Human Growth Hormone / IGF-1

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    Jan 30, 2008 8:16 AM GMT
    Hey guys,

    I work for a sports lab in Australia, and would be more than happy to answer your questions/enquiries about Human Growth Hormone, as well as the latest cutting edge enchancer - IGF1.

    If you have any genuine enquiries about these, please email me.

    I know a lot of guys are considering using to make themselves bigger and better, and if you are going to do so, you should be well advised prior to taking anything. Id be happy to help.

    So, I'm here to talk with anyone, as long as your enquiries are genuine and for the right reasons.

    All the best with your training!
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    Jan 30, 2008 7:53 PM GMT
    Does the stuff work? I saw a doc a while back, and he recommended starting it--genotropin sc crtg 0.2 mg injection--1 a day. Will that do anything? Is the dose sort of wimpy? When do you inject in relation to the workout??

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    Jan 30, 2008 7:59 PM GMT
    2IU a day will help change your body composition if you use it over a LONG period of time (6 months or longer).

    Competing bodybuilders will use 3 to 10 IU daily.

    It will take a while to see the GH working at 2IU.

    You will notice your skin looking younger, get leaner, lower BP, better appetitie and libido, and like AAS, just overall general sense of well being and recovery.

    I'd definitely go with it. It will like add years to your life, as well as improve the quality of your life.

    It's a no brainer.
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    Jan 30, 2008 8:01 PM GMT
    The number of docs prescribing it seems to really be going up.
    How about timing? When in relation to the workout?
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    Jan 30, 2008 8:03 PM GMT
    1st thing in the morning, and right before bed is typical protocol.

    You may wish to view a serious muscle board like or to read up on the protocol. There is a wealth of good information about GH, both scientific and anecdotal.

    Unless you're taking GH at high dose levels (7 to 20IU), you won't really notice many side effects. If you do, you back down some but at 2IU, it's going to take several months to really see differences, and, at that level, side effects are almost unheard of.

    Just another note: there's a strongly held belief that GH causes hyperplasia. Having met some of the BEASTS that are heavy users of GH, I'm inclined to agree. I think the jury is still out on hyperplasia, but, GH and AAS, are awesome anti-aging medicine and, used properly, can make a PRONOUNCED improvement in the quality of your life.
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    Jan 30, 2008 8:04 PM GMT
    I really appreciate it. Thanks again.
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    Jan 30, 2008 8:11 PM GMT
    From my cursory reading- HGH adds more muscle cells (goes beyond your genetics) while AAS increases the size of your muscle cells. HGH + AAS will give someone amazing results, from what I've read in the below thread...
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    Jan 30, 2008 8:15 PM GMT
    t was originally posted on AF by Death on the field.

    Growth Hormone

    Rating: (1 being the lowest, 5 being the highest)
    Weight Gain-4
    Fat Loss-4
    Side Effects-2
    Keep Gains--4

    Side Effects:
    Hypoglycemia- due to lowered insulin levels.
    Aromeglia- (abnormal bone growth) GH does not cause it, but if you are predisposed to it, it will speed it up.
    GH gut- if predisposed and taking large doses of GH
    Carpel Tunnel Syndrome
    Soreness in Joints

    Benefits of GH:
    New Muscle Cells
    Mood Enhancement
    Smoothing and improving the skin
    Leanness, it is a potent fat burner
    Joint and ligament strengthening

    Where to Inject, How, and How to Make:
    You can site inject anywhere you can reach the subcutaneous layer. Pinch the flesh and pull back, then insert the needle in the "pocket" underneath. Doesn't absorb quick enough if you inject into the adipose tissue. Do not inject intra-muscular, though it can be done, it is not recommended. GH is a site injection, where it is shot is where it will burn the most noticeable fat. Most people do it in the stomach since that is a typical sub q shot with most of the fat being in that area. GH should be kept in a fridge; freezing will destroy the GH. On your kit it probably says to use the kit in 18-24 hours, remember these are for AIDS patients, not bodybuilders or athletes. Mixing the GH can either be done with sterile water or bacteriostic water. The kit with water will be fine for 3 days in the fridge, even with the sterile water, but you should not take this chance, rather you should use bacteriostic water and play it safe. This will keep it fine for a couple of weeks. When mixing the GH, let the water slide down the side as to not pulverize the GH wafer. Do not spray it directly against the wafer with any force. Before reconstitution and even after GH is fragile!!! Also once the water is injected into the bottle gently swirl the vial to reconstitute, do not shake or swirl violently!!!!

