Questions For One-Staters - and no answers. Revealing that the so-called "one-state 'solution'" is a bankrupt fraud designed to destroy Israel and replace it with one Arab state.

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    Aug 27, 2012 7:38 AM GMT
    Recall this [the history of Jews not "stealing" land but PURCHASING it] is why one of the first laws passed by the PA was a racist prohibition on selling land to Jews! Not just a token show of solidarity, but a law making this a capital offense - punishable by death!)

    AyaTrollah pouncer> Who was executed under this law?

    So you're ok with such blatantly racist laws even IF no one is executed?

    Unfortunately for you:

    Palestinian handed death sentence
    A Palestinian military court has condemned a man to death by hanging for treason for selling land to Israelis.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8024281.stm

    The above from 2009. And just last month:

    Palestinian ex-officer dies after 'fall' in custody
    http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hNMQXbMFNOVQfpOOeXaJlVL1GDrw?docId=CNG.33dc1b06ef0258207c969fca6d976186.41

    Indeed, this case is very relevant and exposes ianct's propaganda lie:

    Jordan, PA arrest 2 Palestinians for selling Hebron house to Jews
    Hebron Jewish Committee: Arrest proves house was purchased legally, exposes anti-Semitic nature of PA.

    http://www.haaretz.com/news/jordan-pa-arrest-2-palestinians-for-selling-hebron-house-to-jews-1.217018


    If it's a "one-state 'solution'" you seek, then how can Jewish villagers be "illegal settlers"

    ATp> Because the settlers are civilians who are being unilaterally transferred into a militarily occupied area,

    Not only is the conditional question too difficult for the idiot-for-the-cause, but:

    Under Article 2 of the Fourth Geneva Convention, the term "occupation" only applies to territories of "High Contracting Parties" (i.e. existing states).

    Furthermore, Article 47 references "Individual or mass forcible transfers", not "unilateral" transfers (whatever that means).
    What would be illegal (were this "occupied" territory) is for Israel to forcibly transfer its Arab population to the territories.

    Note further propaganda pouncer's shenanigans. Knowing the above (and having repeatedly failed to refute it), he seeks to move away from the legal definition (according to the Convention) and instead references "militarily occupied area". That's as obviously true - yet irrelevant - as the "occupied" sign on an airplane bathroom.


    ATp> whatever future solution may be reached, is currently NOT Israel and NOT as yet a country in its own right.

    Right, it's stateless lands. The disposition of which will be reached via negotiations (not ransom demands).

    Another question propaganda pouncer has been unable to address:

    In a future peace agreement, the Jewish quarter of Jerusalem (and other areas) will become part of Israel. How then can these be "occupied [Arab] Palestine" (a state that doesn't exist and hasn't ever existed)? Does it mean that these particular territories were "Israeli-occupied Israel" all along?

    So much for the propaganda sound-bite/slogan of "occupied".


    Still that misses the point (as is so typical of AyaTrollah pouncer's posts) of my discussion with ianct. It wasn't about the legal disposition but the duplicity of ianct's position. He cannot simultaneously pretend to believe in a so-called "one-state 'solution'" and believe that it is "illegal" for Jews to live in the disputed territories.

    I think we all know what ianct really seeks, and that is the destruction of Israel and sending Jews "back" to "Europe" (because, despite his childish word games, in his final analysis ALL Jews are "illegal settlers").

    ianct> [silence = busted]

    Why then does AyaTrollah pouncer defend ianct?
    Because, like Helen Thomas, propaganda pouncer shares that belief.
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    Aug 27, 2012 12:59 PM GMT
    libertpaulian saidI do have one curious question for those on the side of Palestine...

    If you believe that Israel has illegally taken Palestine's land and that they should give it back, do you believe that we should give most of the US back to the Natives, and the Southwest back to Mexico?


    Only difference is that the Native American Indians, Mexicans and black people can now live peaceful with the white Americans. Palestinians on other hand still suffering under Israel's racist laws and forced them out of their land. Palestinians have never give up fighting for their rights and return to their ancestral homeland in Israel. There are some apartheid systems running in the West Bank. I was there last year and took some pictures of the apartheid wall and some other terrible stuff that Israeli government do not want the world/people to see. The Israeli security guard at the airport was checking out my camera and delete all the pictures.

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    Aug 27, 2012 1:06 PM GMT
    realifedad said
    IanCT saidianct> Do you have any relatives that are Israeli settlers?"

    W4>I don't, but this is an Irrelevant ad hominem.
    It has no impact on the facts and arguments.

    Ianct> Then why are you defending them? What part of illegal that you don't understand? Taking away someone else home and land is not illegal? If there is a one state solution, then there should be both people living side by side equal.

    ianct> the so-called "illegal Jewish villagers" happen to be Palestinian properties... Do you think it is right take over Palestinian homes

    W4>No, I don't think that's right. But the fact of the matter is that most of the Jewish villages are NOT built on private property let alone by "stealing" someone's home. In these rare cases, Israeli courts have ruled in your favor..

    Ianct> The Jews have already stolen Palestinian Christian and Muslim homes since the 1948. Yet they are still stealing Palestinian homes in East Jerusalem and several other Palestinian towns. Israel has violated even its own norms and laws in the West Bank, through the confiscation of private Palestinian property and the building of settlements upon them. Palestinians privately own over 40% of the land in settlements located in "settlement blocs," west of the fence being constructed by Israel, including 86.4% of Ma’ale Adumim, 44.3% of Giv'at Ze'ev, 47.7% of Kedumim, and 35.1% of Ariel. Only a small percentage of settlement land was purchased by Jews.

    ianct> Anyone that build illegal outposts on the stolen Palestinian lands or taking Palestinian homes by force is illegal.

