Gay, Short, and Over 40

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    Mar 16, 2017 12:43 AM GMT
    Let me cut to the chase: Yes, I'm gay. I'm short (5'2"). Often ignored, ridiculed, and not treated seriously because of my height. I'm not sure why. Sometimes treated as if I don't even exist. Always the last one to know if there's an event at work or outside work. The crazy part of it is that they often assume I'd know if something is going on (WTH! LOL!). I didn't know I'm psychic (SMH. LOL!). How should I know? I often find out things after the fact. (So, what events I'm talking about? Things like going out in restaurant, in a bar, co-workers birthday, barbecue, go out for a hike, etc.)

    I'm very much single. I've always been single (which means I never had a partner). Why? I don't know, probably because I don't go out. Well, I do go out, but unfortunately, I get treated like I'm from a foreign land, a retard, weird, etc. or sometimes I get pinned down, stepped on at the club while on the dance floor (LOL), Why? Because I'm short, they can't see me or notice that I'm there, around these tall sexy people. Not their fault, I'm vertically challenged. Or, sometimes, I get this weird stare with an insulting grin or smirk. Believe me; I make fun of myself, at times, when it happens. Lastly, I can't even make friends with gay guys because I don't resemble Zach Efron or Nick Jonas, not trendy, weird, unintelligent, nothing in common, etc. Even race comes to play, which is ridiculous and sad. I'm not exaggerating. What I am saying here is what I was told numerous times in the gay community. So, I am not making this up.

    To add: some folks responded here (I apologize to the both of them because I sounded too sensitive) said that maybe because I'm fat. My profile indicated that I'm 5'2" and 170 lbs, which is overweight for my height and it makes me undesirable. True but it's too ill-defined. So, now I'm confused. LOL! I wasn't thinking about my weight because it's temporary. I can always lose the weight and I don't want to lose weight just because I wanted to be desired. But, is it true that being fat has no room, it seems, in the gay community. Now, I am more traumatized. Why? Well, because I don't know what these "gay fat haters" mean when they say your fat. How do they categorize it? Is 15, 20, 30 ove your ideal weight means that your fat and undesirable? Weightlifters are overweight with >30 BMI, so does this mean they're "fat." It's confusing. Being gay is hard. If you're short, fat, and ugly, you're screwed it seems in this lifestyle. UGH!!!

    Right now, I'm 44. I am not that old. And I look young for my age. Not to brag, some folks think I'm on my late-20's or mid-30's. Now, that's what people I know or met always say.

    Now, because of numerous traumatic experiences, I feel like I have lost my self-worth, my self-esteem (well, what's that?), and my self-confidence, (umm, huh?). I get very anxious even the thought of going out. I - am - traumatized. But, I'm still trying to snap out of it. Although, it has been tough.

    So, what's your assessment?
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    Mar 16, 2017 1:14 AM GMT
    troi1973 said
    Right now, I'm 44. I am not that old. And I look young for my age. Not to brag, some folks think I'm on my late-20's or mid-30's. Now, that's what people I know or met always say.

    Now, because of numerous traumatic experiences, I feel like I have lost my self-worth, my self-esteem (well, what's that?), and my self-confidence, (umm, huh?). I get very anxious even the thought of going out. I - am - traumatized. But, I'm still trying to snap out of it. Although, it has been tough.

    So, what's your assessment?

    I know your Federal Way. A Right Wing speed trap on !-5. Not a welcoming place to be gay.

    Try driving up to Seattle. Or just moving there, if you can. I came out there at 45. Had the most gay sex in my life there (well, there and Fargo, North Dakota, too, of all the gawd-forsaken places). And I'm fairly short, too, 5'7".

    Tell yah a story. In the early 1970s I was in the Officer's Club with another Lieutenant in Fort McClellan, Alabama. And we were at the bar, behind which was a long mirror. And I saw the 2 of us. Now I knew he was a tall guy, about 6-4, but there we were, and I looked like a midget next to him.

    I jumped away, and he asked me what I was doing. I explained i was humiliated for being so short standing next to him.