    1 ml = 1 cc -/+
    100 units per 1 cc

    6 mg = 18iu

    1 ml = 18iu

    .50 ml = 9iu

    .25 ml = 4.5iu

    Some people choose to only do it in cc’s but here is how you can do it in units on a slin dart

    5.5 = 1iu, so 2iu = 11 on a slin dart

    Differences Between Kits:
    The main difference between kits is how many iu’s they make when reconstituted. For example, Serostim re-constitutes to make 126iu, while a Saizen kit.... also made by Serono.... makes up 15iu. Another of their kits makes 54iu. It better be way cheaper than a Serostim kit! Humatrope is fine, but costs too much. The other main concern would be fakes; Lilly is the most often faked one. Some older GH kits do not have holograms on them and are legit, but they are usually only less than 100 dollars than new GH kits with holograms, and I would rather be assured of the hologram and legitimacy of the kit. Best buy currently is Serostim 126 iu kits. These are made for people with wasting diseases like AIDs. Many of these patients got infected because they are IV drug addicts..........they sell the Serostim on the street for drug money.


    4 to 6 iu ed is sufficient. Most people take it 5 days on 2 days off at their designated dosage. There is no reason or evidence why you cannot stay on for various lengths of time; there is no need to go 5 on 2 off other than cost. Considering that our natural production is only .5 to 1.5iu a day, this is still a huge bump for the body. Research has shown that the body's natural defense systems render mega doses of GH ineffective, anyway. GH does not cause gains in allows you to put on a great deal of lean mass in combination with proper steroid and insulin use. The user before taking must know this. One or two kits are not enough, you need at least 3 to make you happy, GH takes a while to make its effects, but remember they are long lasting, what you see is what you keep. It takes 6 to 8 weeks to notice a dramatic change in body comp using GH on an ED or 5/2 split. Lighter doses for long periods of time are better than large doses for short cycles. Like any other drug, the more you take the more the benefits, but likewise also more risks. 4-6 iu is a standard dose but many people take more, the most repulsing side effects happen at or beyond 12 iu a day but like anything else it depends on your predisposition for it.

    How to Stack:
    GH is best taken in conjunction with insulin, anabolic steroids, and t3. Insulin is extremely effective with GH, as anyone here who has tried it will testify. This is because GH injections cause a down regulation of insulin sensitivity in the body.
    GH alone causes little growth of lean mass, however, when combined with insulin and steroids (and IGF-1 if you can find it), the results can be down right remarkable...esp. in the older bodybuilder. Start light with the humulin...5iu...and work up 1 iu a day till you get use to it. 7 to 10iu in the AM and 7 to 10 iu in the late afternoon, with split doses of GH is your best bet. When splitting GH/insulin doses, I use mid-morning and late afternoon after lifting.... both flat times in our natural GH production. The insulin overcomes the insulin-resistance caused by exogenous GH supplementation. If you are scared to take insulin thought, then Gh with Test and Glucophage is good. GH is good for cutting if used alone. Glucophage allows for improved glucose and amino acid absorption by the muscle tissue and does it safely. This is what you want. The half-life of GH is only 2 hours so spread it out. Avoid bedtime injections since we produce the bulk of our own GH in the first two hours of sleep. Since exogenous GH suppresses this, you should not take it before bed. For best results, use a 17aa oral during the cycle to stimulate the release of natural insulin growth factors. I would run the test throughout. GH/insulin/test is the proven synergistic combination.
    It is also wise to preload with testosterone before starting GH if you are going to do it. You should preload with the amount of time it takes for that testosterone to kick in, since most of us take longer acting esters for testosterone you should usually start taking the test 2 weeks before GH use. Likewise, you can accommodate it to fit your needs; the key is for the test to be kicking in the same time you are starting to run your GH. You can cycle you steroids however you want to depending on your goals, if you are going for a more massive look than you would run insulin for most of the cycle and use high androgens, but if you are looking for additional leanness at the end of a cycle you should stop the androgens and run a higher dose of GH or run less androgens. T3 is also another substance that should be used during GH cycling since GH lowers thyroid hormones. T3 should be used for shorter periods though, because it can permanently alter the endocrine system. The magic of GH for men is the ability to gain mass without fat or bloating when stacked properly with insulin, and steroids. GH also makes for amazing improvements in skin...smoothes wrinkles, burns stubborn spots of adipose tissue, gives that paper-thin contest look...and also gives one a real mood lift, a feeling of well being.

