I'm Married, In the Closet and Have Been for Years

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    Nov 16, 2012 12:53 AM GMT
    She knows there is a lack of intimacy, she doesn't know why. In any case, even if she doesn't she's being horrible. Why complain, now they are square!
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    Nov 16, 2012 12:55 AM GMT
    pastelblue saidShe knows there is a lack of intimacy, she doesn't know why. In any case, even if she doesn't she's being horrible. Why complain, now they are square!
    Well your the one who is bashing him...if their square why bash him?
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    Nov 16, 2012 12:55 AM GMT
    Try to be friends with him? Would it be easy ? This man took away your opportunity to find someone who would always love you. He made you bear a burden that only belongs to him and lied to you on your wedding day when about the extent to which he could ever love you, and now he wants out. You must be a very forgiving person. I fear I cannot be.
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    Nov 16, 2012 12:56 AM GMT
    Bashing because he's complaining.
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    Nov 16, 2012 12:57 AM GMT
    pastelblue saidTry to be friends with him? Would it be easy ? This man took away your opportunity to find someone who would always love you. He made you bear a burden that only belongs to him and lied to you on your wedding day when about the extent to which he could ever love you, and now he wants out. You must be a very forgiving person. I fear I cannot be.
    He does not want out thats the problem...and I dont think she really wants out either...because if she did she would just file for divorce..no two people can be trapped in a marriage, if she filed he would have to at one point sign for the divorce
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    Nov 16, 2012 12:58 AM GMT
    end it
    if she was a man and you were in a gay relationship and built your life together and she was doing all these things with men then she clearly isnt treating you right

    if she has also asked for a divorce its because she is already mentally gone and its only going to kill your soul to stay

    and the fact that your gay or possibly bi means you have a whole new world which is more accepting of you for that now to come out to and a whole new dating pool

    your kids will still love you, though it ma be hard as first

    just dont sight your reasons for break up because you like men, build to comming out a little later

    for now.... its because your wife is a right bitch and you can do better
  • 2PecanDeBeurr...

    Posts: 302

    Nov 16, 2012 1:11 AM GMT
    Hardlee, compliments to you for opening yourself to other RJ males.

    From my experience ( 2x married/ divorced), raised to live the "Leave it to Beaver" lifestyle, womanizing father (mother.stepmother),

    I am Bi sexual, actually a "Sexual" lifer. Leaning more towards men.

    Went through counseling with 1st wife, separated, divorced (She had affairs w/other men "throwing it in my face") public embarassment.

    As the product of parent's hostile displeasure with each other, I could have had issues that a young RJ poster(32posts) is writing, however I saw both as my father and mother and it was THEIR issues.

    Recommend what some other supportive RJs have posted. Separate, go to counseling, keep in communication with your children, treat your wife as you would like to be treated- friendly, courteous, understanding (remember your children are watching EVERYTHING- verbal/nonverbal) . I remember things from 7 and 8 yrs old that I witnessed.

    To Thy Own Self Be True, Love from a distant, Do not Build Resentments for LIFE IS TOO SHORT,,,..ENJOY the Bad to BETTER appreciation the GOOD
    j.c.
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    Nov 16, 2012 2:15 AM GMT
    pastelblue saidDissocial personality disorder:

    It is characterized by at least 3 of the following.

    Callous unconcern for the feelings of others;

    Gross and persistent attitude of irresponsibility and disregard for social norms, rules, and obligations;

    Incapacity to experience guilt or to profit from experience, particularly punishment;

    Markedly prone to blame others or to offer plausible rationalizations for the behavior that has brought the person into conflict with society.
    Some of those sound like me, but I'm very social. I decided that since I can't seem to find anyone to hang out with, and the local hyenas are more content making life difficult as their own social norms; I'd stay out of socializing for the time being. I'm not from this particular area, and am failing at networking. Oh well... there are people who will like me elsewhere. Hell, I 300 of them in my facebook now!
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    Nov 16, 2012 2:17 AM GMT
    apolo_delfos saidWhoever says YES in response the the original OP's question, MARRY ME! lol


    will you fly to la paz??? nyuk..
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    Dec 05, 2012 3:43 AM GMT
    I am posting a response here in my thread that I recently made to a young 21 year old gay man who read my thread recently. This young man indicated to me he is "in the closet", confused with his gay feelings and is having strong desires of wanting children and getting married. He stated when he had read my story that it had "touched him" in a way he could relate to. He believed I could help him by understanding what he was experiencing and asked me knowing what I know now, what would I have done different. He was also hoping that I could help him avoid the mistakes I may have made.

