Why is gay marriage important?

  • AlexGuess

    Posts: 364

    Apr 22, 2010 9:55 AM GMT
    Clay Greene and Harold Scull, an elderly gay couple in Sonoma County, California, thought they had all their inheritance and legal paperwork sorted out. They couldn’t legally marry, but they had named each other in their wills, giving each other powers of attorney, and granted themselves control over medical decisions should something happen.

    According to a lawsuit filed by Clay and the NCLR, things couldn’t have gone more wrong.

    Tragically, Harold, aged 88, was hospitalized after falling on the front steps of the couple’s home. Not only was Clay (age 77) barred from seeing his partner of 20 years in the hospital because they weren’t legally family, but health workers forcibly placed the two in separate nursing homes. The County of Sonoma, deeming Harold incapable to care for himself and dismissing his relationship to Clay as “roommates,” seized and auctioned off the couple’s property and possessions. Harold died three months later, without Clay by his side. Clay is now without his partner, home, or any of the possessions that they had accumulated over their lifetime together.

    Same-sex marriage is very, very important.

    The case goes to court on July 16th.
  • AlexGuess

    Posts: 364

    Apr 22, 2010 9:56 AM GMT
    http://www.bilerico.com/2010/04/sonoma_county_ca_separates_elderly_gay_couple_and.php
  • mrcpu1

    Posts: 51

    Apr 22, 2010 2:02 PM GMT
    I wish people would stop calling 'domestic partners' equal to the legal definition of Marriage. Our nation has incorporated the term 'Marriage' and there are rights and privileges granted to 'Married' couples that are not available to anyone else, period.

    If we are to unravel the laws of all the states to replace the actual term 'Marriage', then 'Marriage' would no longer be an equal rights issue.

    Ignorant people and politicians still feel that domestic partners have the same rights as 'Married' couples. That will never happen with so many laws on the books associating the term 'Marriage' throughout.

    While the term Marriage originated in the Christian world (like the current calendar we use through out the world), rights have been associated with committed couples who have identified as 'Married'. Hindu's do not get 'married', neither do traditional Buddhist - however, their commitment ceremonies are considered marriages by our established christian democracies.

    Wake up America, let's put the separation of Church and State back where it belongs, SEPARATE.
  • coolarmydude

    Posts: 9190

    Apr 22, 2010 2:08 PM GMT
    This is truly baffling and sad.
  • jrs1

    Posts: 4388

    Apr 22, 2010 2:22 PM GMT
    ... because everyone deserves to practice loving the man or woman for which they would like to spend their lives beside ... be it in a hospital when they're ill ... bunked in a hotel ... being equally respected and served at a local restaurant ... listless together with friends ... celebrating a home with children (if they so choose) ... and trying to live in a world, together, where other people will try and tell them - even vote against them - to say that their love is not what is right ... according to belief ... try believing in liberty, equality, egality, and - to be honest - logic:

    re-post:


  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 2:28 PM GMT
    This is more distressing to me because it is California. I wouldn’t have been surprised if it had been a Red state.
    You can’t seem to get the “change the word” people to understand that by changing the word means you have to change the volumes of documents the word appears—who is going to do that? In this day, who is going to pay to have it done?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 2:31 PM GMT
    Uh.. maybe because I want to get married some day? As well as many other gay men and women?

    Better question: Are you retarded?
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 2:32 PM GMT
    Progress saidUh.. maybe because I want to get married some day? As well as many other gay men and women?

    Better question: Are you retarded?


    that was kinda shitty. just sayin ..
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 2:34 PM GMT
    Progress, you need to read the first post completely.
  • jrs1

    Posts: 4388

    Apr 22, 2010 2:37 PM GMT
    pf008 said
    Progress saidUh.. maybe because I want to get married some day? As well as many other gay men and women?
    Better question: Are you retarded?
    that was kinda shitty. just sayin ..
    meninlove said Progress, you need to read the first post completely.

    yup ... I don't think you meant any harm, Progress, but the initial investigative question on the part of the OP was rhetorical.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 2:55 PM GMT
    While marrige may get passed for same-sex couples I still see it being a fight for the same rights. Like the Catholic Adoption agencies, many anti-same sex marriage organizations wil close up shop and end it...

    I'm all for the idea of marriage for same sex couples but I don't think most of america is and I can rest and assure you that Virginia, Texas nor Georgia will recoginze it. Regardless if the federal government passes a DOMA repeal.
  • ja89

    Posts: 789

    Apr 22, 2010 2:59 PM GMT
    all great posts and the initial post is a terrible situation. Now my view on gay marriage as a whole (i know it's gonna stir up the forum but here it goes). gay marriage to me is kinda pointless to me. I figure if certain people dont want to allow gay marriage because of whatever they think is a good enough reason, they can keep marriage to themselves. I will share something much greater than they ever will. people think you have to get married to be in live a life full of happiness and love. I think i can do with out it, and i dont need that piece of paper that states me being legally married to my man.

