Islam (like other religions) is a glorious, peaceful religion that is safe for children and small furry animals.

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    Mar 11, 2010 8:29 PM GMT
    1000 lashes for being gay

    1000 fucking lashes. Fuck you Saudi Arabia and Islam for this and for WTC. Go fuck yourselves royally.

    In other words, this beautiful, accepting, warm, system of beliefs is a good system to instill in people from an early age. In fact, it's founder, Mohammed, instilled his belief deeply, throbbingly, into his 9 year old (some say 6 year old) bride in their conjugal bed. It's hard to fathom that such a belief system isn't accepted by everyone on the planet. Don't people love their children?
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:00 PM GMT
    I'm sure there are some good people that practice Islam, but their extreme beliefs and even some of the core beliefs are loony and barbaric, in my opinion. Yes. Lashing someone because of their sexual orientation makes a lot of sense. Almost as much sense as stoning a rape victim to death for...well, being raped.

    The scary part - this portion of the world population is growing rapidly while the other more sane, civilized parts are shrinking.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:11 PM GMT
    Do not attack a faith based on the interpretations of a few adherents. I have issues with Radical Islam but I don't attack Islam itself. Responding in anger never resolved anything.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:19 PM GMT
    Well, I could see slapping him for the cheesiness of the video, but...
    This is bullshit and this isn't the extremism of a "few individuals" this is government policy dictated by religious extremists, the same nation that provided fifteen of the twenty 9/11 conspirators.

    Personally I wouldn't insult donkeys with this charge.
  • gymguy81

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    Mar 11, 2010 10:20 PM GMT
    all religion has its radicals do we need to target a whole religion based soley on the views of the radicals?
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:21 PM GMT
    McGay said1000 lashes for being gay

    1000 fucking lashes. Fuck you Saudi Arabia and Islam for this and for WTC. Go fuck yourselves royally.

    Now, now. The Saudis are the darlings of US Republicans. And the Saudi Royal family the personal friends of the Bushes, both pere et fils. What's 1000 lashes among friends?
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:22 PM GMT
    gymguy81 saidall religion has its radicals do we need to target a whole religion based soley on the views of the radicals?


    No. We're targeting a nation held hostage by religious extremists. This wasn't some religious nutcase lashing this poor kid, it was the result of a distorted judicial system.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:23 PM GMT
    gymguy81 saidall religion has its radicals do we need to target a whole religion based soley on the views of the radicals?

    Only when the radicals are in charge, and call the shots. How did this happen, if the radicals don't have the approval of the majority of Saudi Muslims?
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:24 PM GMT
    Joe52 said
    gymguy81 saidall religion has its radicals do we need to target a whole religion based soley on the views of the radicals?


    No. We're targeting a nation held hostage by religious extremists. This wasn't some religious nutcase lashing this poor kid, it was the result of a distorted judicial system.


    Many people say the same about us. Once oil is gone, there will be an uprising. Just calm down and bide your time.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:26 PM GMT
    agri_sci said
    Joe52 said
    gymguy81 saidall religion has its radicals do we need to target a whole religion based soley on the views of the radicals?

    No. We're targeting a nation held hostage by religious extremists. This wasn't some religious nutcase lashing this poor kid, it was the result of a distorted judicial system.

    Many people say the same about us. Once oil is gone, there will be an uprising. Just calm down and bide your time.

    Cold comfort for that young gay man about to get 1000 lashes.
  • HereNBoston

    Posts: 221

    Mar 11, 2010 10:28 PM GMT
    I get annoyed when we are supposed to respect religions despite barbaric acts sanctioned by them. female circumcision, the inquisition, terrorism, war... or a 1000 lashes for homosexual acts. People need to understand that the nature of religion brings about these behaviors. It's simply an effort towards supremacy and power which is the goal of every religion, and they do it by promising "inner piece" or pleasure in the afterlife or whatever else.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:29 PM GMT
    agri_sci said
    Joe52 said
    gymguy81 saidall religion has its radicals do we need to target a whole religion based soley on the views of the radicals?


    No. We're targeting a nation held hostage by religious extremists. This wasn't some religious nutcase lashing this poor kid, it was the result of a distorted judicial system.


    Many people say the same about us. Once oil is gone, there will be an uprising. Just calm down and bide your time.


    A lot of folks are fighting hard to keep the religious right extremists out of the courts and out of the legislatures. there's no corollary, yet, between, the Wahabists control of the Saudi government at all levels and a the religious right's moves on the US government and we have a constitutional protection against "cruel and unusual punishment."

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    Mar 11, 2010 10:30 PM GMT
    HereNBoston saidI get annoyed when we are supposed to respect religions despite barbaric acts sanctioned by them. female circumcision, the inquisition, terrorism, war... or a 1000 lashes for homosexual acts. People need to understand that the nature of religion brings about these behaviors. It's simply an effort towards supremacy and power which is the goal of every religion, and they do it by promising "inner piece" or pleasure in the afterlife or whatever else.


