Another reason to love and defend religion.

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    Apr 11, 2010 12:15 PM GMT


    During the time of the Prophet, anytime two men were found together, they were taken to the top of a mountain and thrown off. If they didn't die when they hit the ground, then rocks would be thrown on them until they were killed.
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    Apr 11, 2010 5:12 PM GMT
    The only difference between America and Africa is that America has laws to punish people who do that.

    There are still people here who would like to do that if they could get away with it.
  • TexasBoeuf

    Posts: 68

    Apr 11, 2010 5:17 PM GMT
    There are still people here who would like to do that if they could get away with it.[/quote]

    The percentage would be a lot lower. Here it would be a few right wing crazies whereas in Africa...well check out Uganda.
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    Apr 11, 2010 5:29 PM GMT
    How horrific. Some of this hatred is imported by Christianity and some from Islam it seems. And still some people just turn away a let it happen.

    These massacres are as bad as any other human rights violation and yet some will say .. "oh gays don't have it that bad!" For some, it is a silent holocaust and a private hell

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36376840/ns/world_news-africa/Madieye Diallo's body had only been in the ground for a few hours when the mob descended on the weedy cemetery with shovels. They yanked out the corpse, spit on its torso, dragged it away and dumped it in front of the home of his elderly parents.

    The scene of May 2, 2009 was filmed on a cell phone and the video sold at the market. It passed from phone to phone, sowing panic among gay men who say they now feel like hunted animals.


    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36376840/ns/world_news-africa/page/2/"A man that's known as being a homosexual can't be buried in a cemetery. His body needs to be thrown away like trash," says Sene. "His parents knew that he was gay and they did nothing about it. So when he died we wanted to make sure he was punished."


    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36376840/ns/world_news-africa/A wave of intense homophobia is washing across Africa, where homosexuality is already illegal in at least 37 countries.

    In the last year alone, gay men have been arrested in Kenya, Malawi, Sierra Leone and Nigeria. In Uganda, lawmakers are considering a bill that would sentence homosexuals to life in prison and include capital punishment for 'repeat offenders.' And in South Africa, the only country that recognizes gay rights, gangs have carried out so-called "corrective" rapes on lesbians.

    "Across many parts of Africa, we've seen a rise in homophobic violence," says London-based gay-rights activist Peter Tatchell, whose organization tracks abuse against gays and lesbians in Africa. "It's been steadily building for the last 10 years but has got markedly worse in the last year."
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    Apr 11, 2010 5:56 PM GMT
    paulflexes saidThe only difference between America and Africa is that America has laws to punish people who do that.

    There are still people here who would like to do that if they could get away with it.


    Agree.
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    Apr 11, 2010 5:59 PM GMT
    Who even among gays these days even stops from time to time to think of all the gays who have suffered even anonymously persecution and death. Who even remembers those without anyone to care and remember them like those who were murdered in the holocaust, or those that suffered at the hand of the churches and so called "holy men".

    Acknowledgment can sometimes lead to a firm resolve.

    I would hope that gays most of all would pause from time to time and remember and pay respect to those that suffered and continue to do so.
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    Apr 11, 2010 6:06 PM GMT
    I have been going to church since i was a child and have been to dozens of churches and sat through hundreds of sermons,etc and i have never heard anyone talk about throwing gays off of mountain tops. Taking one irrelevant story line to justify being a atheist (like many of you do) falls in the category of excuses.

    What is talked about in mainstream religion is mainly positive life lessons and ways to be honest and treat other humans with respect,etc.

    God is great and that is something i would shout off of a mountatin top.icon_biggrin.gif
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    Apr 11, 2010 6:09 PM GMT
    paulflexes saidThe only difference between America and Africa is that America has laws to punish people who do that.


    Don't overgeneralize.

    South Africa has gay marriage. How does America compare in this regard?
  • trl_

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    Apr 11, 2010 6:12 PM GMT
    I really don't see how the opinion of one Imam in Senegal let's you generalize that all religion is hateful and inglorious. Cherry picking at its finest.
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    Apr 11, 2010 6:13 PM GMT
    PAstud21 saidI have been going to church since i was a child and have been to dozens of churches and sat through hundreds of sermons,etc and i have never heard anyone talk about throwing gays off of mountain tops. Taking one irrelevant story line to justify being a atheist (like many of you do) falls in the category of excuses.

