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In many ways the people now rushing to Haiti, should hang their heads in shame.

  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:13 PM GMT
    Yeah, I agree. Sick of people from the House of Representatives, I mean come on, saying that there going over there to help.

    Really! Really!

    What is a Congressman going to do to help that rescue workers haven't already handled? I don't see some politician getting his fingernails dirty picking up debris or using construction equipment.
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:18 PM GMT
    waxon said
    America does not agree with alot of countries and we might not get along, but we will help when tragedy strikes. Its what we do."

    I try to steer clear of politics, but really, Pattison! If the Thais and Italians felt the way you did they wouldn't have cashed our tsunami and earthquake checks. Heaven help Australia!

    The U.S. and the world should be particularly commended for their relief efforts since as soon as their direct intervention ends so much more of the donated money will wind up in the pockets of the infamously corrupt Haitian government officials. While that government didn't cause the earthquake it's responsible for the lack of infrastructure impeding the survival of many victims. Yes, it could be argued that the U.S and other nations could have taken a greater role in Haiti's governance but increased American involvement in foreign affairs hasn't been met without international criticism since the Marshall Plan. Why not switch gears and criticize the HAITIAN government?


    Red_Vespa said
    What annoys me most, as a US citizen, is his obsession with pontificating on my own country."

    I'm sorry Pattison but I have to agree with Red_Vespa. Even new to the boards I immediately noticed a common pattern to your threads - subtle and none too subtle criticisms of the U.S. We get it already! But wouldn't your agenda be better served by starting a political blog instead of airing your anti-American sentiments on RealJock? Your expertise here on other matters would prove more valuable.
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:20 PM GMT
    Pattison said
    Jockbod48 saidHas anyone done more - to cause guys to leave this site - than Pattison? icon_mad.gif



    If anyone left because of me, it would be because they are fair left wacos, who are only able to be in the same room as people who agree with them, because they don't want their thoughts challenged. They wwant to feel they are right in their thinking. But look at all the people that has left because of their hatful abuse; GG being one of them.




    Yea I've been noticing that a lot on here..
  • dfrourke Posts: 1061
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:33 PM GMT
    The US has been one of Haiti's largest economic contributers for almost my entire life...

    "The U.S. has been Haiti's largest donor since 1973. Between FY 1995 and FY 2003, the U.S. contributed more than $850 million in assistance to Haiti. Since 2004, the U.S. has provided over $600 million for improving governance, security, the rule of law, economic recovery, and critical human needs. The President's budget request for FY 2007 was $198 million. U.S. Government funds have been used to support programs that have addressed a variety of problems."

    You can find this and other helpful information at the State Department website and why Haiti,as a fledgling democracy, is important to the United States.

    http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/1982.htm

    - David
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:37 PM GMT
    Pattison does have salient points regarding the attention span for Haiti. It's been the red-haired stepchild of the aid "industry" for decades now. Every time there is an international disaster such as this, there's no shortage of helping hands. But when it comes to sustainable long term solutions for constant political mismanagement, environmental degradation, and corruption, there is no shortage of badly managed good intentions.

    A good example is the Haitian pot-bellied pig.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creole_Pig
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:41 PM GMT
    Yes... Unfortunately though a lot of money that is donated gets snatched up by crooks (politicians) there, and nothing goes to the people.. Had the government actually did right by the people, things wouldn't be as bad as they are.

    Hopefully when Haiti is rebuilt, this is changed.

  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:42 PM GMT
    dfrourke saidThe US has been one of Haiti's largest economic contributers for almost my entire life...

    "The U.S. has been Haiti's largest donor since 1973. Between FY 1995 and FY 2003, the U.S. contributed more than $850 million in assistance to Haiti. Since 2004, the U.S. has provided over $600 million for improving governance, security, the rule of law, economic recovery, and critical human needs. The President's budget request for FY 2007 was $198 million. U.S. Government funds have been used to support programs that have addressed a variety of problems."