    W4> Sorry, repeating your false propaganda narrative doesn't change the facts.

    Ianct> What I was saying above is the facts.
    http://palsolidarity.org/2012/08/hebron-settler-illegally-enters-palestinian-home/

    W4>Recall this is why one of the first laws passed by the PA was a racist prohibition on selling land to Jews! Not just a token show of solidarity, but a law making this a capital offense - punishable by death!)

    W4>Do you agree with this racist PA?

    ianct>I don't blame them... Don't you? I don't find it racist. Look what happen to them, the Palestinians were replaced by Jews from all over the world that were taken their lands and homes. Now they are under the Zionist racist policy. Palestinians cannot return their lands and homes in Israel that was taken from them. They have to be Jews if they want to return their home. Israel has to be so-called "Jewish majority". I find that racist.

    W4> If it's a "one-state 'solution'" you seek, then how can Jewish villagers be "illegal settlers"?

    W4> Either it's one state for all the people... or it isn't. If you believe in a "one-state 'solution'", how can you claim that it is "illegal" for Jews to live in Judea, Samaria and eastern Jerusalem?

    Ianct> I say there should be one state for all the people. You'll be ok if a Palestinian steals an Israeli home and a land too? Would that considers illegal? I don't consider them (Jews) illegal that already legal bought some lands in Judea and Samaria (West Bank). I only say Jews that stealing Palestinian homes and lands are illegal.





    _________________________________________________________


    SUCCESS IANCT !!!!

    I see we chided the Zionist Fanatic into finally answering your question, of course dipped right back into spreading more propaganda, he knows God damn well that the Zionists were responsible for pushing hundreds of thousand of Palestinians off their land and out of their homes, he just doesn't want to admit it because the facts expose his propaganda lies.



    NOW LETS SEE IF THE ZIONIST FANATIC LIL'AIPAC WILL ANSWER TO HIS HYPOCRISY ABOUT PROMOTING THEFT OF PALESTINIAN STATE LAND BY SETTLEMENT BUILDING THAT HE SAYS DOESN'T BELONG TO PALESTINIANS ANYWAY. THIS WHILE OUT OF THE OTHER SIDE OF HIS MOUTH CLAIMING TO BE FOR A TWO STATE SOLUTION.


    LIL'AIPAC CANNOT HAVE IT BOTH WAYS, EITHER THERE IS TO BE A STATE FOR PALESTINIANS MINUS THE SETTLEMENT THEFT OR A ONE STATE SOLUTION WHERE PALESTINIANS AND JEWS CAN LIVE ANYWHERE AND THE PALESTINIANS CAN COME BACK TO THEIR HOMES IN JERUSALEM AND OTHER LOCATIONS TAKEN AWAY BY THE ZIONIST ZEALOTS THROUGH THE YEARS.


    ALL IN CAPS SO LIL'AIPAC CAN READ THE FACTS A LITTLE EASIER, SINCE HE HAS SUCH A HARD TIME WITH FACTUAL READING.




    ANSWERS LIL'AIPAC ??????????????????????????????


    He stills posting a lot of propaganda... lol Now he thinks Pouncer is defending me. Pouncer and I both think alike and we both know what really happen over there. W4 is only one misleading many people on here. Saying that Palestinians are racists and don't want to sell land to Jews. Well... It seems that W4 has no clue why?! It is because Israel has ethnic cleansing many Palestinians out of their lands and still going? That ring a bell?

    W4 is like Avigdor Liberman. Funny how he doesn't mention about him being an illegal Israeli settler in the West Bank.
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    Aug 27, 2012 2:08 PM GMT
    Here's a perfect example of a lie-for-the-cause:

    ianct> The Israeli security guard at the airport was checking out my camera and delete all the pictures.

    When you entered the country? Before you even took the pictures?

    Alternatively, if on your way out, why didn't you upload those pics during all that time you claimed that you were sitting at an internet cafe in Bethlehem?

    At the time (another example) ianct also claimed that he can be openly gay in the PA territories... that it's no big deal. I asked him to take a photo of himself in public with a sign saying "I'm gay". Guess those photos must have also been "deleted".

    Either that, or:

    Countries that support gays or kill them
    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/984797

    Gay Palestinians
    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/1061322
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    Aug 27, 2012 2:43 PM GMT
    It was before I left the country... If I post pictures on facebook or on the net while in Bethlehem. The Israeli government or Israeli airport security will know everything and will invade your private accounts.

    read this article
    http://mondoweiss.net/2012/06/do-you-feel-more-arab-or-more-american-two-arab-american-womens-story-of-being-detained-and-interrogated-at-ben-gurion.html
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    Aug 27, 2012 4:11 PM GMT
    IanCT saidIt was before I left the country... If I post pictures on facebook or on the net while in Bethlehem. The Israeli government or Israeli airport security will know everything and will invade your private accounts.

    read this article
    http://mondoweiss.net/2012/06/do-you-feel-more-arab-or-more-american-two-arab-american-womens-story-of-being-detained-and-interrogated-at-ben-gurion.html







    Poor LIL'AIPAC, you've left him fairly speechless IanCT, now he's back to attempting postings of propaganda to take the attention off Israel's Leadership despotism against the Palestinians for their Zionist Zealot "greater Israel" to the Jordan River.