    And he said: "Bob, I never think of you as short, because you don't ACT like you're short. You act as tall as anyone I know. "

    It was one of the nicest things anyone ever said to me. Because, like you, I could be self-conscious about my relative shortness. That I could feel very much in the Army where pretty much everybody was taller than me. And obviously I still remember his encouraging words, over 40 years later.

    Don't YOU think of yourself as short, and you won't BE short, either.
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    Mar 16, 2017 1:24 AM GMT
    I am gay, 5'4", and over 40, and doing fine. ^ Nola is correct. You can't be fat if you want others to desire you.
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    Mar 16, 2017 1:56 AM GMT
    NOLAman1977 saidYour profile says you're 5'2" and 170lbs. Are you sure your woes aren't due to your weight? Gays dislike fat far more than short.


    Really?!?! Am I very very fat? Look at my pictures. Do I look morbidly obese? I can still see my picker when I pee. See, this is what I'm talking about. Hahahaha! No offense. You dislike big folks. I'm not even that big. Yes, it's not the ideal weight for my height, but I do not believe I'm fat the way you describe it. I respect your honesty, though.

    WOW! (Oh, well. I asked for the assessment.)
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    Mar 16, 2017 1:59 AM GMT
    woodsmen said
    I am gay, 5'4", and over 40, and doing fine. ^ Nola is correct. You can't be fat if you want others to desire you.

    Well, you and Nola have a point about that.
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    Mar 16, 2017 2:03 AM GMT
    NOLAman1977 saidYour profile says you're 5'2" and 170lbs. Are you sure your woes aren't due to you're weight? Gays dislike fat far more than short.


    Are you sure all gay men dislike fat more than short? Or, you're speaking for yourself? I'm not even morbidly obese. I still have my muscle; I put in some pounds after the Navy and water weight. But I am not "fat" the way you described it as if I'm 300 lb short man. I'm not hurt, though, but it's just too ridiculous the way you said it. Thanks for the honesty and I like you for that.

    Well, I asked for the assessment. This is what I'll get. Hahahaha!!!
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    Mar 16, 2017 2:06 AM GMT
    Thanks for the advice. I don't think too much of my shortness, but the majority of people always have to remind me.
    art_deco said
    troi1973 said
    Right now, I'm 44. I am not that old. And I look young for my age. Not to brag, some folks think I'm on my late-20's or mid-30's. Now, that's what people I know or met always say.

    Now, because of numerous traumatic experiences, I feel like I have lost my self-worth, my self-esteem (well, what's that?), and my self-confidence, (umm, huh?). I get very anxious even the thought of going out. I - am - traumatized. But, I'm still trying to snap out of it. Although, it has been tough.

    So, what's your assessment?

    I know your Federal Way. A Right Wing speed trap on !-5. Not a welcoming place to be gay.

    Try driving up to Seattle. Or just moving there, if you can. I came out there at 45. Had the most gay sex in my life there (well, there and Fargo, North Dakota, too, of all the gawd-forsaken places). And I'm fairly short, too, 5'7".

    Tell yah a story. In the early 1970s I was in the Officer's Club with another Lieutenant in Fort McClellan, Alabama. And we were at the bar, behind which was a long mirror. And I saw the 2 of us. Now I knew he was a tall guy, about 6-4, but there we were, and I looked like a midget next to him.

    I jumped away, and he asked me what I was doing. I explained i was humiliated for being so short standing next to him.

    And he said: "Bob, I never think of you as short, because you don't ACT like you're short. You act as tall as anyone I know. "

    It was one of the nicest things anyone ever said to me. Because, like you, I could be self-conscious about my relative shortness. That I could feel very much in the Army where pretty much everybody was taller than me. And obviously I still remember his encouraging words, over 40 years later.

    Don't YOU think of yourself as short, and you won't BE short, either.
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    Mar 16, 2017 2:18 AM GMT
    troi1973 said
    NOLAman1977 said
    Your profile says you're 5'2" and 170lbs. Are you sure your woes aren't due to your weight? Gays dislike fat far more than short.

