The death of Macho

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    Mar 28, 2010 5:24 AM GMT
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704100604575145810050665030.html

    Basically it says that women are into feminine guys when they feel secure and that healthcare compounds that effect.

    what will all the manly men do?
    do gays think the same way?

    Ive been wondering about what people feel about all of this, given this and other things like the fact the overwhelmingly majority of job losses are in "manly" sectors of the economy.

    Are we all doomed to become zac efron cooking cookies in the kitchen?
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    Mar 28, 2010 5:46 AM GMT
    This is a very different topic for gays. What men look for in a mate is a lot different than what women look for. And for gays, we aren't looking to have a guy's baby, we just want to be with him.

    Also, there is a lot of tension over femininity and masculinity with gays. I think it's safe to say that masculine gay men will be just fine, at least for the time being.

    I wonder if the same sort of tension exists between lesbians? The whole femininity over masculinity thing.
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    Mar 28, 2010 6:13 AM GMT
    carthesis saidAre we all doomed to become zac efron cooking cookies in the kitchen?

    And what is wrong with making cookies? since when is it "feminine" to cook??

    I can bake, clean, arrange flowers, work with wood, rebuild an engine, mow lawns, take care of kiddies (even though I want to kill them) dress nicely, handle a gun (even though I despise guns) fight, get a massage, facial (the nice relaxing one, not the tension release), get a manicure (but not a pedicure) and sew my self a pretty little dinner gown...

    I see no problem with any of it

    Well, maybe with the engine rebuild, I get grease under my nails and it's ever such a bitch to remove properly and it makes my hands all rough icon_sad.gif

    Personally I couldn't give a damn what people want in a partner, all I care about is what the guy I want needs and wants in a partner and if I'm honestly capable of meeting those needs.. mostly needs really, most guys don't really know what they need only what they want and what they need and what they want usually don't run very parallel.
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    Mar 28, 2010 6:31 AM GMT
    I've always appreciated feminine and masculine qualities in people. I don't see the big deal in a bunch of macho men turning in to guys that know how to cook and sew or whatever, but that's just me. It's only a big deal if you make it a big deal I guess.
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    Mar 28, 2010 6:41 AM GMT
    I think balance should exist. Be feminine when you need to, be masculine when you need to. Personally, I am more attracted to the masculine guys. To me masculine is he who understands that feminine characteristics will not confuse him into a new androgynous type of lifestyle. I disagree when guys wear make up... guys that cross dress... guys that feel they should have been a woman and speak in a very effeminate tone and style. Posture is important to me and totally feels unattracted to a guy that wants to walk like Beyonce on the runway "booty shakin her thang" ...

    I guess the macho image dies to he/she who wishes to kill it.
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    Mar 28, 2010 7:43 AM GMT
    TrowelMonger said

    I wonder if the same sort of tension exists between lesbians? The whole femininity over masculinity thing.


    Yes, it does. The lesbians that I have encountered feel like feminine lesbians aren't real lesbians, and will go back with men. Some of the "studs" I know don't feel like women should please them sexually, and don't want to be touched. It is some craziness that even I don't understand.
  • Bunjamon

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    Mar 28, 2010 8:51 AM GMT
    To me, "macho" is synonymous with "douge bag." Being comfortable with your masculinity means that you can do things that society deems "feminine" without feeling threatened or immasculated, like many of the things lilTanker mentioned. Since society is becoming more and more aware (and tolerant) of fluid gender roles, like stay-at-home dads, female firefighters, male nurses, and yes, big, burly, hairy, MACHO men who like pop music or know how to knit, we don't have to worry about this crap anymore.

    Don't think of it as "doom," think of it as "evolution."
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    Mar 28, 2010 3:21 PM GMT
    TrowelMonger saidThis is a very different topic for gays. What men look for in a mate is a lot different than what women look for. And for gays, we aren't looking to have a guy's baby, we just want to be with him.

    Also, there is a lot of tension over femininity and masculinity with gays. I think it's safe to say that masculine gay men will be just fine, at least for the time being.

    I wonder if the same sort of tension exists between lesbians? The whole femininity over masculinity thing.


    I disagree. In terms of a good relationship, two men together or a man and a woman generaly are looking for the same thing.

    love, security, understanding, acceptance, validation, fun, intmacy, kindness, patience, companionship, etc.

    And a truly masculine man will be and act however he want to be without worrying about the artificial divide between masculine or feminine behavior. He expresses himself however he wants and feels comfortable around all types of people without being concerned about what other people will think of him.

    I've noticed some lesbians (like gay men) love to cling to those gender roles and play the part......dress the part etc.

    People are usually boring when they spend so much time being a personality type, rather than a person with a full range of emotons and feelings. When you try too hard to fit into a mold, you limit yourself and become rigid and predictable and forget your true self with the same needs as the rest of the human race.
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    Mar 28, 2010 6:40 PM GMT
    My philosophy's always been that the soul of masculinity lies in being comfortable with yourself. When you're self-confident, you're more masculine than anyone who goes out to sports bars and calls folks "brah" just to put up a facade. And if you happen to bake, what of it?
    Well, okay, when you wear the evening gown that you painstakingly Bedazzled and lipsynch to Beyonce, perhaps you aren't *entirely* masculine at that moment.

    It actually made me think of this article. Maybe as things progress, we're actually getting more masculine?

    http://thenewgay.net/2008/05/gay-acting-is-so-masculine.html
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    Mar 28, 2010 8:22 PM GMT
    KissingPro said
    TrowelMonger saidThis is a very different topic for gays. What men look for in a mate is a lot different than what women look for. And for gays, we aren't looking to have a guy's baby, we just want to be with him.

    Also, there is a lot of tension over femininity and masculinity with gays. I think it's safe to say that masculine gay men will be just fine, at least for the time being.

    I wonder if the same sort of tension exists between lesbians? The whole femininity over masculinity thing.


    I disagree. In terms of a good relationship, two men together or a man and a woman generaly are looking for the same thing.

    love, security, understanding, acceptance, validation, fun, intmacy, kindness, patience, companionship, etc.

    And a truly masculine man will be and act however he want to be without worrying about the artificial divide between masculine or feminine behavior. He expresses himself however he wants and feels comfortable around all types of people without being concerned about what other people will think of him.

    I've noticed some lesbians (like gay men) love to cling to those gender roles and play the part......dress the part etc.

    People are usually boring when they spend so much time being a personality type, rather than a person with a full range of emotons and feelings. When you try too hard to fit into a mold, you limit yourself and become rigid and predictable and forget your true self with the same needs as the rest of the human race.


    I was speaking more in scientific terms. The article mentioned how in theory women needed to be more selective when choosing who they slept with as they could possible have that man's child, whereas men's goal is to spread the seed around like crazy (again in theory). Obviously these roles change dramatically as society progresses, which in my opinion is a good thing.

    At the risk of being redundant, I'll try to re-explain myself. When I see a really attractive men, I don't think (even at some weird subconscious level) "I wanna have that guy's kid". I might possibly think "wow that is a guy I could settle down with and possible raise a family with". Our genetics would not be mixed no matter how hard we tried... and we would try, trust me.
    Does that make sense?