REALJOCK.COM: a gay online frat house?

  • danisnotstr8

    Posts: 2579

    Dec 28, 2009 5:26 AM GMT
    More and more frequently, I have the thought that Realjock.com is very much like a fraternity, in both good ways and bad.

    The good thing is that a lot of guys find a community here. It's a place where gay men can learn a bit, make friends, and even form a bit of an identity in the company of (for the most part) physically healthy individuals.

    However (and here's where the frat house part comes in), I think it's kind of sad that there's a central controlling mentality that encourages us to lose our identity. Whereas it's not the intent of the site or of many of its members, there's a resounding voice that tends to overwhelm in here.

    Basically, we've got an awesome opportunity to express ourselves and entertain some fantastic debates. Unfortunately, though, there's a core of "Realjockers" (those who think we should all just be happy and act the same), who refer to us all as "realjockers" and love to quell our passions and individuality.

    Time and time again, I've chimed in on various topics ranging from food and exercise to gender politics and religion. Many of us have done so. It's sad, though, that when my opinion has diverged from the mean on this site, I've been ousted by those very people who would otherwise require that everyone remains happy. I have been called "pussy," "whiny bitch," and many other things. I have received physical threats and even death threats, all because I sought to defend someone besides the jock-minded male. The worst responses I've seen have been when I (or someone else) comes to the defense of women.

    I, too, have been guilty of ousting people (although I try to avoid calling people names as a defense of my argument). I tend to get aggravated when people post Biblical passages as support for their claims; in those cases, despite my attempts to remain cool, I have slipped into some rude commentary. For my rudeness, I apologize, because in those moments, I become the very person I loathe.

    I'm not 100% sure which extreme is more appropriate. Should we speak out, or should we fit in? I do know, however, that I am *not* here to be average. I didn't come to this site because I was desperate for friends, and nor did I come here because I needed a support network, and to be honest, I was in just as good physical shape before joining. I came here for the forums. I came here for the heated debates with smart people. And it seems, lately, that the general trend is for loud-mouthed jocks with average views to call names and spell out corporate policies when intelligent people talk about things they don't understand or agree with. It feels like you've got to share in the median viewpoint in order to be respected. I sometimes believe that I'm going to be judged out of the group...

    ... and in that sense, in the worst way possible, I feel like Realjock.com is a glorified e-frathouse. Why must we lose our individuality? Why must we appease everyone? Why must we assert that forcefulness, strength, bullheadedness, and team spirit are appropriate, while thoughtful innovation and individuality tend to be frowned upon?

    Now, I'm interested in your views on all this. Good and bad. But please do read everything I've written above before you respond. I was careful to think about all this before I wrote it down. I have been critical of myself, and mindfully, I am the only one I've criticized here by name.

    Go at it, brothers.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Dec 28, 2009 5:29 AM GMT
    Don't be such a pussy bitch!
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    Dec 28, 2009 5:46 AM GMT
    danisnotstr8 saidWhy must we lose our individuality?

    I've seen it stated nowhere that our individuality must be lost.

    danisnotstr8 saidWhy must we appease everyone?

    You haven't been trying to, have you?

    danisnotstr8 saidWhy must we assert that forcefulness, strength, bullheadedness, and team spirit are appropriate, while thoughtful innovation and individuality tend to be frowned upon?

    I'm not sure why you'd invest too much time and emotion in those who'd frown upon thoughtful innovation and individuality.

    By the number of guys who use fratboy grunt-speak, I'd agree that realjock may be like a gay online frat house. But the situation doesn't seem to be entirely hopeless. icon_wink.gif

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    Dec 28, 2009 6:09 AM GMT
    I would be curious to know how we were individually "rushed" and then "activated" into our virtual frat, do we have "alumni" members, in what types of philanthropic works do we engage, do we have a minimum GPA requirement, or dues or a unique ritual and handshake, etc, that unites us.....these actions and events and others are part of my greek experience in college. While I truly enjoy the members of RJ and we may even meet a few of the requirements, This is an internet forum comprised of a gathering of a unique demographic slice....raising a beer to each other or jacking each other off, hardly defines a uniting philosophy and a ritual of a brotherhood in a fraternity...at least in the american college ideal... I don't agree at all with the OP....I was never encouraged to loose my unique personality to be a greek...meerly to share and blend my uniqueness to strengthen the group. I would be interested in the experiences of the OP that shape his views of "FRATERNITY".....
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    Dec 28, 2009 6:13 AM GMT
    I agree.


    But you're totally wrong.