    Really?!?! Am I very very fat? Look at my pictures. Do I look morbidly obese? I can still see my picker when I pee. See, this is what I'm talking about. Hahahaha! No offense. You dislike big folks. I'm not even that big. Yes, it's not the ideal weight for my height, but I do not believe I'm fat the way you describe it. I respect your honesty, though.

    WOW! (Oh, well. I asked for the assessment.)

    We had height & weight standards in the Army. And some guys exceeded the weight. But they had a chance for a medical evaluation.

    Because some guys were solid muscle, that can be heavier. No fat on 'em at all.

    And there are racial differences, too. For instance, Polynesians might tend to not meet these military height-weight standards, which were somewhat established on European models. And yet they are in perfectly good health.

    So don't know what our OP is. He does seem a bit heavy. I'm 5-7, and fluctuating in the 180s. I know I'm overweight and gotta come down. My goal is around 160, or ideally 155 for my age.
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    Mar 16, 2017 3:32 AM GMT
    I apologize Nolan. You just can't generalize fat. There are a lot of reason and factors to consider before you make a conclusion that a person is "fat". You have a point though but the delivery was a bit off.

    NOLAman1977 said
    troi1973 said
    NOLAman1977 saidYour profile says you're 5'2" and 170lbs. Are you sure your woes aren't due to your weight? Gays dislike fat far more than short.


    Really?!?! Am I very very fat? Look at my pictures. Do I look morbidly obese? I can still see my picker when I pee. See, this is what I'm talking about. Hahahaha! No offense. You dislike big folks. I'm not emven that big. Yes, it's not the ideal weight for my height, but I do not believe I'm fat the way you describe it. I respect your honesty, though.

    WOW! (Oh, well. I asked for the assessment.)


    I guess it's a good thing I didn't say anything about your looks.
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    Mar 16, 2017 3:41 AM GMT
    You are very accurate. I was in the Navy. I was over because of my height but not because I wasn't "fat". I was a few pounds over my ideal weight. I'm black/filipino/polyneasian mix. I don't believe just because I'm 170 (now 165) means I'm fat and generally undesirable. Is that how low gay men are nowadays? LOL!

    art_deco said
    troi1973 said
    NOLAman1977 said
    Your profile says you're 5'2" and 170lbs. Are you sure your woes aren't due to your weight? Gays dislike fat far more than short.

    Really?!?! Am I very very fat? Look at my pictures. Do I look morbidly obese? I can still see my picker when I pee. See, this is what I'm talking about. Hahahaha! No offense. You dislike big folks. I'm not even that big. Yes, it's not the ideal weight for my height, but I do not believe I'm fat the way you describe it. I respect your honesty, though.

    WOW! (Oh, well. I asked for the assessment.)

    We had height & weight standards in the Army. And some guys exceeded the weight. But they had a chance for a medical evaluation.

    Because some guys were solid muscle, that can be heavier. No fat on 'em at all.

    And there are racial differences, too. For instance, Polynesians might tend to not meet these military height-weight standards, which were somewhat established on European models. And yet they are in perfectly good health.

    So don't know what our OP is. He does seem a bit heavy. I'm 5-7, and fluctuating in the 180s. I know I'm overweight and gotta come down. My goal is around 160, or ideally 155 for my age.
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    Mar 16, 2017 5:19 AM GMT
    Napoleon complex.
    We're a short person wants to seem taller.
    Not suggesting that the OP, is inflicted with this aggressive psychological disorder.
  • jocked_and_lo...

    Posts: 5159

    Mar 16, 2017 5:26 AM GMT
    Look at it this way. Would you look twice at a person who is 5'2", 170lb (which seems to have dropped to 165lb since this thread started) with a 34" waist? I can relate from personal experience. My waist is now 32" and I'm 6ft tall and 231lb. But there was a time when I had a 36" waist and I was around 245lb and not as muscular. No one paid me any attention. My face was round like yours. The moment I finally dropped back down to a 32" waist and my face leaned down, women and men started noticing me.

    There are guys on this site who are around 5'9" and weigh around 150lb and have some beautiful athletic and tight lean bodies. They typically have no more than a 31" waist. A person at 5'2" would probably have to have a 28-29" waist and weigh less than 140lb to have a similar appearance.