    You can find this and other helpful information at the State Department website and why Haiti,as a fledgling democracy, is important to the United States.

    http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/1982.htm

    - David


    Your insertion of facts is repugnant. Have you no decency, sir?

    icon_wink.gif
  • dfrourke Posts: 1061
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:42 PM GMT
    north_runner saidPattison does have salient points regarding the attention span for Haiti. It's been the red-haired stepchild of the aid "industry" for decades now. Every time there is an international disaster such as this, there's no shortage of helping hands. But when it comes to sustainable long term solutions for constant political mismanagement, environmental degradation, and corruption, there is no shortage of badly managed good intentions.

    A good example is the Haitian pot-bellied pig.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creole_Pig


    I will concede on this point, mismanagement of funds, corruption, all have been chronic issues in Haiti's history...however, I don't agree with the OP's assertion that this was a bandwagon everyone just jumped on...

    - David icon_wink.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:48 PM GMT
    dfrourke said
    north_runner saidPattison does have salient points regarding the attention span for Haiti. It's been the red-haired stepchild of the aid "industry" for decades now. Every time there is an international disaster such as this, there's no shortage of helping hands. But when it comes to sustainable long term solutions for constant political mismanagement, environmental degradation, and corruption, there is no shortage of badly managed good intentions.

    A good example is the Haitian pot-bellied pig.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creole_Pig


    I will concede on this point, mismanagement of funds, corruption, all have been chronic issues in Haiti's history...however, I don't agree with the OP's assertion that this was a bandwagon everyone just jumped on...

    - David icon_wink.gif


    But that is your right to disagree, but why? They do it all the time, get in the way to promote themselves. I've done my bite and not being a celeb, or politician, it's not self serving, as I'm not on TV promoting myself.
  • DJ_Lauderdale Posts: 4032
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:51 PM GMT
    Pattison said
    dfrourke said
    north_runner saidPattison does have salient points regarding the attention span for Haiti. It's been the red-haired stepchild of the aid "industry" for decades now. Every time there is an international disaster such as this, there's no shortage of helping hands. But when it comes to sustainable long term solutions for constant political mismanagement, environmental degradation, and corruption, there is no shortage of badly managed good intentions.

    A good example is the Haitian pot-bellied pig.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creole_Pig


    I will concede on this point, mismanagement of funds, corruption, all have been chronic issues in Haiti's history...however, I don't agree with the OP's assertion that this was a bandwagon everyone just jumped on...

    - David icon_wink.gif


    But that is your right to disagree, but why? They do it all the time, get in the way to promote themselves. I've done my bite and not being a celeb, or politician, it's not self serving, as I'm not on TV promoting myself.



    Celebs have a big stage. RealJock is your little stage and you've promoted your donations very clearly right here in this forum.

  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:51 PM GMT
    To all the people disagreeing with me, and thats your right, I'm happy for that as it opens up the forum to discussion. Now the majority of people we are seeing on TV from Hollywood are openly left wing, and you support them. Would you give the same support if they where mostly right wing doing exactly the same thing? We know the answer, but since I've asked to can reply. I point would be the same if they were all right wing.
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:55 PM GMT
    So, Pattison, if they'd agree to hang their heads in shame for doing something (vs. you, who are doing nothing other than criticizing from afar, which does zero to help Haitians) - would you agree to pull your head out of your ass?

    Fair trade?
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 10:59 PM GMT
    djdorchester said
    Pattison said
    dfrourke said
    north_runner saidPattison does have salient points regarding the attention span for Haiti. It's been the red-haired stepchild of the aid "industry" for decades now. Every time there is an international disaster such as this, there's no shortage of helping hands. But when it comes to sustainable long term solutions for constant political mismanagement, environmental degradation, and corruption, there is no shortage of badly managed good intentions.

    A good example is the Haitian pot-bellied pig.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creole_Pig


    I will concede on this point, mismanagement of funds, corruption, all have been chronic issues in Haiti's history...however, I don't agree with the OP's assertion that this was a bandwagon everyone just jumped on...

    - David icon_wink.gif


    But that is your right to disagree, but why? They do it all the time, get in the way to promote themselves. I've done my bite and not being a celeb, or politician, it's not self serving, as I'm not on TV promoting myself.