    He doesn't want the reader catching onto how he and his ilk play like they're for a two state solution while the reality is that they are intent on settling all of the West bank they can so Palestinians cannot have a true state of their own. Funny thing is, they're also scared to death of a one state solution that would give Palestinians all of the rights of Israeli's, such as rights to return to their property, particularly in Jerusalem.

    THAT WOULD DESTROY THE JEWISH CHARACTER OF ISRAEL THEY SAY. HOW SAD, THEY JUST CANNOT HAVE IT BOTH WAYS AND THEY'VE BOXED THEMSELVES INTO A CORNER. LOL

    LIL'AIPAC STILL HASN'T RESPONDED TO THIS POINT HAS HE ??? LOL


    HIS HYPOCRISY AND THAT OF HIS ILK IS EXPOSED !!!
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    Aug 27, 2012 7:26 PM GMT
    Note this startling admission:

    ianct> I don't consider them (Jews) illegal that already legal bought some lands in Judea and Samaria (West Bank). I only say Jews that stealing Palestinian homes and lands are illegal.

    Odd, then, that ianct doesn't "find it racist" that the PA forbids Jews from purchasing land and punishes Arab land owners who sell land to Jews with death. (Racism which he attempts to rationalize because Jews have already purchased so much land... thus deflating his own "stolen" argument.)


    Regardless of that hypocritical duplicity, I agree.
    Jews living on land that was NOT acquired legally - was stolen - are in the wrong.

    Thus the vast majority of the Jewish villagers ("settlers") are LEGAL by ianct's criteria. As he himself said:

    ianct> Palestinians privately own over 40% of the land in settlements located in "settlement blocs,"

    Meaning that even if we accept his figure (and it is wrong) then 60% of the land isn't privately owned by Palestinian Arabs and was not "stolen".

    Yet ianct is on record saying that ALL Jews have to "get out" of Judea, Samaria and eastern Jerusalem?!
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    Aug 27, 2012 8:40 PM GMT
    OH MY !!!! I SEE ANOTHER ADMISSION, ONE THOUGH THAT LIL'AIPAC THINKS HE CAN SCORE WITH FOR HIS OVERALL CAUSE OF APOLOGIST FOR THE SETTLEMENT CAUSE OF GETTING AS CLOSE TO 'GREATER ISRAEL' AS POSSIBLE.



    NOW LIL'AIPAC WHY NOT ADDRESS THE REST OF THE QUESTIONS AND POINTS BELOW, IGNORING ONLY SHEDS LIGHT ON THE SHALLOWNESS OF YOUR PROPAGANDA THAT OVERALL IS QUITE INDEFENSEABLE.







    realifedad said
    IanCT saidIt was before I left the country... If I post pictures on facebook or on the net while in Bethlehem. The Israeli government or Israeli airport security will know everything and will invade your private accounts.

    read this article
    http://mondoweiss.net/2012/06/do-you-feel-more-arab-or-more-american-two-arab-american-womens-story-of-being-detained-and-interrogated-at-ben-gurion.html







    Poor LIL'AIPAC, you've left him fairly speechless IanCT, now he's back to attempting postings of propaganda to take the attention off Israel's Leadership despotism against the Palestinians for their Zionist Zealot "greater Israel" to the Jordan River.

    He doesn't want the reader catching onto how he and his ilk play like they're for a two state solution while the reality is that they are intent on settling all of the West bank they can so Palestinians cannot have a true state of their own. Funny thing is, they're also scared to death of a one state solution that would give Palestinians all of the rights of Israeli's, such as rights to return to their property, particularly in Jerusalem.

    THAT WOULD DESTROY THE JEWISH CHARACTER OF ISRAEL THEY SAY. HOW SAD, THEY JUST CANNOT HAVE IT BOTH WAYS AND THEY'VE BOXED THEMSELVES INTO A CORNER. LOL

    LIL'AIPAC STILL HASN'T RESPONDED TO THIS POINT HAS HE ??? LOL


    HIS HYPOCRISY AND THAT OF HIS ILK IS EXPOSED !!!
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    Aug 28, 2012 5:19 PM GMT
    realifedad said OH MY !!!! I SEE ANOTHER ADMISSION, ONE THOUGH THAT LIL'AIPAC THINKS HE CAN SCORE WITH FOR HIS OVERALL CAUSE OF APOLOGIST FOR THE SETTLEMENT CAUSE OF GETTING AS CLOSE TO 'GREATER ISRAEL' AS POSSIBLE.



    NOW LIL'AIPAC WHY NOT ADDRESS THE REST OF THE QUESTIONS AND POINTS BELOW, IGNORING ONLY SHEDS LIGHT ON THE SHALLOWNESS OF YOUR PROPAGANDA THAT OVERALL IS QUITE INDEFENSEABLE.







    realifedad said
    IanCT saidIt was before I left the country... If I post pictures on facebook or on the net while in Bethlehem. The Israeli government or Israeli airport security will know everything and will invade your private accounts.

    read this article
    http://mondoweiss.net/2012/06/do-you-feel-more-arab-or-more-american-two-arab-american-womens-story-of-being-detained-and-interrogated-at-ben-gurion.html







    Poor LIL'AIPAC, you've left him fairly speechless IanCT, now he's back to attempting postings of propaganda to take the attention off Israel's Leadership despotism against the Palestinians for their Zionist Zealot "greater Israel" to the Jordan River.

    He doesn't want the reader catching onto how he and his ilk play like they're for a two state solution while the reality is that they are intent on settling all of the West bank they can so Palestinians cannot have a true state of their own. Funny thing is, they're also scared to death of a one state solution that would give Palestinians all of the rights of Israeli's, such as rights to return to their property, particularly in Jerusalem.