    Not true of all faiths...its Christianity and Islam.

    Red Vespa: I think that Stalin said that one death is a tragedy, a million is a statistic. As HORRIBLE as this is, what do you propose we do? Invade the Middle East?
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:31 PM GMT
    Joe52 said
    agri_sci said
    Joe52 said
    gymguy81 saidall religion has its radicals do we need to target a whole religion based soley on the views of the radicals?


    No. We're targeting a nation held hostage by religious extremists. This wasn't some religious nutcase lashing this poor kid, it was the result of a distorted judicial system.


    Many people say the same about us. Once oil is gone, there will be an uprising. Just calm down and bide your time.


    A lot of folks are fighting hard to keep the religious right extremists out of the courts and out of the legislatures. there's no corollary, yet, between, the Wahabists control of the Saudi government at all levels and a the religious right's moves on the US government and we have a constitutional protection against "cruel and unusual punishment."



    I never said it was a fair comparison...just one I have heard. Alot of sucky political comparisons made on RJ anyhow...
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:32 PM GMT
    agri_sci said
    HereNBoston saidI get annoyed when we are supposed to respect religions despite barbaric acts sanctioned by them. female circumcision, the inquisition, terrorism, war... or a 1000 lashes for homosexual acts. People need to understand that the nature of religion brings about these behaviors. It's simply an effort towards supremacy and power which is the goal of every religion, and they do it by promising "inner piece" or pleasure in the afterlife or whatever else.


    Not true of all faiths...its Christianity and Islam.

    Red Vespa: I think that Stalin said that one death is a tragedy, a million is a statistic. As HORRIBLE as this is, what do you propose we do? Invade the Middle East?


    The issue here is a toxic religious belief that has infected and controlled the entire governmental system. And short of invading, we can stop our military and political support of the corrupt Saudi government.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:34 PM GMT
    JASFIT saidI'm sure there are some good people that practice Islam, but their extreme beliefs and even some of the core beliefs are loony and barbaric, in my opinion. Yes. Lashing someone because of their sexual orientation makes a lot of sense. Almost as much sense as stoning a rape victim to death for...well, being raped.

    The scary part - this portion of the world population is growing rapidly while the other more sane, civilized parts are shrinking.



    lets make a colony of educated people! whos with?
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:34 PM GMT
    oy. I dread topics like this simply because of people's misconceptions about Islam.

    yes, the act of what was done is barbaric. yes, the Saudi regime is brutal and oppressive. However, you cannot take the actions and inhumanity of the Saudi Arabian regime and brand it "Islam". Even so, the Saudi branding of Islam is a strict Wahabbist Sunni brand, a very specific type of radical Islam.

    Let's also not forget that the number one sponsor of Saudi Arabia is the United States, (which also is the number one sponsor of Uganda and their kill-homosexuals proposal), closely followed the UK.

    In fact, Saudi Arabia was created by the British ("Lawrence of Arabia"), following World War I, when the British then gave a mandate to the Ibn Saud family to create a kingdom under their family in Arabia, thus naming it after the family patriarch, Saudi Arabia. Since World War II, the United States has taken over the spot of the British as the primary sponsors of the Saudis.

    It's neither fair nor accurate to brand Islam as "backwards", "barbaric", or "uncivilized". These are Orientalist assumptions, and are routed in colonial discourse and racist theories. Orientalism serves as a justification for imperialism; since you describe a people or culture as the "Other", barbaric, backwards, uncivilized, you can thus justify your presence in their countries as a "civilizing mission", a humanitarian endeavour, or "war for freedom". This has been the case regarding western discourse of places like the Middle East and Africa for over 200 years.

    Islam is in reality subject to so much variety, a plethora of sub-sects, different views, practices, beliefs, that to make any such statement as "Islam is extreme" is beyond ignorant.

    Also, it shows ignorance to the growth of extremist Islam in the region and the world. This was not something that sprung organically from madrassas and Islamic communities; it's growth was entirely linked to the Western strategy in the region. In the 1960s and going into the 1970s, various nations were attempting largely socialist projects of governance. Afghanistan had an extremely progressive government in the 1970s; they had a democratic government, women were in government, they could drive, they were being educated, the people were by and large in favour of the government and its reforms. However, there were tribal leaders in the country who were opposed to this. The United States changed its strategy in the late 70s, to that of supporting radical Islamic groups.