    Major Difference Between GH and Steroids:
    Steroids can increase the size of your muscle cells, but cannot I repeat CAN NOT increase the number of muscle cells in your body, which to start with is governed by your genetics. However Growth hormone CAN increase the number of muscle cells in your body, which goes beyond genetics.

    Half-Life of GH:
    Exogenous (injected) GH has a "half-life" of approximately 2 hours . . . a 4-hour period of activity during which there is a suppression of naturally produced GH.

    GH Naturally Produced:
    We release the most of our naturally produced GH during the first two hours of deep may take a little time to adjust.... your body thinks you should be in bed when that big influx hits. It is good to take a nap, that’s w
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    Jan 30, 2008 8:16 PM GMT
    GH Naturally Produced:
    We release the most of our naturally produced GH during the first two hours of deep may take a little time to adjust.... your body thinks you should be in bed when that big influx hits. It is good to take a nap, that’s when you grow anyway. It always helps to take naps after workouts and injections everyday.

    GH Causing Acromeglia:
    Acromeglia is a either have it or you don't. Supplementing GH will not cause it. Persons suffering from acromeglia, like Andre the Giant, lack the natural defense mechanisms of the body to regulate the production and effects of GH secretion in he pituitary. It is well established in the medical literature that exogenous GH will not cause the disease.... of course it would worsen the condition in those who had it.

    GH Gut: Myth or Reality?:

    Some researchers claim that any gains in weight experienced by subjects using GH alone was due to growth of internal organs and connective tissue, which could cause some problems. Most studies do not agree with this theory and consider "GH gut" to be a myth. Some people are allergic to synthetic test, this is something you have to find out for yourself. Some people also feel intestinal discomfort from time to time, if so take it down to one item at a time to see what is causing you discomfort; creatine, glutamine, protein products, orals, and dirty gear have all been known to cause this, so find the problem early.

    GH and IGF-1:
    Perhaps the most relevant effect of IGF-1 is the ability of IGF-1 to increase protein synthesis by increasing cellular mRNA formation (mRNA makes protein) as well as increasing uptake of amino acids. This effect on protein synthesis can lead to increased lean mass. The research indicates that this effect is dependent on GH presence as well. So IGF-1 alone does not promote such effects. Nor does GH. It appears the combination of the two most consistently lead to increased protein synthesis.
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    Jan 30, 2008 8:35 PM GMT


    GH injections, anabolic steroid injections, insulin injections, thyroid supplements...this is craziness. You'll make yourself into a pincushion and run the risk of serious complications. If you eat/sleep/breathe this hormone lifestyle like Chucky does then you MIGHT actually do it safely, but come on...most people have lives. Well, until they get ahold of all this stuff anyway...
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    Jan 30, 2008 9:08 PM GMT
    Folks used to say the world was flat.

    Before penicillin, folks lost limbs or died, with simple bacteria infections.

    Before insulin, diabetics fell over deader than a doornail.

    It's simply the application of science to improve our lives, prevent disease, feel better, and live longer.

    For several decades now, this was in the realm of bodybuilders, HIV patients, and the very rich. Now, with anti-aging, the general public is also able to take advantage of the many benefits offered by hormonal manipulation. No longer is this stuff in just the realm of the rich. No longer to folks have to feel like crap as they go into andropause.

    Instead of being fat, lethargic, suffering from diseases of aging, if these therapies are begun early enough (late 20s'), they can prevent loads of disease, and markedly improve the health of their users.

    Good science applied is always a great idea.

    In past centuries, doctors would "bleed" their patients to death. That's no longer the case. Science continues to advance. Thankfully. It enriches our lives and allows us to re-invent ourselves as a species.

    These therapies remain the protocol of choice for the the sickest of the sick because they have high benefits and have no to very low and managable, side effects even at very high doses.