    THAT WOULD DESTROY THE JEWISH CHARACTER OF ISRAEL THEY SAY. HOW SAD, THEY JUST CANNOT HAVE IT BOTH WAYS AND THEY'VE BOXED THEMSELVES INTO A CORNER. LOL

    LIL'AIPAC STILL HASN'T RESPONDED TO THIS POINT HAS HE ??? LOL


    HIS HYPOCRISY AND THAT OF HIS ILK IS EXPOSED !!!


    Seriously, he doesn't know what is illegal in the West Bank. Anything over there "belongs to Jews." He believes in that racist ideology. What a prick!
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    Aug 28, 2012 6:05 PM GMT
    He doesn't understand the difference between why Palestinians don't sell lands to Jews today and Jews that already bought some lands before 1948 Palestinians' first civil war.

    He has to read some history books!
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    Aug 28, 2012 9:41 PM GMT
    Pouncer saidYou can give me a taste of what he's spouting Ian if you want, though make it short please (I often commit my hands to sanitary lavation after rolling my curser down extended snippets of his muck).

    On the other hand though Ian, consider disregarding the above.






    We'll attach purhaps a few new 'snippets' from LIL'AIPAC, occassionally but I'll confess for the Zionist Zealot that its Usually just rehashes of typical canned Propaganda and accusations that all who point out the lies and coverups are jew haters and seeking the destruction of Israel.

    LIL'AIPAC is having a hard time accepting that he cannot promote his Zionist "Greater Israel"(takeover of all of the West Bank through settlement building) out of one side of his mouth and out of the other side of his mouth promote a two state solution. Poor Fella seems to think that since he believes his own lies that everyone else will too by his ignoring the truth in favor of repeating the same propaganda.

    That's the jist of his repititious posts as usual.

    But here's a particularly gauling piece of propaganda from LIL'AIPAC's recent quote, that is glaringly Hypocritical in light of the fact that he promotes the righteousness current Settlements and continued Settlement Building on land set aside by the International bodies for a Palestinian State.
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Quote from LIL'AIPAC's post above >> "Supporters of the two-state solution are often told that this vision is unrealistic and has become unachievable"
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Now chew on that one from LIL'AIPAC who agrees with his Professor father that Palestine never existed, that Palestinians have no Homeland, that Palestinians Homeland is in Jordan on the East side of the Jordan River, not on the West Side of the Jordan River in the West Bank where LIL'AIPAC thinks its just grand for Settlers to keep right on Building Settlements. Yet now that so much of the West Bank has been taken over by LIL'AIPACS beloved of Settlements and their buffer zones (for settlement protection) and dividing walls and checkpoints a 2 State Solution is nearly impossible. FACTS HAVE IT THAT ITS THE LIL'AIPAC STYLED ZIONIST FANATIC SETTLEMENT BUILDERS WHO ARE RUINING THE TWO STATE SOLUTION NOT THE PALESTINIANS.

    What it boils down to is that LIL'AIPAC's ILK has purposefully sought all of the West Bank 'Greater Israel' through settlements which has totally frustrated a two state solution and now regret the possibility of One State because of how it would end the 'Jewish Character' of Israel that they are so hell bent on the Palestinians accepting. THE GOD DAMN FOOLS WANT TO HAVE THEIR CAKE AND TO EAT IT TOO. Do they think the entire international community are too stupid to see the HYPOCRICY of their Zionist Zealot Tactics.

    Maybe you can get LIL'AIPAC to respond to This glaring HYPOCRICY on his side of the SETTLEMENT WALLS. LOL !! Good Luck.
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    Aug 28, 2012 11:01 PM GMT
    realifedad said
    Pouncer saidYou can give me a taste of what he's spouting Ian if you want, though make it short please (I often commit my hands to sanitary lavation after rolling my curser down extended snippets of his muck).

    On the other hand though Ian, consider disregarding the above.






    We'll attach purhaps a few new 'snippets' from LIL'AIPAC, occassionally but I'll confess for the Zionist Zealot that its Usually just rehashes of typical canned Propaganda and accusations that all who point out the lies and coverups are jew haters and seeking the destruction of Israel.

    LIL'AIPAC is having a hard time accepting that he cannot promote his Zionist "Greater Israel"(takeover of all of the West Bank through settlement building) out of one side of his mouth and out of the other side of his mouth promote a two state solution. Poor Fella seems to think that since he believes his own lies that everyone else will too by his ignoring the truth in favor of repeating the same propaganda.

    That's the jist of his repititious posts as usual.

    But here's a particularly gauling piece of propaganda from LIL'AIPAC's recent quote, that is glaringly Hypocritical in light of the fact that he promotes the righteousness current Settlements and continued Settlement Building on land set aside by the International bodies for a Palestinian State.
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Quote from LIL'AIPAC's post above >> "Supporters of the two-state solution are often told that this vision is unrealistic and has become unachievable"
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Now chew on that one from LIL'AIPAC who agrees with his Professor father that Palestine never existed, that Palestinians have no Homeland, that Palestinians Homeland is in Jordan on the East side of the Jordan River, not on the West Side of the Jordan River in the West Bank where LIL'AIPAC thinks its just grand for Settlers to keep right on Building Settlements. Yet now that so much of the West Bank has been taken over by LIL'AIPACS beloved of Settlements and their buffer zones (for settlement protection) and dividing walls and checkpoints a 2 State Solution is nearly impossible. FACTS HAVE IT THAT ITS THE LIL'AIPAC STYLED ZIONIST FANATIC SETTLEMENT BUILDERS WHO ARE RUINING THE TWO STATE SOLUTION NOT THE PALESTINIANS.