    Afghanistan, being a rather socialist government, had close ties to the Soviet Union, so naturally it became an enemy of the United States. So the US, with its allies in Britain, Saudi Arabia, and Pakistan, heavily funded, armed, and trained the Afghan tribal leaders into warlords, which began fighting against the Afghan government. The Soviets intervened, and then the Afghan-Soviet war was underway from 1979-1989. The CIA, working with British, Saudi and Pakistani intelligence, armed, trained and funded 100,000 radical mujahideen fighters between 1986-1992.

    The Soviets withdrew in 1989 as the USSR collapsed. Subsequently, a new group emerged in Afghanistan, known as the Taliban. The CIA, working through Pakistani intelligence - the Inter Services Intelligence (ISI), created, funded, and armed the Taliban until 2001, when they again changed their mind about who should be in power in Afghanistan. Around the same time the Taliban were rising up, a pseudo-organization known as al-Qaeda began to emerge. Al-Qaeda actually means "the database", referring to the list of CIA and British intelligence assets used and created during the Afghan-Soviet war.

    Covert US assistance for al-Qaeda lasted into the 1990s, such as the training of radicals at the alkifah center in Brooklyn. During the break up of Yugoslavia, US intelligence agencies, working with other western intelligence agencies (such as those of Britain and Germany), were covertly supporting the Bosnian Muslims, and later the Kosovar Albanians against Serbia. To do this, they brought in their intelligence assets from "Al-Qaeda" (the "database"), and funded terrorists to aid in the succession of these countries from Yugoslavia. Osama bin Laden was even involved in this process.

    Even today, the CIA funds an al-Qaeda organization which is orchestrating terrorist attacks inside of Iran. The groups name is Jundullah, and it is run by a former high-level al-Qaeda asset.

    The routes of radical Islam and the barbarism of events like 9/11, rest more on the shoulders of covert western imperial strategies than in the substance of Islam. These practices are a perversion of Islam. So perhaps before going and blaming "Islam", one should maybe look into what it is they are really trying to seek blame for.

    Using words such as "barbaric", "backwards", and "uncivilized", only harks back to old imperial rhetoric and is grounded in racist, Orientalist assumptions which have been widely discredited. Besides, how "civilized" are our western nations who made it their goal to foster, finance, arm, and aid the spread of radical Islam, who wage war on the poorest countries in the world, who deny countries in famine the ability to grow food, who declare an election in a foreign country to be "fraud" and a coup in a foreign country to be "democracy"; how civilized are we in the way our nations act in the world?

    If this is a contest of morality, barbarism, and humanity... we lose every time.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:35 PM GMT
    JASFIT said
    agri_sci saidDo not attack a faith based on the interpretations of a few adherents. I have issues with Radical Islam but I don't attack Islam itself. Responding in anger never resolved anything.


    Sadly, it's definitely more than a few...more like millions. What's concerning to me is the lack of outrage and appearance of complacency by the non-radical Islamic people with regard to the actions of lunatic radicals.


    Vocal moderates are killed or exiled. Period.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:35 PM GMT
    Joe52 said...we have a constitutional protection against "cruel and unusual punishment."

    That's worked really well in Gitmo, where we also disregarded our international treaty obligations, like the Geneva Convention. Our Constitution is only as good as the people who uphold it. After 8 years of Bush and a Republican-appointed Supreme Court, our Constitution might as well be written on a chalk board.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:35 PM GMT
    Pray tell. What makes a gay leftest, any better who wishes one harm, because one does not live by the rules they feel should be enforced on planet earth, or behold their belief system? Or those who have gone out of their way in an attempt to hurt one by starting threads of hate. What makes their brand of hate any better or kinder, or even right?

    They are still out to hurt gay men!
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:36 PM GMT
    agri_sci saidDo not attack a faith based on the interpretations of a few adherents. I have issues with Radical Islam but I don't attack Islam itself. Responding in anger never resolved anything.


    Blow it out yer ass. It's as evil as christianity.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:36 PM GMT
    JASFIT said
    agri_sci saidDo not attack a faith based on the interpretations of a few adherents. I have issues with Radical Islam but I don't attack Islam itself. Responding in anger never resolved anything.


    Sadly, it's definitely more than a few...more like millions. What's concerning to me is the lack of outrage and appearance of complacency by the non-radical Islamic people with regard to the actions of lunatic radicals.


    No one dares speak up in Saudi Arabia. It's not even as open as Iran, sad to say.
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:39 PM GMT
    McGay said1000 lashes for being gay

    1000 fucking lashes. Fuck you Saudi Arabia and Islam for this and for WTC. Go fuck yourselves royally.


    THE VIDEO WAS GOOD. THEY ARE BASTARDS FOR DOING THAT. STOP THE HATE!!!
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:41 PM GMT
    This world is a damn mess!

    End it now!
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    Mar 11, 2010 10:44 PM GMT
    I usually don't say much about another person's reliigion, but I find it very hard to relate to a person who has those beliefs/