    What is talked about in mainstream religion is mainly positive life lessons and ways to be honest and treat other humans with respect,etc.

    God is great and that is something i would shout off of a mountatin top.icon_biggrin.gif
    And these people would shout the same thing as they threw you from the mountain top.

    How dismissive you are.
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    Apr 11, 2010 6:14 PM GMT
    PAstud21 saidI have been going to church since i was a child and have been to dozens of churches and sat through hundreds of sermons,etc and i have never heard anyone talk about throwing gays off of mountain tops. Taking one irrelevant story line to justify being a atheist (like many of you do) falls in the category of excuses.


    Then you are picking and choosing. The fact that they do not say this in a sermon does not mean that it isn't part of your religion.

    Your god ordered the Israelites to commit genocide various times, when he didn't do it himself, to kill people who masturbate, to sleep with a guy and then impale him during the afterglow, etc. etc.

    It always amazes me how little so-called Christians actually know of their own religion.
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    Apr 11, 2010 6:15 PM GMT
    fizzle saidI really don't see how the opinion of one Imam in Senegal let's you generalize that all religion is hateful and inglorious. Cherry picking at its finest.
    Do you really think that this is One Imam? Did you not read the article? Does one imam influence 37 countries? Do you think these people were just born hating homosexuals? burying the head in the sand at it's finest icon_rolleyes.gif
  • Sk8Tex

    Posts: 738

    Apr 11, 2010 6:23 PM GMT
    Science will make people fly.

    Religion will make people fly into buildings.

    This is ignorance and hatred plain and simple.
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    Apr 11, 2010 6:25 PM GMT
    viveutvivas said
    paulflexes saidThe only difference between America and Africa is that America has laws to punish people who do that.


    Don't overgeneralize.

    South Africa has gay marriage. How does America compare in this regard?
    Parts of America also have gay marriage. Not to mention one of my long-time friends is from South Africa...and is married to a guy. icon_wink.gif
  • Delivis

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    Apr 11, 2010 6:32 PM GMT
    PAstud21 saidI have been going to church since i was a child and have been to dozens of churches and sat through hundreds of sermons,etc and i have never heard anyone talk about throwing gays off of mountain tops. Taking one irrelevant story line to justify being a atheist (like many of you do) falls in the category of excuses.

    What is talked about in mainstream religion is mainly positive life lessons and ways to be honest and treat other humans with respect,etc.

    God is great and that is something i would shout off of a mountatin top.icon_biggrin.gif


    I dont know of anyone that does not believe in god because of a single anecdote. If someone does I agree that is a bad reason. But I think for all intents and purposes that is a strawman.

    Keep in mind that your conception of what mainstream religion is is based on very liberal progressive and mostly Christian churches in the US. That is arguably not even the mainstream for the US as a whole. But more to the point that is certainly not the mainstream in Islam. The level of fundamentalism and literalism and hatred of all sorts of people, including gays, is very much higher than it is in your experience of religion.
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    Apr 11, 2010 6:33 PM GMT
    Eden said
    ActiveAndFit saidWho even among gays these days even stops from time to time to think of all the gays who have suffered even anonymously persecution and death. Who even remembers those without anyone to care and remember them like those who were murdered in the holocaust, or those that suffered at the hand of the churches and so called "holy men".

    Acknowledgment can sometimes lead to a firm resolve.

    I would hope that gays most of all would pause from time to time and remember and pay respect to those that suffered and continue to do so.

    To me, that should be the purpose of Gay Prides.
    You are right that should be a part of it, but I think we could afford to think about this whenever the issue of gay and human rights around the world comes up.

    In Germany and other parts of Europe gays have only recently gotten memorials for the thousands of Homosexuals that suffered during the holocaust -- after some 60 years when most of the survivors are dead and gone. Dismissive will do that .. that is cause people not to acknowledge crimes against humanity against certain groups of people.
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    Apr 11, 2010 6:34 PM GMT
    PAstud21 said
    God is great and that is something i would shout off of a mountatin top.icon_biggrin.gif


    with or without your face showing?
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    Apr 11, 2010 6:35 PM GMT
    "Another reason to love and defend religion" McGay chose to title this topic,

    McGay chose his words wisely.

    True faith is NOT a religion, it's a relationship with God through faith in Jesus Christ, the very same person who said to the religious Pharisees who brought a woman caught in adultery for judgement:

    "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone."