    What it boils down to is that LIL'AIPAC's ILK has purposefully sought all of the West Bank 'Greater Israel' through settlements which has totally frustrated a two state solution and now regret the possibility of One State because of how it would end the 'Jewish Character' of Israel that they are so hell bent on the Palestinians accepting. THE GOD DAMN FOOLS WANT TO HAVE THEIR CAKE AND TO EAT IT TOO. Do they think the entire international community are too stupid to see the HYPOCRICY of their Zionist Zealot Tactics.

    Maybe you can get LIL'AIPAC to respond to This glaring HYPOCRICY on his side of the SETTLEMENT WALLS. LOL !! Good Luck.
















    ANSWER'S LIL'AiPAC ?????


    We've read enough of your Propaganda
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    Aug 29, 2012 6:09 AM GMT
    Note this startling admission:

    ianct> I don't consider them (Jews) illegal that already legal bought some lands in Judea and Samaria (West Bank). I only say Jews that stealing Palestinian homes and lands are illegal.

    Odd, then, that ianct doesn't "find it racist" that the PA forbids Jews from purchasing land and punishes Arab land owners who sell land to Jews with death. (Racism which he attempts to rationalize because Jews have already purchased so much land... thus deflating his own "stolen" argument.)


    Regardless of that hypocritical duplicity, I agree.
    Jews living on land that was NOT acquired legally - was stolen - are in the wrong.

    Thus the vast majority of the Jewish villagers ("settlers") are LEGAL by ianct's criteria. As he himself said:

    ianct> Palestinians privately own over 40% of the land in settlements located in "settlement blocs,"

    Meaning that even if we accept his figure (and it is wrong) then 60% of the land isn't privately owned by Palestinian Arabs and was not "stolen".

    Yet ianct is on record saying that ALL Jews have to "get out" of Judea, Samaria and eastern Jerusalem?!
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    Aug 29, 2012 6:12 AM GMT
    Pouncer said"Supporters of the two-state solution are often told that this vision is unrealistic and has become unachievable" - which isn't actually true

    Another startling admission.

    What next, will AyaTrollah pouncer come out in favor of the two-state solution?!
    (After all, none of those spouting the so-called "one-state 'solution'" have been able to address the questions raised in the OP.)
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    Aug 29, 2012 6:32 AM GMT
    Wolverine4 said
    Pouncer said"Supporters of the two-state solution are often told that this vision is unrealistic and has become unachievable" - which isn't actually true

    Another startling admission.

    What next, will AyaTrollah pouncer come out in favor of the two-state solution?!
    (After all, none of those spouting the so-called "one-state 'solution'" have been able to address the questions raised in the OP.)





    Pouncer !!! GOD DAMN !!! I just couldn't resist showing you this line of LIL'AIPAC Bullshit. LOL


    Funny thing is its LIL'AIPAC's Zionist Zealot partners and apologists like him making the two state solution nearly impossible by their ILLEGAL SETTLEMENT BUILDING ADVENTURES.


    DOES ANYONE HAVE AN EXPLANATION FOR LIL'AIPAC's HYPOCRICY ?


    He cannot have it both ways, either there has to be an end to the Israeli Illegal actions as an OCCUPIER BUILDING SETTLEMENTS TO MOVE THEIR CITIZENRY ONTO OCCUPIED LAND meant to facilitate a 2 state solution or they'll have to accept a one state solution that their own actions bring about.


    IS LIL'AIPAC REALLY THIS DAMN STUPID OR FANATICAL THAT HE CANNOT UNDERSTAND THIS REALITY ?

    I HAVE TO WONDER ??


    KEEP IT UP LIL'AIPAC, YOU'RE MAKING AN OBVIOUS ASS OF YOURSELF AND DELEGITIMIZING YOUR OWN CAUSE,
    BECAUSE READERS SEE RIGHT THROUGH YOUR PROPAGANDA AND YOUR TACTIC OF IGNORING REALISTIC POINTS AND QUESTIONS FOR THE SAKE OF REPEATING THAT ZIONIST PROPAGANDA.
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    Aug 29, 2012 11:10 PM GMT
    AyaTrollah pouncer> "Supporters of the two-state solution are often told that this vision is unrealistic and has become unachievable" - which isn't actually true

    Another startling admission.
    What next, will AyaTrollah pouncer come out in favor of the two-state solution?!


    AyaTrollah pouncer> "Startling admission"? Really? Claiming the two-state solution is (barely) feasible after over 35 years of US-Israeli rejectionism on the two-state consensus is a "startling admission"?

    We know that English isn't your native language, but that isn't what I said.
    The startling admission is the double negative meaning that the two-state solution IS achievable.

    Revisiting the Clinton Compromise Parameters
    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/2271313
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    Aug 30, 2012 12:20 AM GMT
    From MONDOWEISS


    Two-stater says the reality has shifted to one apartheid state



    by Philip Weiss on August 27, 2012


    Here is another sign of the end of the two-state paradigm in the minds of those who were engaged in building two states. The dialogue project, bitterlemons, is closing down. From the two statements below, you can see that Palestinian intellectuals are growing increasingly resentful of normalization efforts, and that the hope that some felt around the two-state solution has drained away, including from European sponsors. (Thanks to Paul Mutter).