    Celebs have a big stage. RealJock is your little stage and you've promoted your donations very clearly right here in this forum.



    Yes and that was relevant, and other have dismissed it as being nothing because they perceive me as being White and privliged, and if I had of stated I've not given on cent because my government paid my donation out of my taxers, I would of been a target for abuse too. Also Haiti is along way away from my Island Oz too. Bu then you have a deep seated contempt for me because of the differences I've pointed out between bisexual and homosexuals who have lived their whole lives as such, and never had a wife to hide behind. yet I have no issues with bisexuals either, and one of the people I have the deepest respect for here at RJ, has had a wife, and has a child too.
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:03 PM GMT
    badmikeyt saidSo, Pattison, if they'd agree to hang their heads in shame for doing something (vs. you, who are doing nothing other than criticizing from afar, which does zero to help Haitians) - would you agree to pull your head out of your ass?

    Fair trade?


    No because I have been proactive in doing something. I've givern up my hard earned cash that I was putting away for a trip to Hawai'i next year, and I'm not getting in the way for a photo op, and you have the choice to block one too.

    How about never, is never good for you?
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:03 PM GMT
    Pattison saidTo all the people disagreeing with me, and thats your right, I'm happy for that as it opens up the forum to discussion. Now the majority of people we are seeing on TV from Hollywood are openly left wing, and you support them. Would you give the same support if they where mostly right wing doing exactly the same thing? We know the answer, but since I've asked to can reply. I point would be the same if they were all right wing.


    Yes, I think I can speak for most when I say we'd support the right as much as we're supporting the left. The problem is, not many on the right care about anyone other than themselves.
  • DJ_Lauderdale Posts: 4032
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:03 PM GMT
    Pattison said
    djdorchester said
    Pattison said
    dfrourke said
    north_runner saidPattison does have salient points regarding the attention span for Haiti. It's been the red-haired stepchild of the aid "industry" for decades now. Every time there is an international disaster such as this, there's no shortage of helping hands. But when it comes to sustainable long term solutions for constant political mismanagement, environmental degradation, and corruption, there is no shortage of badly managed good intentions.

    A good example is the Haitian pot-bellied pig.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creole_Pig


    I will concede on this point, mismanagement of funds, corruption, all have been chronic issues in Haiti's history...however, I don't agree with the OP's assertion that this was a bandwagon everyone just jumped on...

    - David icon_wink.gif


    But that is your right to disagree, but why? They do it all the time, get in the way to promote themselves. I've done my bite and not being a celeb, or politician, it's not self serving, as I'm not on TV promoting myself.



    Celebs have a big stage. RealJock is your little stage and you've promoted your donations very clearly right here in this forum.



    Yes and that was relevant, and other have dismissed it as being nothing because they perceive me as being White and privliged, and if I had of stated I've not given on cent because my government paid my donation out of my taxers, I would of been a target for abuse too. Also Haiti is along way away from my Island Oz too. Bu then you have a deep seated contempt for me because of the differences I've pointed out between bisexual and homosexuals who have lived their whole lives as such, and never had a wife to hide behind. yet I have no issues with bisexuals either, and one of the people I have the deepest respect for here at RJ, has had a wife, and has a child too.



    Seriously, have you been drinking? You sound like a rambling drunk.

  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:03 PM GMT
    sexylatinboi saidYeah, I agree. Sick of people from the House of Representatives, I mean come on, saying that there going over there to help.

    Really! Really!

    What is a Congressman going to do to help that rescue workers haven't already handled? I don't see some politician getting his fingernails dirty picking up debris or using construction equipment.

    um... Congress authorizes emergency appropriations of money. It also oversees how taxpayer money is being spent. The President can only spend or redirect such money as Congress has appropriated, within the limits previously set by Congress.