    I believe my posting this here is important. Mainly to show how important the thread I had started has impacted others whom could benefit from my story and to initiate dialog for those in need. If you remember, I hoped to seek understanding and support from this forum of people when I started my thread. I have received MANY responses here and personal emails. Both good and bad. I have received an email from this young man. When I read his words, I felt I was reading my past. I am quite humbled to be in a position to hopefully provide clarity to a young mans life for which I never had this opportunity extended to me. Second, for those of you who may have responded negatively in my thread, I pray for you and hope you will finally understand how important it is for us, "family", to help and nurture our fellow gay brother. How important my thread really is. We are the only people in society who can actually understand what we have gone through, and through brotherhood, to band together in dealing with any difficulties that may lay ahead. Society is very cruel and unforgiving in itself. It doesn't help for like people to extend such hypochracy and hatred toward a sole who is struggling with the same struggles most of us may have endured one way or another.

    Here is what I responded to this young 21 year old closeted gay man (in part):

    Well first I would like to say I am sorry it has taken me awhile to review your email and respond back. I have received many. Second, I deeply want to thank you for the time it you took to read my story and write me with your thoughts. Lastly, please never apologize for being too "windy". These are important issues we both have raised and I believe we both could benefit from each other in a positive way not to mention others. After all, this is one of the anticipations I hoped would come from putting my story out there.

    You stated you are experiencing much of what I have stated when it relates to my "gut" feelings of gay tendencies. You are 27 years younger than I. Reading your message brings back MUCH of what I had experienced at your age and I often look back upon it in thinking, "what I would have done different", which is your main question to me.

    You mentioned, 'im in the closet as well and deal with that gut feeling you spoke about but cant act upon the urge.' First let me say the feeling you speak about I have experienced ALL my life to the present day. In other words, it hasn't gone away no matter how much I tried to rebuke it over the years, and believe me I tried many times during my life. There were times I thought it was gone for good. No... I was only fooling myself to only learn it would only re-surface many times later in life, which at times with great avengence. I never really had girlfriends when I grew up nor was I really attracted to them because I was gay and knew it. I tried to be attracted to girls and it worked at times but the realness wasn't there. Understandably. I acted on my gut feelings as far back as young as 5 - 11 years old. I never acted upon my feelings toward guys again until I was in the U.S. Marine Corps when I enlisted at the age of 19 years old. During my 8 years of honorable service, I occasionally, on and off, engaged in gay activities with other Marines but it wasn't too involved and very infrequent. All during these times I was ALWAYS fighting the gut feelings of being gay and wanting to have constant sex with other men. I had great restraint for most of my life. I left the Corps in 1990. Since then, I never engaged in any gay activity, mainly because I married. I embarked on a life I was brain washed into living. I was over come by the gut wrenching gay feelings which I strongly believe are the result of my declining marriage and the issues involved, and started to engage and act on my gayness this past August of 2012 to this present day. I feel great guilt because I knowingly and willfully broke a trust I freely undertook 20 years ago. That is something that violates a very deep core value I have.

    Looking back on this part of my life, I wish when I was 19 years old, essentially on my own, I would of had the courage to explore my gayness much more than I did and NOT fight the very strong gay feelings I was experiencing, which was daily during this time of my life. The reason I state this is because of what I know now and the experiences I have endured since then to this present day. First, I have learned the deep gut wrenching feelings, for me, have never went away but only became much stronger through time. Perhaps because I have been rebuking those feelings so adamantly throughout my life. I know now if I had acted on my gayness when I was your age, I do believe strongly that things would have turned out much different for me to where I would not be in the current position I am in. I do not enjoy or am I pleased where I am at socially, i.e., being married and for over 20 years, and living a restricted gay life. Things are not better between my wife and I. Honestly, I believe it has actually gotten worse. The future of our marriage looks quite bleak with each passing day. With this being said, it only greatly underscores the great importance of what I would have done different if I could be your age once again. I would have never had gotten married for one. Even though I wanted to experience what it would be like and to have children. I state this in the sense I would of had a much happier life at your age moving forward in my life if I had not married and lived a gay life. Yes, I can change that "today" by getting a divorce, which I'm sure will happen in the near future. But the sad part is, like I stated, I would of had a much happier life much sooner than later. Also, what I find the most difficult part in my experiences is the fact of my two children. Like you, I wanted to have children and the only "real way" to do this in my mind is to fertilize a "woman" in an effort to truly fulfill my desire. I did that by getting married first (beliefs) and now I have two wonderful children. I for one second do not regret having my children. I would never give them up for one second. I definitely would give my life for them in a heartbeat. I know eventually they will experience some very real hurt once they learn I am gay. I know this because I have raised and lived with them for 12 and 17 years and know the principles people live by who are apart of there everyday life. This is what has applied the breaks on many fronts, i.e., divorce, coming out of the closet etc. Looking back, if I had acted upon and allowed my gayness to play out without hesitation when I was your age, I know I would not have these strong concerns in regards to my children because I would not of had any. Not to mention all the complications I have brought onto myself. But I am very pleased I have them now and don't regret it. I have no choice. Additionally, I would be MUCH happier today because I would be living the life I really want to and need to...being the real me.