    Palestinian partner Ghassan Khatib, formerly of the P.A., says this:


    In the foreword to "The Best of Bitterlemons" compilation published in 2007, I noted that we rarely had trouble recruiting writers. Despite the feeling among many in the Arab world that contact with Israelis is tantamount to accepting Israel's occupation, seldom did authors decline an invitation. Lately, we have observed that this has changed, that even once-forthcoming Palestinians are less interested in sharing ideas with Israelis just across the way. Still, we have been able to present the voices of security chiefs and political prisoners, military generals and farmers losing land, spokespersons for armed groups and peaceniks in an equal and fair manner--rather differently than the situation on the ground.

    Nevertheless, this achievement is bittersweet as the scenery around us grows ever more dark and uncertain. Two decades after the signing of the Declaration of Principles that many hoped would usher in the creation of a Palestinian state and independence, freedom and security, Palestinians and Israelis are barely conversational. The structures created by those agreements have atrophied, corrupted by an increasing imbalance in the Palestinian relationship with Israel. Every day, there is new word of land confiscations, arrests, demolitions, and legislative maneuvers to solidify Israel's control. Israel's political leaders are beholden to a tide of right-wing sentiment and Palestinian leaders are made to appear ever-smaller in their shrinking spheres of control.

    We are now, it appears, at the lowest point in the arc of the pendulum, one that is swinging away from the two-state solution into a known unknown: an apartheid Israel. How this new "one-state" option will be transformed into a solution that provides freedom and security for all remains to be seen.

    Israeli partner Yossi Alpher adds this:


    We are ceasing publication for reasons involving fatigue--on a number of
    fronts. First, there is donor fatigue. Why, donors ask, should we continue to support a Middle East dialogue project that not only has not made peace, but cannot "prove" to our satisfaction--especially at a time of revolution and violence throughout the region--that it has indeed raised the level of civilized discussion? Why fight the Israeli right-wing campaign against European and American state funding and the Palestinian campaign against "normalization"?

    These last two negative developments also reflect local fatigue. There is no peace process and no prospect of one. Informal "track II" dialogue--bitterlemons might be described as a "virtual" track II--is declining. Here and there, writers from the region who used to favor us with their ideas and articles are now begging off, undoubtedly deterred by the revolutionary rise of intolerant political forces in their countries or neighborhood.




    LIL'AIPAC the HYPOCRITE still hasn't answered how he thinks he can approve settlement building on land set aside for a Palestinian state, and further that Palestinians home is in Jordan because there never was a Palestine. Niether of those two beliefs goes along with believing in a two state solution. How does this Zionist pain in the ass think he can have it both ways ?
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    Aug 31, 2012 12:41 AM GMT
    realifedad saidFrom MONDOWEISS


    Two-stater says the reality has shifted to one apartheid state



    by Philip Weiss on August 27, 2012


    Here is another sign of the end of the two-state paradigm in the minds of those who were engaged in building two states. The dialogue project, bitterlemons, is closing down. From the two statements below, you can see that Palestinian intellectuals are growing increasingly resentful of normalization efforts, and that the hope that some felt around the two-state solution has drained away, including from European sponsors. (Thanks to Paul Mutter).

    Palestinian partner Ghassan Khatib, formerly of the P.A., says this:


    In the foreword to "The Best of Bitterlemons" compilation published in 2007, I noted that we rarely had trouble recruiting writers. Despite the feeling among many in the Arab world that contact with Israelis is tantamount to accepting Israel's occupation, seldom did authors decline an invitation. Lately, we have observed that this has changed, that even once-forthcoming Palestinians are less interested in sharing ideas with Israelis just across the way. Still, we have been able to present the voices of security chiefs and political prisoners, military generals and farmers losing land, spokespersons for armed groups and peaceniks in an equal and fair manner--rather differently than the situation on the ground.

    Nevertheless, this achievement is bittersweet as the scenery around us grows ever more dark and uncertain. Two decades after the signing of the Declaration of Principles that many hoped would usher in the creation of a Palestinian state and independence, freedom and security, Palestinians and Israelis are barely conversational. The structures created by those agreements have atrophied, corrupted by an increasing imbalance in the Palestinian relationship with Israel. Every day, there is new word of land confiscations, arrests, demolitions, and legislative maneuvers to solidify Israel's control. Israel's political leaders are beholden to a tide of right-wing sentiment and Palestinian leaders are made to appear ever-smaller in their shrinking spheres of control.

    We are now, it appears, at the lowest point in the arc of the pendulum, one that is swinging away from the two-state solution into a known unknown: an apartheid Israel. How this new "one-state" option will be transformed into a solution that provides freedom and security for all remains to be seen.

    Israeli partner Yossi Alpher adds this:


    We are ceasing publication for reasons involving fatigue--on a number of
    fronts. First, there is donor fatigue. Why, donors ask, should we continue to support a Middle East dialogue project that not only has not made peace, but cannot "prove" to our satisfaction--especially at a time of revolution and violence throughout the region--that it has indeed raised the level of civilized discussion? Why fight the Israeli right-wing campaign against European and American state funding and the Palestinian campaign against "normalization"?

    These last two negative developments also reflect local fatigue. There is no peace process and no prospect of one. Informal "track II" dialogue--bitterlemons might be described as a "virtual" track II--is declining. Here and there, writers from the region who used to favor us with their ideas and articles are now begging off, undoubtedly deterred by the revolutionary rise of intolerant political forces in their countries or neighborhood.




    LIL'AIPAC the HYPOCRITE still hasn't answered how he thinks he can approve settlement building on land set aside for a Palestinian state, and further that Palestinians home is in Jordan because there never was a Palestine. Niether of those two beliefs goes along with believing in a two state solution. How does this Zionist pain in the ass think he can have it both ways ?