    You are pudgy. It shows in your face. I would guess your body fat level is at least 30-35%. Forty percent is considered obese. You might have muscle under the fat but there's no point if the levels are so high that it's all completely hidden. Look at this photo and honestly assess yourself to see which photo your body most resembles.

    body-fat-percentage-men.jpg
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    Mar 16, 2017 5:26 AM GMT
    Hahaha! You have a point. But I don't want to be taller though. I'm satisfied with my height. (Nope, I lied. I wish I was a few inches taller like at least 5'5" or 5'8".) Though short, I would date me. LOL! Now, with the Napoleon complex, it's all I have.

    Odin saidNapoleon complex.
    We're a short person wants to seem taller.
    Not suggesting that the OP, is inflicted with this aggressive physical disorder.
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    Mar 16, 2017 5:45 AM GMT
    Thanks, MuchoMas. I just don't want you to think that I don't know I'm pudgy. I worked in the medical field especially when I was in the Navy to where I take part of making sure that our sailors are within standards. You can't compare my pudginess to the other men on this site because each has unique situations. I wasn't even talking about being overweight because I see myself in the mirror every day and "honestly" assess myself regularly. I already know that more than 30%. But I will tell you this. Even when I was 145 with 29-30 waist, I was still ignored. Why? Because I was short and most men say it to my face. Then I gained after the military because of the medication I'm taking. However, I am lucky enough that I didn't go over 40%. I have maintained 30-35% and still going down. I'm not sure if you're trying to be constructive, but it seems like you're assuming I'm too blind to see how "fat" I am that I need to look in the mirror and "honestly" assess myself. I hope that's not what you're implying.

    MuchoMasQueMusculo saidLook at it this way. Would you look twice at a person who is 5'2", 170lb (which seems to have dropped to 165lb since this thread started) with a 34" waist? I can relate from personal experience. My waist is now 32" and I'm 6ft tall and 231lb. But there was a time when I had a 36" waist and I was around 245lb and not as muscular. No one paid me any attention. My face was round like yours. The moment I finally dropped back down to a 32" waist and my face leaned down, women and men started noticing me.

    There are guys on this site who are around 5'9" and weigh around 150lb and have some beautiful athletic and tight lean bodies. They typically have no more than a 31" waist. A person at 5'2" would probably have to have a 28-29" waist and weigh less than 140lb to have a similar appearance.

    You are pudgy. It shows in your face. I would guess your body fat level is at least 30-35%. Forty percent is considered obese. You might have muscle under the fat but there's no point if the levels are so high that it's all completely hidden. Look at this photo and honestly assess yourself to see which photo your body most resembles.

    body-fat-percentage-men.jpg
  • BloodFlame

    Posts: 1860

    Mar 16, 2017 9:24 AM GMT
    I know I'm way on the opposite side of this spectrum and I'm sure it's not because you're short though unfortunately, it's true that a lot of guys may be turned off by guys shorter than them though I've noticed a lot more dominant guys like shorter guys even if they're muscular. I think some factors play into this. Do you ever initiate any contact to guys or do you wait for them to contact you? And I did take a look at your profile, particular the kind of guys you're into and well, I don't want to be that person but if you typically go for white men (just assuming because of the red-hair comment), it will be kind of a struggle because most will be attracted to other white guys, especially the younger ones. I'm not saying it's racist but just pointing this out because I feel a lot of minorities need to keep that in mind.

    And I know you pointed out that you don't think you look overweight but going off your pictures, you do look a bit overweight but I mean, I know some guys who workout and have muscle to show for it can have that beefy muscular look but I can't really see that on you because you don't have a shirtless pic so going off that, it does come off a bit chunky/overweight and I'm not saying it's bad or anything but it will be a turn off for quite a few guys (again, not saying I'm better, I really am not and it can be just as harsh on the other side for those of us on the skinnier side). But I'm just being realistic. You may not think you look overweight but to others, that might be the case.

