The end of the Republican Christian Right?

  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Jan 07, 2008 2:56 PM GMT
    Here is a great article predicting a possible future for the republican party by Mark Falcoff. I hope it could be true. If the religious motivation of the right died, we would be forced to look at many more issues than social ones, which is welcome in my book. Politics shouldn't be just voting for whose on your team:

    http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives2/2008/01/019467.php
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    Jan 07, 2008 3:54 PM GMT
    The Religious Right had its chance to show the country what it could do. Baby Bush is the result and he has been a disaster.

    Elections are decided by the great mass of independents. They let the RR have it chance and have seen the disaster. They arent going to let them do it again.
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    Jan 07, 2008 9:05 PM GMT
    I couldn't agree more, Caslon. Bush II has become the poster child of the RR's agenda. Thinking people aren't going to be put through this again. Huckabee makes Shrub look like a Wiccan by comparison (and I am convinced that Bush's religion is like that of so many others--only so strong until it inconveniences him). I have said and will continue to say that Huckabee cannot win the election for president. Discerning voters have had enough of the Evangelical approach. Huckabee would have a hard time beating a trained seal in this political climate.
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    Jan 07, 2008 9:18 PM GMT
    Yeah, but...

    remember....

    35% of all people are weak-minded and these folks typically have false belief systems (religion).

    They are NOT rationale; do not have common sense; no amount of empirical evidence will guide them to truth-based belief systems.

    Don't write off the RR just yet.

    Remember...they're wacky as a basis...and it only gets worse from there.
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    Jan 07, 2008 9:21 PM GMT
    End of the RR? Only if we can find and obliterate the stupidity gene.
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    Jan 07, 2008 9:23 PM GMT
    I'd like to second the motion, please.
  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Jan 07, 2008 9:27 PM GMT
    "Discerning voters have had enough of the Evangelical approach. Huckabee would have a hard time beating a trained seal in this political climate."

    Maybe I'm being cynical today, but, um, what????

    I have no illusions about the relative levels of intelligence, openmindedness or social tolerance of the vast majority of the population of this country. I have seen first hand more racism, sexism and homophobia (blind, rabid hatred in the last example) in my brief time on this earth than anyone should have to see. I used to think that it was generational, but kids younger than me routinely fag-bash gays and make the most disgusting racial jokes when they think no one is listening.

    Four things unify the haters of every age - poor education, relative poverty, geographic distance from the Northeast or Pacific Coast, and devout, fundamentalist Christianity. The cycle of bigotry continues, and will continue for the forseeable future. Children are taught to hate at their hate-filled parent's knees, right after church on Sunday.

    The average voter is not particularly well-informed about any issue. The RW Christian conservative voter will turn out in massive numbers to vote no on any social issue, because he is doing the Lord's work. And they are not going away. To think otherwise means you have spent too much time in the relative safety of an urban area with cultured, sophisticated, educated neighbors surrounding you...
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    Jan 07, 2008 9:28 PM GMT
    motion approved
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    Jan 07, 2008 9:33 PM GMT
    jarhead5536 said The cycle of bigotry continues, and will continue for the forseeable future. Children are taught to hate at their hate-filled parent's knees, right after church on Sunday.

    The average voter is not particularly well-informed about any issue. The RW Christian conservative voter will turn out in massive numbers to vote no on any social issue, because [b]he is doing the Lord's work.[b] And they are not going away.


    i do agree, they start the indoctrination young, and couple that with that whole "im doing God's will," it's a frighteningly strong motivation to vote like an idiot. You can't reason with these people, they have their own reality. Fear of God's wrath is quite the motivator for these sad folk.
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    Jan 07, 2008 9:46 PM GMT
    I don't think GW fits the bill of a religious right president. He certainly pandered to the RR by using Carl Rove's 'wedge' system of winning elections. GW is a failed conservative and a failed religious president not having dealt a blow to fags or fetus killers. I think 2006 and 2008's elections are all about the long term failure of Rove's politics.

    The religious element has always had a special place in American politics. The first people calling for abolition, suffrage, and integration all used religion as their motivation. So, the religious right may be on the ropes, but who knows we may very well have a religious left in the near future.
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    Jan 07, 2008 10:00 PM GMT
    jarhead5536 saidFour things unify the haters of every age - poor education, relative poverty, geographic distance from the Northeast or Pacific Coast, and devout, fundamentalist Christianity. The cycle of bigotry continues, and will continue for the forseeable future. Children are taught to hate at their hate-filled parent's knees, right after church on Sunday.
    Yes, but......reliable polling puts these people at approximately 25-27% of the electorate. I agree that no one is going to change them, but they didn't "win" the last few elections on their own. They had help from mainstream, non-religious Republicans, and also a fair slice of the independents. THESE are the people who will abandon the GOP in 2008 in record numbers, and that's why I predict not only a Democratic win, but a huge pickup in the House and at least six Senate seats.
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    Jan 07, 2008 10:01 PM GMT
    And....that is a scary thought....a Religious Left...

    EEK!

