White House for leadership on this issue, as I would do if Hillary wins...
  • DalTX

    Posts: 612

    Jan 04, 2008 4:50 PM GMT
    hippie4lyfe saidAlso as a New Yorker and someone represented by Hillary Clinton as senator of my state I can say she has gone to all gay pride parades but conveniently did not attend this year! Why? because she is pandering to right wing America. God forbid she be seen at the gay pride parade when she runs for President.



    So you're ok with Obama teaming up with McClurkin but upset because Hillary missed one gay pride parade?

    Sounds about right.
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    Jan 04, 2008 4:57 PM GMT
    don't throw in the towel for hillary yet. she's is not out of this race. if, for some god awful reason, it came down to edwards or obama you better believe my ass would be supporting edwards. obama is a joke and so is the fact that his campaign's biggest supporter is oprah. really? oprah? come on now, go back to your fucking angel network and stay the hell out of politics.
  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Jan 04, 2008 5:05 PM GMT
    genqb saiddon't throw in the towel for hillary yet. she's is not out of this race. if, for some god awful reason, it came down to edwards or obama you better believe my ass would be supporting edwards. obama is a joke and so is the fact that his campaign's biggest supporter is oprah. really? oprah? come on now, go back to your fucking angel network and stay the hell out of politics.


    You're my new best friend. Couldn't agree more. Obama is like Bambi (inspiring and nice and charming but dangerously innocent and inexperienced). He would be slaughtered in the GE, he's just not tough enough. And now we also now he is unprincipled...
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    Jan 04, 2008 5:11 PM GMT
    Jarhead--

    Did you ever see the short film "Bambi meets Godzilla"?
  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Jan 04, 2008 5:13 PM GMT
    I think I might have. Maybe at the Sigma Chi house in college, I think I was under the influence of something at the time...
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    Jan 04, 2008 5:25 PM GMT
    thanks jarhead. i feel like too many people just fall in line with obama because they think he's likable. i'm so sick of people voting for someone because they think they're nice, or they don't like the other candidate's wife, etc. after dealing with a complete idiot for 8 years can we PLEASE vote for someone with some serious credentials, experience, and leadership ability???

    as for hillary's stance on gays - let's be honest here. she's not going to say or do anything to upset the right wing until AFTER she gets elected. come on guys, the only candidate to 100% support us in recent history is dennis kucinich and NO ONE takes him seriously because they know the right wing will destroy him. we just have to be patient...

    oh, and as for the DOMA - why do you think Hillary wouldn't say anything about it? It was her husband's legislation (that he was essentially forced into signing). I'm sure she'll repeal it, she's just not gonna tear down her husband's presidency to do so (another reason why edwards & obama have said something about it already).
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    Jan 04, 2008 5:48 PM GMT
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    Jan 04, 2008 5:48 PM GMT
    genqb saidthanks jarhead. i feel like too many people just fall in line with obama because they think he's likable. i'm so sick of people voting for someone because they think they're nice, or they don't like the other candidate's wife, etc. after dealing with a complete idiot for 8 years can we PLEASE vote for someone with some serious credentials, experience, and leadership ability???

    as for hillary's stance on gays - let's be honest here. she's not going to say or do anything to upset the right wing until AFTER she gets elected. come on guys, the only candidate to 100% support us in recent history is dennis kucinich and NO ONE takes him seriously because they know the right wing will destroy him. we just have to be patient...

    oh, and as for the DOMA - why do you think Hillary wouldn't say anything about it? It was her husband's legislation (that he was essentially forced into signing). I'm sure she'll repeal it, she's just not gonna tear down her husband's presidency to do so (another reason why edwards & obama have said something about it already).


    It's amazing that you won't vote for someone because they are "nice" but you will support someone for what you have faith they will do. That makes no sense especially when the "nice" guy is taking a stand on these issues right now.

    Get over the McClurkin thing. It's ridiculous. Read his Advocate interview.
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    Jan 04, 2008 5:53 PM GMT
    Sicko, please provide a link. I was just over at Advocate and there's a shitload of articles mentioning Obama and McClurkin. I'm not sure which one you're referring to.
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    Jan 04, 2008 5:57 PM GMT
    haha, sorry, it's hard to manage all 70 of these threads and remember what is in it earlier:

    http://www.advocate.com/news_detail_ektid50021.asp

    It's a good'n
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    Jan 04, 2008 6:06 PM GMT
    NNJfitandbi saidThe Iowa winner rarely gets the nod.


    That is incorrect.

    For democrats the winner got the nod 5/8 times since Iowa became the first state in 1972.

    Republicans got it 3/5 times since they started in 1976.

    You can read that info here

    And on who supports gay rights more, all three leading candidates have been less than perfect. Obama had the exgay debacle in SC as well as being tepid in his support due to faith, which he has since recanted. John Edwards says that his faith does not allow him to support gay marriage, which his wife scolded him for and said she is working to change his mind on that. And Hillery has not done anything about DOMA as mentioned above. None of them is ideal, but Clinton seems least ideal of the three.

    A dem president in a solidly dem controlled congress will mean a change in position once one of these clowns is in the whitehouse. So, stay tuned.