    Did I just prove or disprove your point? Fuck. I'm confused.
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    Dec 28, 2009 6:16 AM GMT
    Maybe we follow different topics, but I still see plenty of individuality among the members (sometimes annoyingly so). We're not all of equal or even similar types of intelligence, education, emotional or cultural development. We also use the site for different reasons.
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    Dec 28, 2009 6:25 AM GMT
    ThePenIsMyTier saidI agree.


    But you're totally wrong.



    Did I just prove or disprove your point? Fuck. I'm confused.


    The correct answer is "Bend over, pledge!"
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    Dec 28, 2009 6:27 AM GMT
    GuerrillaSodomite said
    ThePenIsMyTier saidI agree.

    But you're totally wrong.

    Did I just prove or disprove your point? Fuck. I'm confused.


    The correct answer is "Bend over, pledge!"


    May I watch?
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    Dec 28, 2009 9:26 AM GMT
    . . . the frat's house mother and scold is meninlove, of course . . . who else could be so painfully unhip . . . ?

    . . .but no, this is not a fraternity, this is a sideshow or a rest stop . . .
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    Dec 28, 2009 9:39 AM GMT
    icon_confused.gif

    I wish I'd never gotten rid of that paddle.....
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    Dec 28, 2009 9:47 AM GMT
    Taking applications to live in the frat pad with me icon_rolleyes.gif

    fratpad-wild_and_crazy_fratpad_5_13287_7

    http://www.fratpad.com/
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    Dec 28, 2009 2:18 PM GMT
    lol, OK we'll play. Is noren correct Dan?
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    Dec 28, 2009 2:55 PM GMT
    I feel like I've been "ousted" enough times in my life. As an adult, I cannot bring myself to do that to others, consciously. I've found myself guilty of it before, just like everyone else.

    I haven't been on here long enough to have been a culprit of such. icon_smile.gif I personally hope I never find myself conforming to the masses viewpoint, solely because it is that. Where's the fun there? I thoroughly enjoy a good debate or arguement.

    For myself, as long as I'm saying what's on my mind and how I feel, then eh, I've fulfilled my end of the bargain. I'm always willing to listen and even change my mind accordingly, in the face of a damn good arguement. I also think it's only courteous for others to be prepared to do the same. Or their arguments quickly become moot.

    There's my 2ยข
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    Dec 28, 2009 6:56 PM GMT
    I totally agree with the concensus on here. And I want to look like everyone else who agrees.
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    Dec 28, 2009 7:16 PM GMT
    Personally, I find that there are a number of guys here who's opinions and commentary I enjoy and learn from. I don't have to agree with someone to enjoy their company. There are guys who are in various combinations, hot, funny, brilliant, witty, insightful, artistic, analytic, and fun.

    There are also those guys with personal agendas that would never consider that they may have an argument that is limited, based on poor research, inane or just incomprehensible (whether in concept or explanation). I tend to ignore them.

    I never belonged to a fraternity since the ones available to me at the time seemed less than appealing (whether social or academic.)

    I've made some very good friends here and I don't need to silence those I find egregiously ignorant or belligerently provocative, when I can simply ignore them and read more compelling, intelligent, and well considered alternate points of view.

    Those friendships come from mutual respect, not merely or necessarily agreement.
  • danisnotstr8

    Posts: 2579

    Dec 28, 2009 7:29 PM GMT
    So... no commentary on any of the finer points of my post?

    And NO, by the way, Noren is not correct. Just for the sake of argument, of course.

    I'm interested to hear TigerTim's response...
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    Dec 28, 2009 7:39 PM GMT
    danisnotstr8 said


    I'm interested to hear TigerTim's response...


    oh yes ..... us too.



    As for us..comments? Well, we're not into bigotry, no matter how it's dressed up to be something else, so right or wrong of us, we call it out when we see it.

    Both of us think it's really important to express opinions and that all have the right to do it. HOW it's expressed though, is just as important.

    We both call it onto the carpet when people give advice that can easily go devastatingly wrong if it's followed. Idealism is great, but the real world is far less accommodating.

    lol, have at us, guys! -in the bomb-shelter, us


  • danisnotstr8

    Posts: 2579

    Dec 28, 2009 8:00 PM GMT
    meninlove said

    We both call it onto the carpet when people give advice that can easily go devastatingly wrong if it's followed. Idealism is great, but the real world is far less accommodating.




    I perceive a lot of the guys here as leaders (or as potential leaders). Brains, brawn, motivation, good health, and good looks are often a devastatingly potent combination.

    In that sense, I'm sometimes disappointed to see some of the guys here who have all those things just coast along complacently. Why not take advantage and BE the idealist-- for it only takes a few loud voices to start a riot. Idealism is great, and in a few short breaths it actually becomes the real world.