    KEEP REPORTING LIL'AIPAC (W4) SPAMMING THE TOPICS



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    Aug 31, 2012 3:57 AM GMT
    Well POUNCER, YourName2000, IanCT, Jaxe and liberpaulian Nothing but more repeats of LIL'AIPAC's same old Propaganda >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    BUT NO REASONABLE DIALOG FOR THE GOYIM !!! LOL
  • Posted by a hidden member.
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    Aug 31, 2012 7:03 AM GMT
    Pouncer said
    realifedad saidWell POUNCER, YourName2000, IanCT, Jaxe and liberpaulian Nothing but more repeats of LIL'AIPAC's same old Propaganda >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    BUT NO REASONABLE DIALOG FOR THE GOYIM !!! LOL


    Sure thing. Kindly refrain from quoting.


    -----------------------------------------------------------------


    LIL'AIPAC the HYPOCRITE still hasn't answered how he thinks he can approve settlement building on land set aside for a Palestinian state, and further that Palestinians home is in Jordan because there never was a Palestine. Niether of those two beliefs goes along with believing in a two state solution. How does this Zionist pain in the ass think he can have it both ways ?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Still no progress on DIALOG FOR THE GOYIM FROM LIL'AIPAC, but more repeats
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    Aug 31, 2012 3:04 PM GMT
    AyaTrollah pouncer> "Supporters of the two-state solution are often told that this vision is unrealistic and has become unachievable" - which isn't actually true

    Another startling admission.
    What next, will AyaTrollah pouncer come out in favor of the two-state solution?!


    AyaTrollah pouncer> "Startling admission"? Really? Claiming the two-state solution is (barely) feasible after over 35 years of US-Israeli rejectionism on the two-state consensus is a "startling admission"?

    We know that English isn't your native language, but that isn't what I said.
    The startling admission is the double negative meaning that the two-state solution IS achievable.

    Revisiting the Clinton Compromise Parameters
    http://www.realjock.com/gayforums/2271313
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    Aug 31, 2012 4:10 PM GMT
    6 more spam reported of the same AIPAC STYLED PROPAGANDA with no response to the reality of the situation brought out by the GOYIM.

    STILL NO REASONABLE DIALOG FROM LIL'AIPAC

    Funny thing is its LIL'AIPAC's Zionist Zealot partners and apologists like him making the two state solution nearly impossible by their ILLEGAL SETTLEMENT BUILDING ADVENTURES.


    DOES ANYONE HAVE AN EXPLANATION FOR LIL'AIPAC's HYPOCRICY ?


    He cannot have it both ways, either there has to be an end to the Israeli Illegal actions as an OCCUPIER BUILDING SETTLEMENTS TO MOVE THEIR CITIZENRY ONTO OCCUPIED LAND meant to facilitate a 2 state solution or they'll have to accept a one state solution that their own actions bring about.


    IS LIL'AIPAC REALLY THIS DAMN STUPID OR FANATICAL THAT HE CANNOT UNDERSTAND THIS REALITY ?

    I HAVE TO WONDER ??


    KEEP IT UP LIL'AIPAC, YOU'RE MAKING AN OBVIOUS ASS OF YOURSELF AND DELEGITIMIZING YOUR OWN CAUSE,
    BECAUSE READERS SEE RIGHT THROUGH YOUR PROPAGANDA AND YOUR TACTIC OF IGNORING REALISTIC POINTS AND QUESTIONS FOR THE SAKE OF REPEATING THAT ZIONIST PROPAGANDA.

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    Aug 31, 2012 4:28 PM GMT
    Here's an article from Mondweiss regarding the fate of the Two state solution



    ‘After Zionism’ at the Frontline Club



    by Ahmed Moor on August 27, 2012

    Antony Loewenstein wrote about a discussion he participated in in Tel Aviv around our jointly edited anthology, After Zionism.

    We were lucky enough to have an opportunity to speak about a one state future with Ghada Karmi and Dimi Reider in London recently. The Frontline Club - a journalistic hub - provided us with the venue while Tim Llewellyn (a former BBC journalist with expertise in the Middle East) moderated the discussion.

    In reality, the one-state solution is only an idea now - but the one-apartheid-state was our point of departure. Recognition of the fact that we've moved well beyond anything called "two states for two peoples" was the basis for our discussion.

    The conversation was lively - but it could have been livelier. In other words, the four of us had few disagreements. Part of this had to do with the panel make-up, but I think it was also because we were speaking in London. The Palestine/Israel discussion in the UK (and Europe more broadly) has long been more open than that in the US. Facts are harder to argue against there.

    Here is a video of the panel"


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    Aug 31, 2012 5:35 PM GMT
    Oh, look, the ianct account is gone.
    I wonder which troll will be next....

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    Aug 31, 2012 5:54 PM GMT
    More repititious Spaming from LIL'AIPAC reported.



    another article regarding how the Settements are frustrating and nearly making a two state solution impossible. Settlements that LIL'AIPAC Approves of and apologizes for.



    Israeli Settlements in West Bank and the Two-State Solution









    May 22, 2012
    Enver Guseynov





    Israeli security checkpoints are scattered throughout the West Bank - Magne Hagesæter via Wiki Commons

    Israeli settlements in the West Bank reduce the prospects for a two-state solution by undermining the establishment of a viable Palestinian state.