    As the truth comes out and people are living longer, demand for these therapies will continue to skyrocket.
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    Jan 30, 2008 9:17 PM GMT
    Hey, I'm all about the advances of science to improve our lives, prevent disease, feel better, and live longer. But you cannot ignore the potential downside and risk with these injections either. Insulin injections can cause life-threatening hypoglycemia, just to name one.

    Odd that these injections are (generally) illegal too. Is this a coincidence, or could it be that there really is some danger here?

    Oh and since you mentioned science, it's also odd that the bulk of the scientific community considers them harmful at worst and suspect at best. (I know, I think it's all some conspiracy theory or something. Best not to go there.)

    Look: there MAY be some use to this stuff afterall, but it is not to be taken lightly, and guys outta know the potential risks involved as well as the possible benefit. Fair?
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    Jan 30, 2008 9:23 PM GMT
    It's illegal to do sodomy in many places, but, it happens. It makes no sense, but, it's the law.

    THINK, before typing.

    Can a bucket of tesosterone kill you? No. It's naturally produced by your body.

    Can a bucket of GH kill you? No.

    Can McDonald's kill you? Yes.

    Can aspirin cause you to bleed to death? Absolutely. Is it illegal? No.

    Is Tylenol deathly hepa-toxic, even more so than most C-17 oral AAS? Yes. Will half a bottle of Tylenol fuck you up bad? You bet. Is it illegal? No.

    The laws don't have a lot to do with danger. They have everything to do with where money is.

    THINK, next time, and you won't ask questions with obvious answers.

    I think the poster here is pushing IGF, honestly.

    Note that, above, JonathanJ's doctor advised him that now is the time to start.

    In all the fluff, you missed that.
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    Jan 30, 2008 9:36 PM GMT
    Well a knife might kill you too, if you decide to stab yourself with it instead of using it to cut your veggies. That's not the point. You are the master of the bait and switch, which is not a valid debate tactic.

    We are discussing human growth hormone and insulin-like growth factor, not tylenol or sexual practices. Or did you forget to take your Adderall today too? (j/k -- that was meant to be funny not mean.)

    In any case, I believe that we should weigh all the pros and cons of something before injecting it into our bodies every day for the rest of our lives. Is that stupid of me, as you suggest?

    I invite any guy on here to do websearches on these substances, and not just take your word for it that they're wonderful and that we should all go out and get some off the black market immediately.

    Can you honestly tell me that there are NO risks whatsoever to these injections?? You seemed to ignore my admonition regarding the severe hypoglycemia from insulin.
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    Jan 30, 2008 9:40 PM GMT
    Hmm question:

    Does this cause weight gains for those with faster metabolisms too? Or is this more of just a helper for the aging jock?
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    Jan 30, 2008 9:41 PM GMT
    I don't know much about steroids or HGH, but this IS what I know:
    Long-term drug use (unless its like over-the-counter or prescribed) will probably fuck you up.
    I've known people for whom this is true and the only way anyone really knows what’s up is if they do lots of research on whatever they are taking or they are a doctor. I don't believe experience quite counts because w/o knowledge experience means nothing.
    I also have an ex who used steroids and who thought he knew what he was doing, but since what he was taking wasn't regulated, how could he really know? He messed himself up too (go figure).
    So be careful and know about what yr putting in yr body peopleicon_exclaim.gif
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    Jan 30, 2008 10:20 PM GMT
    I've heard that HGH is usually prescribed to people in their 40's and older. Are there risks in taking it at a younger age?
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    Jan 30, 2008 10:26 PM GMT
    growth hormone side effects:
    - headaches
    - papilloedema (swelling of the optic disc -eyes-)
    - visual problems
    - nausea and vomiting
    - intracraneal hypertension (increased tension of the brain secondary to swelling)
    - fluid retention (bloated legs, etc)
    - arthralgia (pain in the joints)
    - carpal tunnel syndrom (pain and loss of movementes of hands
    - paraesthesia (numbness, strange prickly feeling of limbs)
    - antibody formations (may fuck up your body)
    - hypothyroidism (down-turning of thyroid function)
    - hyperglycaemia (raised blood sugar -risk diabetes and damage to small vessels, kidneys, eyes, etc)
    - leukaemia in children (blood cancer)
    - ?bone cancer

    plenty of reasons to stay away unless indicated by serious professionals for a MEDICAL reason ("GH prescription is on the up" ??? -market forces at work-)
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    Jan 30, 2008 10:32 PM GMT
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    Jan 30, 2008 10:33 PM GMT
    Just like if you eat to many burgers you'll get fat; take a bottle of aspirin you'll bleed to death, etc.