    I look back in my life quite often. Sometimes everyday. I always wondered why I wanted to get married and have children of my own. Now after many years of analyzing this in every way imaginable, I come to the realization that I was "programmed" to think this way by by society and the way I was brought up in life. That being a young man you are to
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    Dec 05, 2012 4:24 AM GMT
    Dude you are way to hard on yourself because you are under the false belief that you can foresee the future. The reality is that you have no idea how your life would have gone had you followed your "feelings". And what are your feelings? According to you it's the stuff you didn't do rather than the stuff you did do. You followed something to get where you are now and that is as valid as what you didn't do. I had friends that followed their gay feelings and died in the first wave of AIDS or beat up their partner and went to prison. The fate of a country has been decided on the way the wind decided to blow in a Naval battle so if you think you really had things in control think again. Your wife could have done way, way worse than marrying you . My best friend is a single mom and widow. Another suffered knife wounds from her Alcoholic husband . Your wife's life path believe it or not is hers not something you created. Being gay is not a crime on earth or heaven unless you want to play it that way. You are the sum of your experiences accept them as- is ,non judgmental. It really does not matter what those experiences are just be grateful and own them They made you who you are.
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    Dec 05, 2012 4:40 AM GMT
    Most guys won't understand your position because they've not been through it. I think more older guys will get it and some younger but many younger guys grew up in a much different environment than we did.
  • AllAmericanJo...

    Posts: 4271

    Jan 12, 2013 10:09 AM GMT
    eb925guy saidI think more older guys will get it and some younger but many younger guys grew up in a much different environment than we did.


    Every generation of same-sex couples stands on the shoulders of giants. Think how much better gaybies born in 2013 are going to have it when they are turning 30 years old.

    That makes the lives we are leading now very important.

    I wonder how Hardlee is doing...
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    Jan 12, 2013 10:54 AM GMT
    Hardlee saidClarification: I'm in love with my wife because yes I do love her, made commitment to her 20 years ago and she is the mother of my children. But I find I am not attracted to women but deeply attracted to men. I got married because I was forcing myself then not to act and go with my true feelings. I hope this provides clarity.


    Basically then, you love her in your head and heart, but in a sex way. This is actually pretty common for gay men who are either confused or in denial. I had a similar relationship with a woman in college.

    The best policy is to say something. You don't necessarily have to tell her you're gay just yet, but maybe you can feel her out to see how she'd react. I'm not sure how you'd do that though. My guess is that she already has suspicions. Her having conversations with other men and indirectly bringing up divorce might be her passive/aggressive way of trying get you to come clean.

    The good news is that you've been faithful to her. That's not an easy task, and it's something few men in your position have been able to do. I know a guy who's in your same position, and he's screws around all of the time on his wife. The key thing to remember is that marriage is not just about love, but trust as well. It's impossible to have trust when you're not being completely honest. In a way, even though you're not acting on your feelings, you're lying to her about your sexuality. While it's only part of you, it's still a major piece to your life. If you can't be honest with her about something that major, you can't have real intimacy, which will cause you two to drift apart.

    I respect that you're trying to save your marriage and family. That is admirable. Still, you're doing so at the cost of everyone you love. Your wife will definitely feel a sense of betrayal once you do tell her. That's unavoidable. Still, she has the right to find someone that can fulfill her completely--just as you do as well.

    Good luck in doing whatever it is you feel you have to do. It's a sucky road to go down, but it's all worthwhile in the end.
  • bfirbs

    Posts: 55

    Jan 12, 2013 11:34 AM GMT
    Considering she has asked for a divorce 4 times? I think its time to leave.
    Once the divorce is finalized she can't take anything more from you if you come out.
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    Jan 12, 2013 12:42 PM GMT
    (I realize the OP made this thread awhile ago, buticon_smile.gif

    I think paradoxically, self-loathing helps bring more gay people in the world.

    My dad told me had gay feelings once, and here I am -gay also. I think a lot of gay sons also have gay dads.

    I wanted to marry a girl and have kids sometimes just because women are sooo much easier in ways, EMOTIONALLY (not sexually). It depends on the girl sure but the women I'm compatible with and can commit - feels better than a guy sometimes. (The likelihood of a woman bullying you and being cruel is just statistically a lot lower than a man doing it even though yes, women can be bitches.) And girls aren't that bad sexually either, but I prefer men.

    And my mom was always open-minded. I think before she had kids she wouldn't mind if they were gay - but she would rather them be straight because of the prejudice in the world.

    I guess this thread is just proof that 'gay' and 'straight' are always connected more than we think.

    Ru Paul or some other gay icon figure said once that we don't think two men can work out in a normal relationship so we won't let them get close that way, instead we just use each other for sex. But it doesn't have to be that way. Who you fall in love with is who you fall in love with. There should be no 'standards' based on the specifics of a sexual preference, standards should be based on equality, since really - we are all more alike than we are different even if it doesn't feel that way.