    The only things I can think of is try looking for guys who like bigger/stockier men, they are out there but you gotta use certain search words. That or just continue with your weight loss journey and start dating when you feel ready. Also, try not to be too insecure about your height. I know it's hard but you just gotta try to think positively.

    Good luck!
  • NealJohn

    Posts: 524

    Mar 16, 2017 12:26 PM GMT
    You wanted an honest answer , you'll get one. It's your body. You're not shapely in a good way. Take your gym and diet seriously and you will reap the rewards. Height has nothing to do with it, because short muscular guys are very hot!
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    Mar 16, 2017 2:58 PM GMT
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    Mar 16, 2017 6:49 PM GMT
    As I read trough all these comments I fell disgusted...You dont have to look like a Menshealth cover guy to date have a relationship when being Gay,its a bonus if you do look like that, but lets face the majority of us doesn't look like that !
    @Troi1973 what I think you need is a good dose of self-confidence remember what you put out in the universe you'll get it in return.
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    Mar 17, 2017 2:37 AM GMT
    ::side note::
    I could sit here and read Blood Flame's post all day.
    @bloodflame
    Your soo freaking cool. Really like your insights and thoughts.
    -me
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    Mar 17, 2017 2:51 AM GMT
    For all of those who responded. Thank you very very very much. I know I'm overweight and that wasn't even in my postings was all about originally. Then me being FAT came up and insulted and fat-shammed at the same time. I just added a few things about it when it was brought up. Now, I was overweight my entire life. Like I said, it is temporary, and I am working on it not to be desired but to be healthy. Just because I said my kryptonite are red-heads, it doesn't mean I exclusively just want to date a white man. HAHAHAHA!!!! I like all races, and I can date anyone who wants to date me; black, white, yellow, red, blue, Martians, etc. Unfortunately, no one trying to date me because I was too short then. And now, I am short and fat. But some of you miss the first couple sentences when I said, "I'm very much single. I've always been single (which means I never had a partner)." Again, I said, I NEVER had a partner, which means I never had a boyfriend, then when I wasn't overweight, sexy with a muscular body but still ignored.

    I made this post as an experiment and hoping to get a CONSTRUCTIVE response, but instead, I received "fat-shaming." Telling me nobody would like to date me because I'm fat and undesirable. It's just like telling me that I look nasty and hideous. And it strikes me that when some folks offered their opinion as if "ALL" gay men dislikes fat and nasty fat people. One response even posted a picture that shows BMI and told me to look in the mirror and honestly assess myself then compare my body to the picture. I find that insulting.

    I was hoping to get good advice or constructive criticism from people in the gay community. But from the response I received, it seems like gay men are shallow and superficial. And, a beautiful body trumps personality because it is more important.

    Reading some of the responses here is amusing and disappointing.

    I GUESS IT'S MY FAULT AND I ASKED FOR IT. UGH! SMH!
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    Mar 17, 2017 2:52 AM GMT
    Thanks sweetness!

    Marchello saidAs I read trough all these comments I fell disgusted...You dont have to look like a Menshealth cover guy to date have a relationship when being Gay,its a bonus if you do look like that, but lets face the majority of us doesn't look like that !
    @Troi1973 what I think you need is a good dose of self-confidence remember what you put out in the universe you'll get it in return.
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    Mar 17, 2017 2:56 AM GMT
    I can take your honest answer and the choice of words. I am aware that my body went crazy. You are a good man and I like you because your great personality shows through your response. It's true us short people are HOT!!! It's the reason I made this post in this forum because I was wondering why I couldn't get a man even when I was sexy. You actually helped me understand that shortness is not really the issue. Being fat, well, I can take care of it.

    THANK YOU, NEALJOHN!!!

    NealJohn saidYou wanted an honest answer , you'll get one. It's your body. You're not shapely in a good way. Take your gym and diet seriously and you will reap the rewards. Height has nothing to do with it, because short muscular guys are very hot!
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    Mar 17, 2017 2:59 AM GMT
    MuchoMasQueMusculo said...there was a time when I had a 36" waist and I was around 245lb and not as muscular. No one paid me any attention. My face was round like yours. The moment I finally dropped back down to a 32" waist and my face leaned down, women and men started noticing me...You are pudgy. It shows in your face.