    Your point is only valid at very extreme dose levels and very few have the kind of money to do that, for beginners.

    Apsirin and Tylenol, along with fat foods, are way more dangerous than GH, any day of the week.

    You have to use some logic and common sense when making your comparisons.

    You skew the truth with your presentation.

    GH is being prescribed, along with androgens, because they are way safer than being overweight, smoking and so on, and can prevent a person from having to take other more dangerous meds like bp meds, cholesterol meds, and so on. Prevention is ALWAYS better than cure.

    I'm sorry you are so misinformed, and that's why I've worked to show you truth.

    If more people were undergoing these therapies, not only would their quality of life be improved, but, they would also have less disease, and not take as many dangerous non-natural drugs (GH and testosterone are both naturally occurring).

    Whether you chose to accept the truth of over 50 years of AAS use, and over 20 years of GH availability is another matter.
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    Jan 30, 2008 10:38 PM GMT
    Got to thank you guys for all your help. These were my first posts.
    To clarify, tho, I wasn't talking about using the stuff illicitly. As the doc explained it to me, he would follow blood levels so that my GH level would be that of a guy in his 20's--a natural level even though I am, umm, older than that.
    So, I know that there are side effects, but it just seems that taking some of those risks might be worth it if he was going to check my levels every few months or so. I'm not planning on super human strength.
    So, just to lead this off on a tangent, I'm guessing that the same people that are against gh supplements would be against testosterone supplements.
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    Jan 30, 2008 10:43 PM GMT
    The irony of this all is that:

    1. The folks so down on it haven't looked at all the facts.
    2. They generally aren't old enough to know about andropause / diseases of aging.
    3. They'd waste money on snake oil over the counter, instead of using something that works. That's called being stupid and a sucker.
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    Jan 30, 2008 10:51 PM GMT
    JonathanJ: I'm happy that you're under the care of a licensed physician who is monitoring your blood levels.

    I don't think the issue here should be pigeon-holing everyone into the "fors" or "againsts." It's clear that the supplements have some uses and merit, but it is also clear that there are some possible risks as well.

    Frankly I was alarmed at Chucky's suggestion to stack the HGH with both anabolic steroids, thyroid supplements AND insulin injections. Trust me, you could kill yourself with such a cocktail if you did not know precisely what you were doing. (He might, but does the average person reading these threads??)

    And just because a substance is produced by your body does not necessarily mean you should be injecting it into yourself. Again with the insulin example: it's produced by the pancreas in response to carbohydrate consumption, but excessive amounts can cause life-threatening low blood sugar.

    I suspect your doctor does not have you on that one! It comes from an old body-building gimmick of eating mega doses of carbs (like pasta) then giving yourself insulin to force the glucose into the muscles. Only safe if you're eating like an olympic marathon runner, and defintely not worth the risk.

    But back to HGH: some risks, and certainly some side-effects too. Worth it? You decide, but do your research first, and do it under the supervision of a health professional.
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    Jan 30, 2008 10:58 PM GMT
    Contrary to popular belief (a belief mostly held by Chucky), Chucky DOES NOT know everything about everything.

    The fact of the matter is that anytime you introduce new hormones into your bloodstream that your body has not asked for, your body is going to have to re-adjust in various ways. No need to go into specifics; it's the simple matter of bodily homeostasis that you are screwing with when you introduce things like growth hormone into your system. Hormones direct cell activity. They bring about reactions. Ultimately, there are a hundred other hormones in the body that act as a synergist or antagonist to that hormone, and so on and so on, until the body reaches some state of homeostasis.

    I'm sure it works for some, but I don't hear of too many medical professionals who recommend it to just anyone.
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    Jan 31, 2008 2:34 AM GMT
    What about all the claims that IGF-1 is cancer fuel?