    A Member of the House would go to Haiti to evaluate what additional money is needed and where, and if money already spent has been used properly. These are basic Constitutional functions of Congress. Whether or not individual Members of Congress exploit that legitimate function for political purposes is a different question.
  • dfrourke Posts: 1061
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:05 PM GMT
    Pattison saidTo all the people disagreeing with me, and thats your right, I'm happy for that as it opens up the forum to discussion. Now the majority of people we are seeing on TV from Hollywood are openly left wing, and you support them. Would you give the same support if they where mostly right wing doing exactly the same thing? We know the answer, but since I've asked to can reply. I point would be the same if they were all right wing.


    Well, in 1973 Richard Nixon was POTUS and a Republican...so his administration [and maybe even his party] gets credit for being Haiti's biggest foreign aid supporter...I am unclear about your point on this matter.

    Did you have a similar point when the world [including the US] rushed to the support of Indonesia with the Tsunami of 2004?

    - David
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:07 PM GMT
    IHG84 saidYes... Unfortunately though a lot of money that is donated gets snatched up by crooks (politicians) there, and nothing goes to the people.. Had the government actually did right by the people, things wouldn't be as bad as they are.

    Hopefully when Haiti is rebuilt, this is changed.



    I pray you are right.

    I remember years ago buying final records, for feed the world. We are the world, we are the children,we are ones to make a better place so lets start giving.

    I got my vinyl record as did millions of other , and they made millions to then find out that most of the cash,went to administration fees. I struggle with this concept regally with the month donations I make to community aide abroad and a few others. You have hit a sad point of truth, and that the thing with the truth, it's not always nice.
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:08 PM GMT
    Time to go and make a pot of tea.
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:08 PM GMT
    djdorchester said
    Pattison saidBut that is your right to disagree, but why? They do it all the time, get in the way to promote themselves. I've done my bite [sic] and not being a celeb, or politician, it's not self serving, as I'm not on TV promoting myself.



    Celebs have a big stage. RealJock is your little stage and you've promoted your donations very clearly right here in this forum.

    OUCH!!! icon_eek.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:10 PM GMT
    McGay saidY'know, when you're at the zoo and the monkey is flinging his poop at you, you probably avoid the monkey exhibit. This is a little like that where you kind of look at the monkey with a resigned grimace because he's not smart enough to fling his poop at zoo visitors and instead just rolls around in his own poop. That patticakes. He's RJ's inhouse rolls-around-in-his-own-shit monkey.


    You always seem to make me smile icon_biggrin.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:18 PM GMT
    IHG84 saidActually he has a point, and they should hang their heads in shame... There are a lot of politicians rushing on over there to get a photo op, which is sickening.. My brother who was called over there to help, told me that's part of the problem.. Too many people trying to get in there, and they get in the way.

    When I was watching Fox News Sunday, Bush and Clinton ...


    That's when I stopped reading. I'm sorry, but I couldn't go on.

    I'm wondering if I could use you for a few days around my home. I have a lot of heavy lifting that needs to be done. You need not speak. No, not a word. Just move some equipment, dig a hole for my pond and push some boulders around.
  • dfrourke Posts: 1061
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:18 PM GMT


    QUOTE AUTHOR GOES HEREI got my vinyl record as did millions of other , and they made millions to then find out that most of the cash,went to administration fees.


    Could you please provide a source for this comment...I have information about the USA for Africa Foundation which seems to contradict your assertion...

    - David

  • Posted by a hidden member.Log in to view his profile
    QUOTE Jan 19, 2010 11:21 PM GMT
    reppaT said
    Pattison saidTo all the people disagreeing with me, and thats your right, I'm happy for that as it opens up the forum to discussion. Now the majority of people we are seeing on TV from Hollywood are openly left wing, and you support them. Would you give the same support if they where mostly right wing doing exactly the same thing? We know the answer, but since I've asked to can reply. I point would be the same if they were all right wing.


    Yes, I think I can speak for most when I say we'd support the right as much as we're supporting the left. The problem is, not many on the right care about anyone other than themselves.


    There are many on the left, who care about no one but themselves as well.. It goes both ways mate... They only thing they care for are power, and their little ideologies.. Not gonna find that in just one party, or more on one side...

    Each side just shows it in different ways.. Its sad when people spend so much time demonizing one side, and don't realize both do it and we play into their hands when we fight with each other.