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    Dec 28, 2009 8:03 PM GMT
    noren said. . . the frat's house mother and scold is meninlove, of course . . .

    Oh god, you say that again!! ... icon_rolleyes.gif ... this place could do without that mother. ... icon_wink.gif
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    Dec 28, 2009 8:09 PM GMT
    jawrhed saidMaybe we follow different topics, but I still see plenty of individuality among the members (sometimes annoyingly so). We're not all of equal or even similar types of intelligence, education, emotional or cultural development. We also use the site for different reasons.

    Outstanding! You took the words out of my mouth (again).icon_wink.gif
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    Dec 28, 2009 8:16 PM GMT
    [quote][cite]meninlove said[/cite]
    danisnotstr8 said


    I'm interested to hear TigerTim's response...


    oh yes ..... us too.



    As for us..comments? Well, we're not into bigotry, no matter how it's dressed up to be something else, so right or wrong of us, we call it out when we see it.

    Both of us think it's really important to express opinions and that all have the right to do it. HOW it's expressed though, is just as important.

    We both call it onto the carpet when people give advice that can easily go devastatingly wrong if it's followed. Idealism is great, but the real world is far less accommodating.

    lol, have at us, guys! -in the bomb-shelter, us


    [/quote

    C'mon guys there something wrong just there, you "call it out as you see it!" I'm sure there are many things we don't see the same, the Bible a picture on the wall, politics! So what right do you have to call me or anyone else out, because we see it diffrent to you! Thats just saying your view is always right; Bah humbug. I've seen you force political correctness on others, and thats nothing more than forcing your political view on others. I commented sometimes telling the Op, they have every right to an opinion, and don't be bullied to change it.

    I recall starting a topic from a British news about the right to an opinion, and you guys felt threatened by that, and started to stalk one, and put words in ones mouth, just to upset one; and failed. I had a truly good guy here at RJ come out and bat for me, coz he felt the same of having a right to an opinion. He gave you guy many facts concerning Canada to do with the topic, and all you could say was " Oh we were only talking about England," I was not, nor were others.

    Not having a go just having an opinion, and there is some facts in there too.icon_wink.gif
  • CuriousJockAZ

    Posts: 19119

    Dec 28, 2009 8:24 PM GMT
    Perhaps some people just take it all a bit too seriously. This is, after all, just a web site. Nothing to get too overly wrapped up in or upset about regardless of how someone else may react to your posts.
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    Dec 28, 2009 8:30 PM GMT
    You know in a way in the forums, it is like a frat house to me. I get to act in a way, I just about never do out here.

    I'm not really political out here, I'de rather be in my garden, or with me dogs, in the garden chilling.

    I don't debate out here much, because if I try to chew the fat on a topic, people say: I'm not going to argue with you Pattison!" But it's not an argument i'm looking for. I myself don't feel threatend because another nay not see things the same way as I do, or has a diffrent view to a topic, thats all good.

    I really get to play the Devils advocate out here.

    I'm just about never in the same room with so many homosexuals or bisexuals out here, albeit there is an innate sameness to the homosexual communities around the world from Moscow to Melbourne. There is a diffrence politically to many homosexuals here in Oz to many in America, We don't feel so threatend, by the right wing, nor religion.



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    Dec 28, 2009 8:32 PM GMT
    danisnotstr8 saidMore and more frequently, I have the thought that Realjock.com is very much like a fraternity...

    No, incorrect, wrong, erroneous, mistaken, etc, etc.

    The negatives you relate are not how a fraternity functions. A frat is much more homogenous, and therefore more harmonious, than an online site. A few similarities may exist, but in general frat brothers represent a more narrow segment of society, with much more in common among their members than one finds within the broader online community, even in one dedicated to gay men.

    Therefore your analogy is not valid. Far from being a fraternity, we are a gay mob. Indeed, the very fact that we are all gay here negates any fraternal possibilities, since gays are socially dysfunctional, like trying to herd cats. We all insist on going in our own direction, conforming to no standard, defying all conventions, reveling in our refusal to join anything that smacks of social compliance.

    We love to be contrary, even to our own disadvantage, and so the conformity of a fraternity could never appeal to us. Our gay life's calling is to disagree with everything (as replies to my post will soon demonstrate), whereas a fraternity if founded upon mutual agreement and harmony, a gathering of clones. The disparity between gays and fraternities could not be greater.
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    Dec 28, 2009 8:47 PM GMT
    Red_Vespa said...like trying to herd cats...

    didz sum1 sey katz???