    Are the days of the built power bottom numbered? Humm?
  • jarhead5536

    Posts: 1348

    Jan 07, 2008 10:09 PM GMT
    chuckystud,

    Careful there. I am a religious left person. Liberal as they come, but quite devout Episcopalian...
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    Jan 07, 2008 10:18 PM GMT
    Yeah, but Episcopalians are reasonable, for the most part.
  • TallGWMvballe...

    Posts: 1925

    Jan 07, 2008 10:26 PM GMT
    Having been raised in a "christian" family and having christian fundamentalists and missionaries as relatives (all republicans of course) I am well aware of how bullshit false beliefs can emotionally control the behavior of those masses affected by it.
    I recently got a hate Email telling how Barak Obama is really a muslim who will destroy our Country and give it to the muslims and that gays are ruining our christian families.
    We even have some guys here that are fervent believers in the god/christian myths.
    Until such time as the majority of people can think for themselves the RW republicans and the religious right (and left( will continue to be a threat to the rest of us. We ALL need to stay vigilant and speak out when we see hate taking over logic , reason and good sense and god morality.
  • roadbikeRob

    Posts: 14336

    Jan 08, 2008 12:10 AM GMT
    The best thing to ever happen to both the GOP and our great country would be the rapid weakening and decline of the religious right wing. Unfortunately, given the poor quality of education in most red republican states especially the South, chances of these narrow-minded bible thumping screwballs losing their political clout and influence over the republicans is very iffy at the present time. Granted the rapid decline of the religious right is long overdue, but in order for that to happen we have to start educating the people about the true facts behind all these religious beliefs. We have to successfully demonstrate to them that religious beliefs are based on fear, superstition, and ignorance. Until we do that, the USA will continue to resemble a third world country in its embracing religion and irrational thought. No other developed first world country comes close to the USA in its embracing religion, even Australia, Canada, and the United Kingdom are far less religious than we are in this country despite all our strong influence in those and other developed countries. Even heavily catholic countries like Spain, France, Poland, Hungary, and Italy are no where near as religious as the good ol' USA. A good, well-advanced, secular education is the primary key to breaking American society permanently free of all this religion and the hateful, narrow-minded, backward values that it instills in peoples minds.
  • Starboard

    Posts: 242

    Jan 08, 2008 12:25 AM GMT
    I think that Huckabee's success in Iowa last week is indicative that the evangelicals who helped carry Bush through two elections are ready to separate from their GOP masters. When Huckabee isn't talking about social issues, he sounds like a Democrat (anti-corporate America, being the guy who "works with you, not the guy who laid you off", etc.).

    It seems like the evangelicals have finally woken up to the fact that while the GOP was happy to take their votes and their support, they were not interested in really enforcing their agenda of social issues.

    Now, it's a question of whether the GOP can be viable without the support of evangelical demographic. The fight between Romney and Huckabee will provide the answer...or it may push forward a more moderate compromise in McCain.
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    Jan 08, 2008 12:41 AM GMT
    Well, I don't think that the point of the article was grasped. It was more about the way that the republican machine that used the religious right is falling apart. And because of that, conservatism is going to find it's true nature instead of this machine Rove/Bush built (as MunchingZombie astutely pointed out). This has little or nothing to do with the validity of religion (of which some of you are woefully ignorant, despite you supposed "experiences" with it) but is about the possibility that Huckabee's existence and success in this campaign is the harbinger of real conservatism rather than the kind that brings out votes.

    Whether or not religion is valid is irrelevant to the point, I think. The point is the system is not going to allow overt pandering anymore because the GOP cannot control the Religious Right.
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    Jan 08, 2008 12:48 AM GMT
    The RR will eventually resort, more, to the kinds of tactics that other religious fanatics use. Namely, terrorism. Some already have. Abortion clinic bombings come to mind. If the RR loses it's grip on the Gays On Potties party (GOP, teehee), the shit will hit the fan. Carry your umbrellas, friends.
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    Jan 08, 2008 12:52 AM GMT
    The point seems to be someday, long from now, when democrats and republicans debate it will be their difference over economy, health, federal power, etc.... Rather than debate over if they accept evolution or not.
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    Jan 08, 2008 12:54 AM GMT
    Exactly, Trance.

    And also, I don't think that the RR will put up a fight. Look how quickly Pat Robertson supported Guiliani. I don't think we can expect terrorism from them. Let's not demonize people (beyond how they demonize themselves, of course).
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    Jan 08, 2008 12:56 AM GMT
    Funny you should say demonize in this context. I do think we can expect acts of terrorism from them, because we already have experienced them.
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    Jan 08, 2008 1:00 AM GMT
    How do we know a person who bombs an abortion clinic is a republican? He/She could be a registered democrat or independent. Both can also believe in the supernatural.
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    Jan 08, 2008 1:02 AM GMT
    While I concede that abortion clinic bombings happened, I don't know of any Christian that supported them. And on top of that, Christian doctrines don't allow for murders like that. There are significant doctinal differences between Islam and Christianity that people exploit to do that. That guy was just off his rocker. You wouldn't say all PhD holders are terrorists because of Ted Kazinsky, would you?
  • HndsmKansan

    Posts: 16311

    Jan 08, 2008 1:20 AM GMT
    Jarhead!!! Truely intriguing... A left leaning Episcopal.. .we need to talk!

    Sickofthesame: Excellent thread, Glad to see it.