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    Apr 11, 2010 6:37 PM GMT
    NotThatOld said"Another reason to love and defend religion" McGay chose to title this topic,

    McGay chose his words wisely.

    True faith is NOT a religion, it's a relationship with God through faith in Jesus Christ, the very same person who said to the religious Pharisees who brought a woman caught in adultery for judgement:

    "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone."

    I hope you realize that that story about the woman caught in adultery was one of the many passages in the christian bible that was added centuries after the fact. Let he who calls himself Christian throw the first stone at a homosexual and then justify it by quoting "scripture"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_and_the_woman_taken_in_adulteryThe Pericope Adulterae (pronounced /pəˈrɪkəpiː əˈdʌltəriː/ in anglicised Latin) or Pericope de Adultera is a traditional name for a famous passage (pericope) about Jesus and the woman taken in adultery from verses 7:53-8:11 of the Gospel of John. The passage describes a confrontation between Jesus and the scribes and Pharisees over whether a woman, caught in an act of adultery, ought to be stoned. Jesus manages to shame the crowd into dispersing with the famous dare for anyone presumptuous enough to consider himself sinless to throw the first stone, coupled with some apparently embarrassing information written in the dirt, and averts the execution.

    Although in line with many stories in the Gospels and probably primitive (Didascalia Apostolorum refers to it, possibly Papias also), most scholars agree that it was "certainly not part of the original text of St John's Gospel."
  • Delivis

    Posts: 2332

    Apr 11, 2010 6:40 PM GMT
    NotThatOld said"Another reason to love and defend religion" McGay chose to title this topic,

    McGay chose his words wisely.

    True faith is NOT a religion, it's a relationship with God through faith in Jesus Christ, the very same person who said to the religious Pharisees who brought a woman caught in adultery for judgement:

    "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone."



    No true faith without jesus and yet you think religion has nothing to do with it? I have news for you - most people who believe in god do not believe in jesus as the only way to have a relationship with her.
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    Apr 11, 2010 7:01 PM GMT
    ActiveAndFit said

    I hope you realize that that story about the woman caught in adultery was one of the many passages in the christian bible that was added centuries after the fact. Let he who calls himself Christian throw the first stone at a homosexual and then justify it by quoting "scripture"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_and_the_woman_taken_in_adulteryThe Pericope Adulterae (pronounced /pəˈrɪkəpiː əˈdʌltəriː/ in anglicised Latin) or Pericope de Adultera is a traditional name for a famous passage (pericope) about Jesus and the woman taken in adultery from verses 7:53-8:11 of the Gospel of John. The passage describes a confrontation between Jesus and the scribes and Pharisees over whether a woman, caught in an act of adultery, ought to be stoned. Jesus manages to shame the crowd into dispersing with the famous dare for anyone presumptuous enough to consider himself sinless to throw the first stone, coupled with some apparently embarrassing information written in the dirt, and averts the execution.

    Although in line with many stories in the Gospels and probably primitive (Didascalia Apostolorum refers to it, possibly Papias also), most scholars agree that it was "certainly not part of the original text of St John's Gospel."


    I agree with you that this bit of Scripture from the Gospel of John had its authenticity questioned by scholars. Some say it was from Luke's Gospel.
    But where ever its source might have been, it is without doubt that it's in perfect keeping with Christ's teachings.
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    Apr 11, 2010 7:01 PM GMT
    I sense sarcasm in your post title.

    Yeah religion has it's ups and downs but so do political parties and all sorts of groups. Give someone something to believe in and they'll use it as a way to exclude other people (or include people).
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    Apr 11, 2010 7:11 PM GMT
    NotThatOld saidI agree with you that this bit of Scripture from the Gospel of John had its authenticity questioned by scholars. Some say it was from Luke's Gospel.
    But where ever its source might have been, it is without doubt that it's in perfect keeping with Christ's teachings.
    Well certainly the "scripture" and Christs' teachings have not helped the religious folk who have been murdering heretics for centuries, and it has certainly not helped the victims of these religious folk.
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    Apr 11, 2010 7:13 PM GMT
    im starting to lose my trust in religion.
  • Delivis

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    Apr 11, 2010 7:22 PM GMT
    shan37 saidim starting to lose my trust in religion.


    That is good news.