    This is absolutely true. When I have carb face I get almost no attention despite being relatively muscular. But when I lean out and the bone structure shows through I get lots of attention from men and women. Maybe because jawlines and cheekbones are, at least in general in most Western cultures, considered markers of attractiveness.

    I hate to say it (because I know it's my answer for almost everything) but while there IS height discrimination (there are workplace studies showing that most senior executives skew TALL, please don't fight me on this or ask for a link to prove my assertion, people, do your own research and then draw your own conclusion), muscle really counts. I will definitely be called out for objectifying - because I am - but two of the hottest guys I was ever with were 5'5". Because of their short height (and hard work), they could pile on a ton of muscle and had slabs for traps tapering down to broad shoulders, shelf-like pecs and batwing-like lats v'ing down to cobblestone abs, defined apollo belts and incredible bubble butts. Given their shorter arms and legs they were strong as fuck too (shorter distances allow one to propel more weight). I know that's not EVERYONE'S type but a lot of guys, me included, love fun-sized, toss-able pocket gays built like brick shithouses. So it totally sucks, but it's not height that's keeping you from being noticed but your weight. The only good news here is that while it's never easy, you'll have an easier time developing the kind of body that gets attention, in fact it may only be largely a matter of fat loss - I looked through your profile and you looked good even sporting the suggestion of abs in your old shirtless pic, that body's probably still there, and if you lean out enough can FAR exceed your previous condition. It's a numbers game and you have to play it - the more guys you attract, the more likelihood of finding guys who will love you for YOU (and forgive you if you get fat again, which is usually inevitable, which also sucks, most of us yo-yo.) So make lemonade out of your height.

    Again, apologies for objectifying, and let me score points for acknowledging that my type isn't everyone's - but it's a LOT of peoples'. Make the most of your assets!
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    Mar 17, 2017 3:03 AM GMT
    Thanks for the response. You misunderstood when I said that red-heads are my kryptonite. It doesn't mean that I prefer only white dudes. LOL! And yes your assumption was wrong. Hahaha!

    BloodFlame saidI know I'm way on the opposite side of this spectrum and I'm sure it's not because you're short though unfortunately, it's true that a lot of guys may be turned off by guys shorter than them though I've noticed a lot more dominant guys like shorter guys even if they're muscular. I think some factors play into this. Do you ever initiate any contact to guys or do you wait for them to contact you? And I did take a look at your profile, particular the kind of guys you're into and well, I don't want to be that person but if you typically go for white men (just assuming because of the red-hair comment), it will be kind of a struggle because most will be attracted to other white guys, especially the younger ones. I'm not saying it's racist but just pointing this out because I feel a lot of minorities need to keep that in mind.

    And I know you pointed out that you don't think you look overweight but going off your pictures, you do look a bit overweight but I mean, I know some guys who workout and have muscle to show for it can have that beefy muscular look but I can't really see that on you because you don't have a shirtless pic so going off that, it does come off a bit chunky/overweight and I'm not saying it's bad or anything but it will be a turn off for quite a few guys (again, not saying I'm better, I really am not and it can be just as harsh on the other side for those of us on the skinnier side). But I'm just being realistic. You may not think you look overweight but to others, that might be the case.

    The only things I can think of is try looking for guys who like bigger/stockier men, they are out there but you gotta use certain search words. That or just continue with your weight loss journey and start dating when you feel ready. Also, try not to be too insecure about your height. I know it's hard but you just gotta try to think positively.

    Good luck!
  • Webster666

    Posts: 9225

    Mar 17, 2017 3:07 AM GMT
    Being 5'-2" is not the problem.
    Being 5'-2" and 170 # and not working out, isn't what many guys are looking to date.
    In your profile, in pictures 2 and 3, you're very attractive.
    Lose the hats.
    On your profile page, you said that you were looking for, " someone who can motivate me to start working out and help me bring my "sexy" back."
    It doesn't work that way.
    You've got to WANT to work out, and to do it for yourself.
    When you're in good muscular shape, a lot of guys will notice you.