    The construction of Jewish settlements in the West Bank has been one of Israel's most unpopular policies at domestic, regional, and international levels. While Palestinian terrorism has routinely undermined the two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and continues to terrorize Israeli civilians, Israel's settlement policies have done little to counter these violent forces or increase the prospects for peace. In addition to frustrating the disgruntled Palestinian masses and strengthening radical elements that advocate violent resistance against the Israelis, settlement activities in the West Bank serve as an increasingly steep barrier to a two-state solution between the two peoples.

    Reasons Behind Israel's Settlement Policy

    Since the late 1960s two factors have been driving Israel's determination to populate the Arab populated West Bank with Jewish settlers. First, Israeli leaders, having experienced numerous confrontations with the neighboring Arab states, were convinced that only by extending its borders into the territories of its Arab adversaries will Israel be able to gain a strategic edge over them and thus enhance its regional security. One of these territories was the West Bank, which was controlled by Jordan until Israel invaded it during the 1967 Arab-Israeli War. Soon afterwards Israel began building both military and civilian outposts throughout the region in order to solidify its claim to it and strengthen itself against future attacks.

    The second factor has been the ambition to realize the dream of Greater Israel, which calls for the establishment of a Jewish state stretching from the Mediterranean Sea to the Jordan River and therefore encompassing the West Bank (referred to as Judea and Samaria by right wing Israelis) The achievement of this goal was made problematic by the heavy concentration of Palestinian Arabs in the West Bank, many of whom were refugees that fled Israel following the 1948 Israeli-Palestinian War. Israel sought to solve this problem by introducing Jewish settlers into the West Bank and thus tipping the demographic balance in its favor, a policy continued to this day.



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    Settlements Making the Two-State Solution Unfeasible

    Today there are around 300,000 Jewish settlers living in 120 official settlements and several unauthorized outposts in the West Bank. In addition, 200,000 more reside in Israeli annexed East Jerusalem. In order to protect the settlers from terrorist attacks by the disgruntled Palestinians, the Israeli government has taken several protective measures such as the construction of roadblocks, fences, and checkpoints along many major West Bank roads and Palestinian areas. In all, 40% of the land in West Bank has been appropriated by Israel for construction of roads, military infrastructure, and protected land that service the Jewish settlers.

    In addition to restricting the Palestinians’ freedom of movement in a territory designated to be part of a Palestinian state, these measures deal a blow to their morale by suggesting that the presence of settlements will always interfere with the prospect of a Palestinian state. Several major Israeli settlement blocs cut well into the West Bank, with the East Jerusalem linked Maale Adumime threatening to divide the territory into two cantons (Mearsheimer & Walt, 104).

    This is precisely what makes Jewish settlements a particularly salient obstacle to the two-state solution; they are literally facts on the ground, a physical presence disrupting the continuity of Palestinian controlled territory in the West Bank and undermining the viability of a Palestinian state. The matter is stated succinctly by Middle East expert Alon Ben-Meir who asserts that, “Every housing unit built beyond the 1967 Green Line [Israel-West Bank border] has physical, psychological and political ramifications, making the issue a formidable obstacle to overcome if a two-state solution is to be achieved”.

    Expansion of settlements contradicts Israel’s commitment to a two-state solution and reinforces Palestinian perception that Israel is bent on appropriating chunks of the West Bank while gradually purging it of its Arab population. This plays into the hands of radical elements like Hamas and Islamic Jihad, who oppose the two state solution and call for Israel's destruction. Conversely it discourages moderate Palestinian leaders from embracing negotiations with Israel, as such gesture would make them look weak and ineffective in the eyes of the Palestinian masses.


    More on this topic

    UN Frustrated with Mid-East Peace Stalemate
    'Palestine' or Palestine?
    A One-state Solution for Israel and Palestine

    According to Ben-Meir, “Since the Oslo signing of the Declaration of Principles in September of 1993, the number of Israeli settlers in the West Bank has nearly tripled, from approximately 116,000 in 1993 to over 300,000 today.” This increase wasn’t simply due to natural population growth, as the growth rate of Israelis in West Bank settlements was significantly higher than the population growth in Israel proper during that time period (Mearsheimer & Walt, 40). Additional outposts were of course constructed to absorb the growing number of settlers, meaning that throughout the Oslo years Israel was essentially appropriating parts of the West Bank which the Palestinians believed would be up for negotiations during future peace settlement talks.

    Complicating matters further is the fact that several settlements have been constructed on privately owned Palestinian lands. According to Peace Now, an Israeli based movement opposed to settlement activities in Palestinian territories, 38% of private Palestinian land has been used for the construction of Jewish settlements and settlement related infrastructure (Israeli Settlement Building…, p. 15).

    Settlements in East Jerusalem

    Current Israeli Prime Minister Benyamin Netanyahu’s policies in the West Bank have done little to assuage the settlement issue. The Likud leader’s ten month settlement freeze that sought to revamp the Israeli-Palestinian peace talks was rendered irrelevant when Israel’s Interior Ministry announced the planned construction of 1600 new housing units in an East Jerusalem neighborhood. Soon after Netanyahu voiced his support for settlement activities in East Jerusalem, while calling Palestinian demands that Israel halt construction there unacceptable.

    Even if Israel does have a legitimate claim to a unified Jerusalem, ongoing settlement activities in mostly Arab populated East Jerusalem are counterproductive and damaging to the prospect of a two-state solution. After all, East Jerusalem is home to the Dome of the Rock, one of Islam's holiest sites, and the issue of Jerusalem should at least be kept on a negotiating table to illustrate that Israel is genuinely committed to the two-state solution. The expansion of Jewish settlements in this highly sensitive area is a negative gesture on the part of the Israeli government that discourages Palestinian involvement in the settlement talks, while strengthening