    My post isnt here to knock down those who are for marriage, it's just an opinion of mine. Though i dont agree with marriage completely, it is wrong that they dont acknowledge equal rights for all. (sounds like im kinda contradicting myself now) icon_rolleyes.gif
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 3:03 PM GMT
    "i dont need that piece of paper that states me being legally married to my man"

    Sonoma County disagrees. Lots of hospitals disagree, though Obama has remedied that. The IRS disagrees with you. The state you live in might disagree with you. Of course, this is all contingent on you ever needing to exercise one of the more than 1000 rights granted to married people not granted to unmarried people.
  • ja89

    Posts: 789

    Apr 22, 2010 3:13 PM GMT
    McGay said"i dont need that piece of paper that states me being legally married to my man"

    Sonoma County disagrees. Lots of hospitals disagree, though Obama has remedied that. The IRS disagrees with you. The state you live in might disagree with you. Of course, this is all contingent on you ever needing to exercise one of the more than 1000 rights granted to married people not granted to unmarried people.


    yeah since im moving away within a year, i kinda dont care what this state has to offer or lack there of. also, i could care less of what the state laws are. really get a handle of my post. quoting myself "people think you have to get married to be in live a life full of happiness and love." you dont need that piece of paper for love.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 3:14 PM GMT
    No, ja89 you don’t have to believe in marriage there are plenty of people who don’t.
    I have a sneaking suspicion that 20 years from now you may change your mind; especially if you have been in a relationship that long.
    However,you won’t have to worry about it, because hopefully by then you’ll be able to look back and say I can’t believe this was an issue—not unlike we do now when it the subject of bi-racial marriage is brought up.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 3:21 PM GMT
    ""people think you have to get married to be in live a life full of happiness and love." "

    I don't think I've ever heard anyone say that. In the US, people have to get married to be granted a whole shitload of rights. It doesn't matter if you agree with the state, the fed, the church, or the magic eight ball. It's a fact not open to debate.
  • ja89

    Posts: 789

    Apr 22, 2010 3:28 PM GMT
    dustin_K_tx saidNo, ja89 you don’t have to believe in marriage there are plenty of people who don’t.
    I have a sneaking suspicion that 20 years from now you may change your mind; especially if you have been in a relationship that long.
    However,you won’t have to worry about it, because hopefully by then you’ll be able to look back and say I can’t believe this was an issue—not unlike we do now when it the subject of bi-racial marriage is brought up.


    yeah i know what you mean. I cant say that i can speak for my future self, but if one thing has stayed constant it's my way of thinking. i know year from now it will be one of those things that makes you scratch your head in wondering why, but seeing as how now im dont think it's too much of a big of deal, it will surely not be such a big deal for me then. the rights of not being able to have your life long love by your side sucks indeed. if able to marry and my man wants to get married even though im opposed to it, i would do it because i love him. not because i want the benefits that the state gives me.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 3:30 PM GMT

    Marriage was the icing on the cake for us. To stand publicly and declare love in this way was galvanizing.

    ja89, at the request of an RJ buddy we posted our vows on our profile. icon_redface.gif

    -Doug
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    Apr 22, 2010 3:41 PM GMT
    Ricovelas said I can rest and assure you that Virginia, Texas nor Georgia will recoginze it.

    Texas may be opening the door a little. Two gay couples married in Massachusetts filed for divorce in Dallas and Austin family courts. Both courts granted divorce decrees. The state Attorney General then filed appeals attempting to block the decrees as contrary to Texas law. The issue will wend its way up through the courts of appeals.
    Legally speaking the US Constitution requires the states to give full faith and credit to the acts of sister states, e.g., a marriage. The Constitution of course trumps state family law and the Dallas and Austin family court judges ruled on that basis. The final outcome should be interesting. If the divorces are valid then Texas has given legal recognition to gay marriage.
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    Apr 22, 2010 3:47 PM GMT
    The privileges of the married should be extended to everyone. It's not just gay people who are ripped off by the marriage laws; it's any unmarried person.

    Theoretically, I'd like to see marriage disappear as a virtually classist institution of the state. But that's not gonna happen, so legalizing gay marriage is important.

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    Apr 22, 2010 4:06 PM GMT
    ja89 saidall great posts and the initial post is a terrible situation. Now my view on gay marriage as a whole (i know it's gonna stir up the forum but here it goes). gay marriage to me is kinda pointless to me. I figure if certain people dont want to allow gay marriage because of whatever they think is a good enough reason, they can keep marriage to themselves. I will share something much greater than they ever will. people think you have to get married to be in live a life full of happiness and love. I think i can do with out it, and i dont need that piece of paper that states me being legally married to my man.



    1) Marriage equality is pointless to you, but it is extremely important for many gay couples, families and their children.


    2) Voting/Suffrage is pointless to mt best friend, but was extremely important to the women and African-Americans who marched and suffered to attain that right.


    You may never change your opinion one year or twenty years from now, but #2 should exemplify why marriage an altruistic matter regardless of whether is matters to you or not. Equality is not just a "piece of paper", it is our livelihood and the right to insure and protect our families & children under the law.

    The list of rights is so vast: making spousal medical decisions, joint parenting rights, family visitation rights for the spouse and non-biological children (such as to visit a spouse in a hospital or prisonimmigration benefits/sponsorships), supplemental security Income, medicaid, income tax deductions, credits, rates exemption, access to "family only" services, funeral and bereavement leave, joint adoption and foster care, joint tax filing, spousal privilege in court cases, and the list goes on.

    Once upon a time, bi-racial couples weren't allowed all that, and now gay couples aren't allowed any of it. That "piece of paper" might be pointless to you, but it is imperative for gay couples and their families if they want to avoid the fate of Clay Greene and Harold Scull, and one of the many reasons why gay marriage is so important.
  • adidas0783

    Posts: 290

    Apr 22, 2010 5:04 PM GMT
    tryandbuy said
    ja89 saidall great posts and the initial post is a terrible situation. Now my view on gay marriage as a whole (i know it's gonna stir up the forum but here it goes). gay marriage to me is kinda pointless to me. I figure if certain people dont want to allow gay marriage because of whatever they think is a good enough reason, they can keep marriage to themselves. I will share something much greater than they ever will. people think you have to get married to be in live a life full of happiness and love. I think i can do with out it, and i dont need that piece of paper that states me being legally married to my man.



    1) Marriage equality is pointless to you, but it is extremely important for many gay couples, families and their children.


    2) Voting/Suffrage is pointless to mt best friend, but was extremely important to the women and African-Americans who marched and suffered to attain that right.


    You may never change your opinion one year or twenty years from now, but #2 should exemplify why marriage an altruistic matter regardless of whether is matters to you or not. Equality is not just a "piece of paper", it is our livelihood and the right to insure and protect our families & children under the law.

    The list of rights is so vast: making spousal medical decisions, joint parenting rights, family visitation rights for the spouse and non-biological children (such as to visit a spouse in a hospital or prisonimmigration benefits/sponsorships), supplemental security Income, medicaid, income tax deductions, credits, rates exemption, access to "family only" services, funeral and bereavement leave, joint adoption and foster care, joint tax filing, spousal privilege in court cases, and the list goes on.

    Once upon a time, bi-racial couples weren't allowed all that, and now gay couples aren't allowed any of it. That "piece of paper" might be pointless to you, but it is imperative for gay couples and their families if they want to avoid the fate of Clay Greene and Harold Scull, and one of the many reasons why gay marriage is so important.


    This rings true to me and echos what meninlove and progress posted.

    This is an EXTREMELY important issue to me. Like many other gay men and women I want to eventually get married as well. It is a travesty that in 2010 same sex marriages are only legal in selected states and not nationwide. My point is that marriage is a right that each and everyone of us should have. That is my two cents. Lame to some? Possibly. Does it matter to us as a community and as human beings? ABSOLUTELY!
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 5:20 PM GMT
    Whats sad is that most people view marriage as something nice and an expression of love, what they fail to understand is the legal issues involved and how it protects gay couples, family issues over estates, right to visit in medical/hospital, loss of support when another LTR partner dies and not being able to collect on pension, Federal tax issues/credits. Did you know that a hetro married couple can sue for loss of support if one of them dies in a car accident due to negligence of a Drunk driver, while a gay couple can't? Sound like I'm a materististic gay man, but I'm not, so many legal options available to hetros and we gays should have the same rights.
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Apr 22, 2010 7:22 PM GMT
    Why is Gay Marriage important?
    Why not?
    icon_neutral.gif
  • AlexGuess

    Posts: 364

    Apr 22, 2010 7:23 PM GMT
    Progress saidUh.. maybe because I want to get married some day? As well as many other gay men and women?

    Better question: Are you retarded?


    lol....
    Maybe you should read the post first, but I am not really sure you know, I am retarded.